QA session at Columbus 2018 Spring

[QA session at Columbus, Ohio, USA]

Video:

Transcript

This is an AI-generated transcript and may contain some errors.
Thank you very much.
Shri Prabhupada ki Jai. Samaa Om Vishnupadaya Krishna Vaishtaya Bhuntale Shrimate Bhaktivedanta Swamitinamine Namaste Saraswati Devi Gauravani Pracharine Nirvishesha Shunyavadi Ashyatideshya Tarine Vancha Kalpataru Bheshya Kripasindhu Jaya Vacha Patitanaam Pavanebhyo Vaishnavirbhyo Namo Namaha Jai Shri Krishna Chaitanya Prabhu Nityananda Shri Advaita Kadapara Shri Vasadhi Gaurav Bhakta Vrinda Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare Hare Krishna. Yes please.
Thank you. It’s a basic question. Everybody here asked about this kind of question.
The thing is lot of time we get inspiration to get up early in the morning, chant in the morning, do some proper sadhanas everyday. But even though we get the inspiration but the inspiration does not last for some time. Maybe for couple of weeks.
Again we still hear so many philosophies and everything. But the inspiration just doesn’t continue at all. It just stops at a certain point and then we feel like okay this is what we cannot do.
Our mind will impulse us. This is what the way we can live in our situation. What is the way to keep up the inspiration going on continuously? Like so many, Maharaj, so many people are there.
So we hear in classes we get inspired but the inspiration doesn’t last. There are two things here. Firstly, even if the inspiration doesn’t last, the purification that we get when we act with inspiration, that lasts.
So if I decide to do some sadhana enthusiastically for, maybe it lasts for one week, 10 days, 15 days, that is going to last. So in that sense, in spiritual life, we have to see success more as a direction than a destination. It’s like a relationship.
It’s never a destination. When we go back to the spiritual world, what are we going to do? We are going to serve Krishna. That’s going to go on.
So it’s more of a direction. And sometimes we move the direction faster, sometimes we may not move that fast. So if we think that, OK, coming to this standard is success.
No, that standard is the way we are expressing our intense devotion to Krishna. So even if we go in that, it’s like I’m moving in the direction of Krishna. And some days when I’m inspired, I pick up speed and move faster.
And sometimes when I’m not that inspired, I may move slowly. So first of all, the nature of the mind is that it will find reason to be discouraged even when we are encouraged. So that means we hear some class and we get inspired.
I can do it. But then the mind says, you know, you’re not going to continue it anyway. So why do it? It’s like that.
So we don’t have to fall for that trick of the mind that, OK, even if I want to continue for one week, one month, whatever it is, I’ll get purified in that time. And in general, when we become inspired also, it is better to make positive resolutions than negative resolutions. Because I will never do this.
It’s said that don’t make resolutions that a dead person can keep better than you. If I say, OK, I’m never going to over it. Well, a dead person is never going to over it.
So negative resolutions are not very positively inspiring. So if we focus, OK, OK, I tend to over it and I don’t want to do that. But I will fill my time and my day and my mind with something more positive.
And when I keep doing that. So then that will enable me to resist that. So if I. So in general, it’s best to make positive resolutions.
And then if I decide, OK, I’m going to chant some extra rounds or I’m going to recite some verses, I’m going to memorise something. So then even if we are not able to maintain that negative resolution, it doesn’t matter because the positive resolution is connected with Krishna to that extent. So we see success in that direction rather than destination.
And we focus on the positive resolution to go along in that direction. And secondly, it’s a Chetan Chaitanya says that hearing about Krishna is like food for the soul. It’s food for bhakti.
So we have to keep seeking food regularly. We never say that I ate food yesterday. I don’t have energy today.
So why should I eat today again? We eat again. So similarly, we we have what you could say a willpower and a willpower level. So that means we.
OK, this is a you could say, OK, I can fast on Ekadashi by taking. I can fast till noon. After that, I’ll take some fruits or I’ll take one.
That’s the level I can do. If I’m very inspired or it’s a special day, which comes once a year or a few times a year and I say I will fast till evening. So this is fasting till noon is my average willpower level.
Now I can go beyond that on a few occasions. Sometimes I fall below that also. So what will happen by the steady practise of bhakti is that it’s not specifically in terms of austerity.
But as we grow old, austerity may become more difficult also. But I’m just giving that as an example that the average willpower level will increase because we’ll connect with Krishna more and more. So it’s not so much that specific activities, we have to quantify the willpower in those terms.
But Bhakti Santra could give the example that once his disciple was very sick, not able to digest anything. So he told him to take ghee. When you take ghee, everything, all the ghee vomited out.
This came out of it. He said keep taking ghee. When if you throw it out, still some ghee will stay inside.
And that ghee will strengthen you. And eventually he got healed that way. That’s not the only way to heal digestive problems.
But that’s an example that somehow. So even if we feel we’re here and not much stays, but still while we’re here, for the short while after that, at least the purification remains, the conviction remains. And then we move on.
That time we move faster. So even if inspiration is not there, we continue on with our conviction, with our commitment. And we keep seeking inspiration when it comes.
But we don’t have to lose the, not intensify our practise just because the inspiration is not going to stay. Does that answer your question? I have an extension of the question. So always mind takes always the least resistance path, right? So whenever we have an association going on, a devotional association going on, and even in Bhagavad Gita Krishna has said that your dharma, you have to fulfil your dharma, right? So we have our family issues that everything has to be taken care of.
And this association goes into the priority number two. So how can we… See, sometimes if I have a family of professional responsibilities, because association goes to a lower priority, there is a purpose and there is a priority. Our purpose is to move towards Krishna.
But specifically at different times, different things may be more important. It’s just like, say, if you have to go to a temple from here, and the traffic is very heavy, we’ll go slowly. If the traffic clears, we’ll go fast.
Similarly, we want to move towards Krishna. And sometimes the traffic of our material activities becomes a lot. If somebody falls sick in the family, there is a deadline in the project, then at that time our spiritual activity will become a little slower.
But after they clear up, then we can intensify. Or sometimes you may decide that, oh, this is a time when we can go for a yatra, or there’s some devotee association specially available, and I can spend more time on this time. So that time we may accelerate further and we may put the material activities on the back burner a little bit.
But that adjustment is fine. So in general, balance, the first thing to, if you want to balance, the first thing to understand about balance is that we can never find any ideal balance. We live in a real world.
So balance itself has to be dynamic. So if I’m riding a cycle, I want to go in this direction, but I find that there’s a wall over it. Then I have to tilt myself and then move right and then again tilt myself left and then move on straight.
Similarly, sometimes in our life we have a direction to move towards, but sometimes we have to bend this way, sometimes bend that way. So it’s more of a dynamic balance rather than a static balance. As long as the purpose is clear in life, sometimes priorities may have to be adjusted That is perfectly OK.
So the key is, it’s not that after the traffic clears, still I keep going slowly. Then that means I’m not interested in going to the temple only. So we have to be honest that when the other things are not that important, we have to move towards Krishna.
And over a period of time by just living, we learn balance. OK, this is what, here I overdid this thing and later on I could have done this more, but I missed that opportunity. So we look back and we learn also.
Say if I could have turned this much, I could have gone only this much. I could have gone this way and I could have gone forward also. So Krishna also says Yuktaha Raviya.
So you have to be regulated in everything. So there is no need to worry if circumstantially certain things become more important than devotion. Now there is a subtle point over here also.
When I said the traffic has become tight, then we can’t move towards wherever we are going. In bhakti, even our worldly activities, even our family responsibilities, our professional responsibilities, they are also part of our devotion. So in that sense, they are, we could say they are indirect devotion.
This is direct devotion. But we need to separate the two so that we give some quality time for direct devotion. But in the actual living, we don’t have to constantly separate, you know, this is material, this is spiritual.
Ultimately, what defines a thing as material or spiritual is the attitude. If I am doing my worldly responsibilities also in a mood of service to Krishna, then that is spiritual. So we don’t have to constantly, oh, I am not giving, I take so much of my time is being taken by material things.
If we have to do it, just do it wholeheartedly. Otherwise, the mind is such a thing that we may think, actually, my lamentation is spiritual. I am doing this material responsibility, but I am so attached to Krishna.
I want to be so attached to Krishna. I think I’m not able to do bhakti. But the mind is so deceptive that when we are doing bhakti, the mind will say, hey, what are you doing? You have so many responsibilities.
Why are you not doing that? So, the mind, if we just listen to the mind, the mind will not let us do material things properly, not let us do spiritual things also properly. So, when you are doing material things, hey, come on, do spiritual. If you do spiritual, say, do material.
What do you want? I want to keep you miserable. So, when we are doing something, just do it wholeheartedly. And in experience, we can learn.
Maybe this should be done more, maybe this should be done less. So, if we see that integrated vision, that everything is a service to Krishna, some is direct, some is indirect, then we can move forward much more positive. The Leela Amrita is described that when Srila Prabhupada was in Prayag, at that time, he had a chemist.
He used to dispense medicines. And there was a doctor with whom he would sit. The doctor would prescribe and Prabhupada would give the medicine.
So, the doctor writes, it’s described in Leela Amrita, doctor says that it was clear that he was Abhay Babu at that time. He was not Bhaktivinand Swami or Prabhupada. He says, Abhay Babu was a very deeply religious man.
That is clear. But at that time, his main concern was, how can I earn more money? So, that was the situation. He had to do that.
So, if that was what was required, Prabhupada did it. Similarly, we try to do our best in the situation that we are in. And Krishna ultimately knows our situation.
Krishna understands. Krishna is not a judgemental God. You did not do this, you did not do that.
Krishna is an understanding God. If we try to, if we have a desire to serve Krishna and circumstantially we are not able to do it. Now, bhakti is very subtle.
Sometimes, I may go to the temple and in the temple, I am simply looking, who has not come? So much attached. This person, fallen. This person is on the way to fall down now.
Somebody else may not be able to come to the temple, but their heart is in the temple. And they, by their longing to be in the temple, they may make more spiritual advancement. So, in bhakti, the external actions are important, but the internal attitude is equally, if not more important.
So, if we have that desire, strong desire to serve Krishna, then even when it is circumstantially we are not able to do, we do the responsibility wholeheartedly, whatever is required. But at the same time, we keep that longing for Krishna, we will make advancement even through that. So, devotional service is something like something that we have to perform joyfully, right? So, that is what it actually says, right? And most of the time, like the places where I stay, then people wear like separate mala or they take deeksha and they say, okay, I am following this path.
So, what happens generally is, okay, from tomorrow I am going to start this deeksha. So, I will leave whatever I want today and I want to go to a movie and from tomorrow I will start it. Basically, what they are feeling is, okay, this is my base of enjoyment and now I am taking a deeksha.
So, I cannot do all these things. So, let me enjoy now and then I will take deeksha. So, now, how does this joyfulness of performing devotional service, how does that work? Okay.
So, devotional service has to be performed joyfully. But sometimes we think of enjoyable activity as something separate. And say before initiation we have a binge and we enjoy as much as we want and then now afterward I won’t be able to do this.
Yeah, there are two things over here. In Srimad Bhagavatam 1 to 22, it is said that Therefore, the wise people constantly They perform bhakti with great joy. And to that Vasudev, who is Bhagawan, So, if we reduce it down to the essence, what he is saying is, the wise joyfully perform the bhakti that brings joy.
So, is joy a component of devotion or is it a consequence of devotion? Put another way, you say, chant Hare Krishna and be happy, Sri Prabhupada said. Is this one instruction or two instructions? Is the chanting Hare Krishna will lead to happiness? Or chant Hare Krishna, that’s one instruction, be happy, that’s another instruction. So, actually it is both ways.
That means that suppose somebody has been sick for a long time, they tried various treatments, nothing worked. And then eventually they find a medicine that works. Now they are not yet healthy, but they are happy that I have found a medicine that works.
And as they keep taking that medicine, they will become happier. So, similarly, for us, chanting and practise of bhakti will sometimes bring happiness. Sometimes it will not bring happiness.
But we understand that this is going to purify me and that purified state will lead to lasting happiness. So, for that, I am grateful. In that sense, sometimes chant and be happy will be a causal statement.
I chant and I feel happy. Sometimes when that doesn’t happen, then I chant and I cultivate happiness as a disposition, because at least I am grateful I have the opportunity to practise bhakti. So, sometimes in the condition stage, when the modes of passion and ignorance become strong, at that time we are not able to perceive the joyfulness of bhakti.
So, that time it may appear that, okay, this is enjoyable and this is my enjoyment and this is my duty. So, okay, that’s why I feel, okay, I have to give up my enjoyment and do this duty. It may appear like that.
So, sometimes it appears as if, say, if there is some, you know, there is some carob halwa and there is some carrot and celery. So, we will feel, okay, material life is always enjoyment like carob halwa. And our bhakti is like carrot and celery.
So, that will be the perception as long as we are in the modes of passion and ignorance. So, that time we have to do bhakti as an austerity. Still I’ll take this.
But actually, as we start practising bhakti, as we start becoming purified, we start realising that bhakti is actually like the carob halwa. Because, yes, there is some pleasure in sense enjoyment. But that pleasure is so temporal, it’s so superficial.
But that we cannot realise as long as we are dominated by the modes of passion and ignorance. And actually you will see that we ourselves go through different modes at different times. So, sometimes in the mode of goodness, we feel bhakti is so nice.
I just want this to go on and on. I want to do this. Why do I do anything else? And then later going to the mode of passion and ignorance, we say, no, why am I doing this? So, we oscillate through the modes.
That’s why we, when we say take initiation, there is a commitment. No matter how I feel, I’ll continue doing this. But in general, by the practise of bhakti, as we come to the mode of goodness, we start appreciating purer pleasures more and more.
So, initially it will appear as if this lower taste is better and the higher taste is not so good. But if we become purified, then we’ll see actually the higher taste is better. So, till that time, there is some austerity.
So, we cannot at one level, we can say that joyfulness is a result of bhakti. It’s a consequence of bhakti. But we can also see joyfulness as a component of bhakti.
That means, if I use my intelligence to count my blessings, to remember all the things that are right in my life, then I can cultivate happiness. In the Bhagavad Gita, 17th chapter, Krishna says, satisfaction is an austerity of the mind. In 17.16, he says, manah prasada somnyatam maunam atma vinigraha, bhava samshuddhir iti etat, tapo manasam uchyate.
So, manah prasad is satisfaction. So, in general, we think of satisfaction as emotion. I feel satisfied, I don’t feel satisfied.
That’s true. But satisfaction is also a decision which we make. And how do we make that decision? So, if I look at the things which I have, I can cultivate satisfaction.
Or if I look at the things that are right in my life, I can cultivate satisfaction. If I look at the things which I don’t have or the things that are wrong in my life, then that will lead to dissatisfaction. So, in that sense, what will I focus my vision on? That is a decision I can make.
So, when the mind by default starts looking at all the things we don’t have, the intelligence needs to look at the things we have. When we do that, then even in our situation, we will feel satisfied. So, both materially we can be satisfied, spiritually also we can be satisfied.
In the sense that we are grateful that we have the opportunity for spiritual growth. So, by making that conscious decision to count our blessings, to look at the things that are right in our life, we can bring bhakti, bring satisfaction or joy as a component in our devotion. And then when joy is a component of our devotion, then the connection with Krishna becomes deeper.
Krishna says, When we do that, we perform with affection, Krishna gives us the intelligence of how to come closer to Him, how to see more and more of the blessings and how to become joyful. Thank you. Any other questions? So, Praveen, I have multiple questions for just one topic.
Just a minute. If any of the Mataji’s want to ask and if you want to write in chits and give, that’s also fine. I was in Perth.
So, we had a three-day only question-answer session. So, first day all Prabhus were asking questions. So, next day the Mataji’s said that they felt a little hesitant to ask publicly.
So, what we did was, we put a prashna patra. A bowl with questions. And then next day we had almost like hundred questions there.
Yeah. So, Prabhu, my question is on the topic of financial responsibilities for devotees. So, in Nectar of Consciousness, it is mentioned how low the income is to be distributed, 50%.
In this age and day, how practical it is and at what point a devotee should think that it is time to do that. Because other things also in Nectar of Consciousness, people try to practise that, you know, for three or four years, every day practically, it is possible. But this part, how to distribute your income, how to make it in such a way that it is directed towards people, that is first.
Secondly, due to the surroundings and other environment and other family responsibilities, our mind or at least someone’s mind is always going in that direction, no, I have to earn for that, I have to work for that, I have to earn. So is it even like a good thing because you have your responsibilities, which sometimes can only be fulfilled by providing that financial support to you. Thirdly, sometimes you are very lenient with yourself, like if I already have a phone and I am like, I know that I cannot afford a new phone, but I still want to buy a new phone, I still do it anyway.
Like that, there are so many other things that we spend money for ourselves and we don’t feel guilty, but when it comes to other person, like someone’s spouse or family or anything, we say, no, it is not a waste of money, let’s spend some money on that person. At that point we feel guilty, you know, that we are spending our money in the wrong way. So first question is that we always feel that we have a responsibility to provide financial security and that requires earning more and more.
But at the same time, we are also told that we should do charity and then giving, say, the recommended percentage of charity. Is that practical in this age? So there is a principle and there is a practise. I was talking with one devotee, he is one of the leaders of ISKCON in terms of financial management.
He was telling that, you know, Prabhupada has told 50%, but most devotees don’t even give 5%. So what happens is that, now what that 50% means, there are different devotees who have different ideas. Some devotees say it’s 50% of income.
Some devotees say it means 50% of what remains, what the difference between your income and your expense. From that you get 50%. But now I wouldn’t go into the specifics of that because we have to understand the principle.
The principle is that charity is not just action, it’s an attitude. It is not just activity, it’s a mentality. That means that whenever we earn something, if we understand that whatever I was able to earn, I was able to earn by Krishna’s mercy.
It is the ability to earn that is given by Krishna. The arrangement by which I can earn it, that is also given by Krishna. So therefore, I should give something.
So sometimes we feel, you know, oh, I want to give that 50%. But what devotees are telling me that, you know, every day I pray to Krishna, Krishna, I want to earn so much that I’ll be able to give not 50 but 51%. But he said that, I was talking to him, he said that he has been praying like this for the last 15 years and he has not given much.
So what happens is that even if we say succeed in earning a lot, the nature of the mind is that the more we earn, the more it gives. And unless we have cultivated a habit of giving, even when we have a lot, the mind will come, I need to arrange for this also, I need to arrange for this also. Generally, as we earn more, our, you could say, standard of living goes up and then the expenses also go up.
So in general, if we postpone charity to a future, when we will have greater financial security or greater earnings, then that will never happen. So it’s best, right now in whatever situation I am in, I’ll give some charity. And what percentage it should be, that is something which is something which we’ll have to individually decide based on our situation and our future planning or needs.
So basically what we can at least do is make it a habit to give some amount on a regular basis. Once we do that, that becomes a habit. And that habit will keep us moving.
And if, say, if we are in financial difficulty, we may give less. If we have a little more, we may give more. But it is, it is a part of our, you could say, it should become a part, ingrained part of our habit, of our mind that this is a habit which I have cultivated.
So now with respect to, say, financial security or, say, how much we, how much security we arrange, there are, it’s, I gave a series of classes in Denver on this topic of, you know, what is our quota. And we talk about, Ishopanishad says that we should all not enroach upon others’ side, we just take our quota. So one simple way to understand the quota is that, that it’s like food.
Now how much food does, who needs? Now some people may eat two chapatis, some people may eat six chapatis. Some people may eat this much rice, some people may eat that much rice. Now the test is not, somebody may be eating a lot, that doesn’t mean that they are attached to food.
Somebody may be eating less, that doesn’t mean that they are detached from food. It is what is the need. So how do I know in terms of food, what is my need? So basically, food should not become a competitor to Krishna.
What that means is, if I eat too little, if I say Ekadashi, I am going to fast nirjan, and I am going to chant 128 rounds, and I am sitting and chanting Hare Krishna, and my mind is chanting food, food, food, prasad, Hare Krishna, prasad, prasad, Hare Krishna, prasad, prasad. That sort of chanting is out of much use. So better take some food, come back and chant.
So if the food I am taking is too little, then the mind becomes so obsessed with food, that food becomes a competitor to Krishna. Similarly, if I eat too much, then either I feel sleepy after eating, or if I keep eating too much, then the craving becomes disproportionate. It becomes excessive.
Constantly, I want this, I want this, I want this. So if there is too little or too much, in both cases, the mind gets too entangled in it. But when we eat the right quantity, then we feel, we can never be materially fully satisfied, but at least that agitation because of too less or too much is not there.
So this balance of how much food we should eat, we all learn by experience. Sometimes we may do more, sometimes we may do less. The same we could apply to finances.
We all have a need for security. And even in the family, there may be different family members who may have different levels of need for security. Just like some people need to eat more, some people need to eat less.
So we have to find out a level of security where money doesn’t become a competitor to Krishna. If I am not having a job itself, I am in constant, if I don’t know how I am going to pay my next instalment or whatever, then at that time it’s an urgent situation where I have to look for a job. So I have to make some arrangements.
So if there is too much uncertainty about the money, then money just dominates our consciousness. And in that case, money becomes a competitor to Krishna. But suppose we get into the mood that I just want to earn more and more.
Then also the craving becomes unlimited. So if I decide that these many hours I am going to work, or these many hours I am going to give to Krishna, and apart from that in whatever hours I work, whatever I can earn, I will be okay with that. So it can be in terms of time, in terms of quantity of money that we earn, it can be in terms of the extent of the tension that we can take up in the workload.
Basically, a balance means that we are relatively mentally peaceful. In the material world, we can never be fully peaceful. But it’s like, if I have to lift weights, if my capacity is to lift 10 kg, and if I lift 2 kg, there will be no workout at all.
I will go out and come back, there will be no workout, if I go for a gym also. But if I lift 25 kg, then I will get crushed. So we all have to understand what is our capacity.
And if I am lifting 25 kg, my muscles will pain too much, I may get into an accident. But sometimes when our workload becomes too excessive, or when we become too obsessed about money, then we become extremely irritable about everything else. We become dismissive of everybody else.
So we can see it coming out in our attitude. So we have to, the key to finding a balance is that, that money stops being a competitive question. Money is needed in life, and we work to get it.
And with experience we learn how much quantity or how much time to spend, what kind of work to do. So with respect to judging others, we have to find out, everybody has, as I said, their own, we could say, we cannot objectively say what is the need of whom. Because how can I say, you should eat 2 chapatis.
Well, who are you to tell me that? I feel hungry after that. So each one of us has to decide. So of course you can say if somebody is taking 25 chapatis.
That is a bit too much, isn’t it? Because somebody can be Bhima, like Bhima, and they can do that also. But there are exceptions. But the point is that, what may be felt as a need for me, may be different from what may be felt as a need for someone else.
So some people, they get a sense of self-worth by spending, buying. If they buy new things, they feel, oh, you know, I’ve got something. I’ve got some money, I’ve got some new things, I’m showing it in my house.
Some people say, when they save the money, they get a sense of, you know, I’m planned, I’m organised, I’m prepared. So we have to, each one of us has to find out when we feel secure. When I feel secure, it’s not ultimately secure, because there is no ultimate security in the material world.
But relatively speaking, if you see the mind’s agitation, it’s like, if there is too less, it’s high up. If it’s too much, it goes high up. But if it’s in between, it comes down.
It’s at a relatively balanced level. So, relatively manageable level. It’s like, I can lift 10 kg and lift 10 kg or 11 kg or 12 kg.
I stretch my muscles, I improve a little bit. So we have to find out that zone for ourselves. And we have to give others the space to find that zone for them.
Sometimes, we all go through phases. Sometimes we may become too hard with ourselves. Sometimes I may decide, I will eat very less.
But then after a while, we finally can’t sustain it. Sometimes we may become too lax with ourselves. So then again, we may have to introspect or we may have to get some inputs from others.
And we balance. But it’s if we are practising sadhana bhakti reasonably well, then that brings us at least for some time of the day in the mode of goodness. If we chant, if we do worship the deities, if we study scripture, if we hear classes, at least for some time we come to the mode of goodness.
And that is the time when we can evaluate. In the mode of passion and mode of ignorance, it is very very difficult to evaluate properly. In the mode of passion, we will feel that I just want to earn more and more and more.
In the mode of ignorance, we will be irresponsible and we will say I am detached. But there is a big difference between irresponsibility and detachment. Irresponsibility is like a student has an exam.
Student doesn’t prepare for the exam. Mother says, why don’t you study? I am detached. That is our detachment.
Generally the key difference between irresponsibility and detachment is that irresponsibility is before doing the work. Detachment is after doing the work. So I do my work and then I don’t stay emotionally entangled in that.
If I don’t do my work only, then that is irresponsibility. So generally if we are in the mode of ignorance, we will just be lazy and think I am being detached. So throughout the day, sometime we are in the mode of goodness.
So sometimes if there is a specific issue we want to think about, then maybe on a weekend or sometime when we have some time, we pray, we read, we bring ourselves to the mode of goodness and then calmly reflect. And based on that reflection, we arrive at a general plan for our life. The sort of decision of how much to earn, how much to save, how much to give in charity.
These we can’t do on the heat of the moment. Because that will be an impulsive decision and we will not think about it so well. So we have some time in the mode of goodness when we reflect.
And then we get a general direction for our life. This is what, this much time this, this much time this, this much charity, this much saving, this much expenditure. We plan and then sometimes we make a little adjustment as life comes along.
But at least the broad path is clear. But if that broad path we try to discern when we are in the mode of passion and ignorance, then we will err on either the wrong side of, we will err on some wrong side. We will err on that wrong side.
So over a period of time, Prabhupada writes in the Act of Instruction and Introduction that when we come to the mode of goodness, how to advance further will be revealed from within. So that revealed from within doesn’t mean that we reject external guidance. But that we, whatever we have heard in classes, heard in scripture, we understand by the guidance from within how I can apply it in my life.
Which part I can apply now, which part is not so practical for me now. So that all that understanding, clarity we get when we come to the mode of goodness by practising bhakti. Did I answer your question? Thank you.
Yes. How do you get yourself motivated to chant more and read more? How do you get motivated to chant more and read more? Generally three things. That is, our desires, where do they come from? They come from attraction, they come from conviction, they come from association.
Three things, broadly speaking. Why do I do something? Because I like to do it. Or why do I do something? Because I know it is important for me.
Why do I do something? Because all my friends are doing it, so I do it. Say like if you see in your life, you may play some sports, you may play cricket. Because say you like cricket.
But then you go to school and you see that everybody else is playing say football. Then you want to be a part of them, so you play that sports. That’s because of association.
Or you may decide you want to go to gym and do some workout. You may not enjoy that, but I need to be healthy. So we do that because of conviction.
So broadly speaking, our actions are shaped by these three things. Our attraction, our conviction and our association. So whatever we want to do, devotional activity, if it is chanting or it is reading more and more, we have to see which of these three forces are lacking and how can we increase those.
So with respect to attraction, sometimes we feel attracted towards chanting, sometimes we don’t feel attracted. Our mind is so fickle. Some days we feel like chanting is so nice.
Sometimes we feel, we start chanting and we feel, oh, I feel so much strength, this is so good, I want to chant more and more. Sometimes we feel chanting should never end. And the next day we feel chanting never ends.
It just needs to go on and on and on. So attraction is not a steady platform for us for us to do anything. Our mind is very fickle.
So Jiyu Goswami says that in the sadhaka stage, priti will not keep us in bhakti. When we are purified, when we are realised, priti will keep us in bhakti, affection, attraction. But in the sadhaka stage, it is buddhi that keeps us in bhakti.
The buddhi is intelligence. So that’s why if we want to do any activity, we have to nourish our intelligence about its importance. Suppose we hear some class about why it is important to read this, to read or why it is important to chant, then maybe note something down and keep it with us.
And when we don’t feel like doing it, we read it. That gives the conviction. Now, in general, doing something based on attraction is joyful.
Doing something based on conviction is not so joyful. Like, I know this is important but I don’t feel like doing it. So what can make it joyful is association.
In general, our desires, we think of them as linear. Say, I see a gulab jamun and I want to eat it. So I see the object and I get the desire.
But our desires are not just linear. They are also triangular. Triangular means that, say, I have gone to Australia for the first time and we are at a devotee’s house and they said, we have made baklava.
Would you like a baklava? Now, I had never heard of a baklava. And the name is not a very pleasant, baklava. So I said, okay.
I didn’t say anything. Then there was a devotee with me. And then he got the baklava and he just took it and he ate it.
And he said, bless. And seeing him, I said, give me one also. So what happened is, just hearing or seeing the baklava did not give the desire.
But seeing someone else enjoying it, that gave the desire. So that is triangular desire. So, just seeing the object doesn’t give the desire.
But seeing someone else enjoying that object gives us the desire. So, this is especially true, this triangularity of desires is especially important in spiritual life because many of the activities in spiritual life may not initially seem so enjoyable. So, maybe kirtans may seem enjoyable, but other activities may not seem that enjoyable.
So, if we have some friends who are doing it, then seeing them, so if we decide, we have a friend, we decide to memorise one verse per week. And then every Sunday we will discuss the verse. And then on Sunday you go, he is going to ask you what is the verse and you are going to ask him which is the verse you memorised.
Then just looking forward to it, oh, you will ask me. That will give us the inspiration to memorise. And you will ask him, what have you memorised? He will ask, what have you memorised? So that way, when we see others doing something, that is what gives us inspiration.
So, broadly speaking, we have to see which of these we need to increase. So, attraction, conviction, association. And if you can increase either of these also, sometimes there will be no association and there will be no attraction.
But if there is conviction, keep doing it. Seeing us, others may start doing it. And then we will be the association for them.
And then after that, they will also become the association for us. So, that way we can increase our inclination to do devotional activities. Any other questions? Yes.
My question is, how do we balance success and failure from an emotional perspective? And also, how do I balance between staying passionate towards my goal or whatever it is I want to achieve and also staying detached from it? So, how can we be passionate about a goal and still be detached? See, the word passion is one of the words which in material life and spiritual life has opposite connotations. In spiritual life, we say, don’t be in the mode of passion. Don’t be in passion.
It’s bad. But in material life, they say, you should have a passion. You know, you have to find out what your passion and pursue that passion.
So, the way I reconcile it is, we can have a passion, but we shouldn’t be in passion. We can have a passion. That means we have some inspiration, some driving force.
This is what I would like to work on. This is what I want to do. We can have a passion.
But we don’t want to be in the mode of passion. So, the word passion, in material life, it means something which we are very driven about, which we feel strongly about, which we just want to do strongly. And in the spiritual circle, passion means the mode of rajoguna, where we act impulsively.
Yeah, I understand what you are saying. So, you are saying it more in the sense of having a driving force. But, so, now, with respect to the practise of bhakti, earlier I said that if we see success more as a direction than as a destination.
So, for example, say, I want to become a doctor, I want to become an engineer, I want to become a writer. Now, if one thing is okay, I want to get a particular degree or I want to get a particular job. That’s you could say that is becoming a particular thing in a career.
But that is just one landmark along the way. So, it’s a direction into a person. And if we focus in every situation, sometimes we define success in terms of the results that we get.
Say, if I get this many marks, that’s I am successful. If I get this job, I am successful. If I get into this college, I am successful.
We live in a competitive world. And those external markers of success do matter. But we cannot wed ourselves only to them.
Because sometimes they may come and sometimes they may not come. So, we need to, okay, this is what I feel inspired to do. And this is the value that I want to live according to.
Let’s say, I will do my best in this field. So, if we define success more in terms of not expectation of what we will get, but the contribution that we will make. Then, if we decide, let’s say, I want to be a good student and I want to study diligently and I want to contribute that way.
If I make that as my goal, success will come. And even if success sometimes doesn’t come, but still I am moving in that direction, sooner or later that will come. So, if we define success too much in terms of expectation of what I will get, then if I get it, I will be elated.
But what after that? Okay, then I have to set another goal. Then I start pursuing another goal. So, and if I don’t get it, I feel devastated.
So, the balance between success and failure, not getting too buffeted by either, that can be achieved when we redefine success as living in harmony with our values. Krishna has given me some abilities, Krishna has given me some interests and I want to use them fully. So, I work hard to develop those, to do justice to those talents, to develop those interests.
And whatever I am able to achieve, that is my contribution through that. If some results come, that’s wonderful. If we focus too much on success in terms of achieving certain goals, then we get alienated from our values.
And then even if we achieve success, that success doesn’t bring any fulfilment. Because you say, recently if you see, there was this ball tampering scandal that happened in cricket. An Australian cricket team was accused of that.
And several of the captain, vice-captain were disgraced. So, what happened? They tried success at all costs. So, for that somehow or the other we have to win this match.
Now, they were caught over there and they realised the cost was too much for them. So, what happens if you obsess too much with success, then we lose perspective. If a team performs properly, sooner or later they will be successful.
But instead of improving the performance, if they somehow try to hook or crook get success, that has counterproductive results. So, Arjuna, he was quite clear. He wanted to be a great archer.
And he practised very hard for that. He didn’t neglect his archery practise. Continuously he was doing that.
But then he did not let that become an obsession where he neglected everything else. He practised dharma. He had time for doing dharmic activities.
When he had to practise archery, he was completely diligent about it. But that doesn’t mean that he neglected other things. So, if we see that we are parts of Krishna and we have to connect with Krishna.
So, there are many channels through which we connect with Krishna. So, our bhakti, our chanting the holy names, doing bhakti activities, that is a very important channel through which we connect with Krishna. But our career and the contribution that we make using the gift that Krishna has given us, that is also a connect channel by which we connect with Krishna.
So, if we see, when I said success is more of a direction, further direction is that I want to do this in a mood of emotional offering to Krishna. So, if I see that this is meant to connect with Krishna, then I won’t get so obsessed with it that in doing it I get disconnected from Krishna. So, seeing that our gifts are given to us by Krishna and we are meant to use it in his service.
If we see that vision, then we can have that passion, but we won’t get obsessed with it. Because we will see that when Krishna wills, the results will come. But if I keep persevering, Krishna is observing that, Krishna will appreciate that and eventually the reward will come.
So, it said that what we are is God’s gift to us. What we become is our gift to God. So, we see even our career and our pursuits in our day to day life also as a devotional pursuit.
By seeing the connectedness of it with Krishna. Okay? Okay. Thanks.
Yes. Just trying to present my question in a good way. So, we talked about decisions, talked about financial management and we also talked about the principle of charity.
And then recently we are a little over 50 years of ISKCON and then we have more temples than the day when ISKCON was started. Or even after Gopal left the world. So, the question is sometimes when we take decisions, like I mean we are asking a lot of congregations in different parts of the world.
We are aspiring to build bigger temples. But at the same time, the fact is, if you look at the number of, there is a thousand people in the congregation in the particular city. There is only like 1% of the people who are actually managing or giving charity to the temple and running the whole temple from maintenance to everything else included.
And the rest are like 99%. In the congregation or in the city? In the city. I mean there are like thousand congregation people and there is 1% who are actually managing.
But there could be more number of people too. There is higher potential to get them closer to Krishna consciousness. So, our question is like we talked about decisions.
So, sometimes we aspire to build bigger temples. But at the same time not realising the fact that there is lot of maintenance and lot of sustainability would be a concern in a longer run. But at the same time, those kind of decisions, if as an individual, if you have to take it in your own house.
Let’s say if you are making 100K and then you would not prefer to be in a million dollar home, right? So, you don’t take those decisions at your personal level. But then at a bigger level, like aspiring to build bigger temples for Krishna. So, sometimes you end up taking those decisions and taking the risk.
But not realising the sustenance and the maintenance and how making it for a longer run for future generations. So, how do we sync up all that and what would you suggest since you are building a new temple? So that it will help us in making the right decisions. Suppose if you are building a big temple, but then it involves taking a huge amount of risk.
Because there are not many people who are going to contribute or even maintain the temple regularly. And we may not even take that kind of risk for building a home for ourselves. So, how can we make such activity sustainable? Let’s say that there are different ways of doing devotional service to Krishna.
And different devotees are inspired differently. So, bhakti is so inclusive that it accommodates different people with different inclinations. So, we could say that as you said that a small number of people are going to actually run the temple.
That is how it always is. It’s like a pyramid where there are some people who are extremely dedicated. There are some people who are somewhat dedicated.
Occasionally they will take up some commitment. Some people they say, if you go to meet somebody, I regularly come to the temple. How regularly? Once a year on Janmashtami.
That is the regularity. So, what happens is people will be at different levels of commitment and dedication. And certainly we need a certain number of dedicated people, no doubt.
But at the same time, Srila Prabhupada also had that principle that if you want to shoot, go and shoot a rhino. It’s so difficult, people say if you don’t do it, it’s not possible only. If you do it, people will be amazed.
So, now, in general, the construction of the temple, if it is emerging from the presence of a well-developed congregation, the temple can serve many different purposes. One purpose, traditionally when Indians build temple, it is more of a, it’s a pious instinct. Okay, I have wealth and I want to use it for some good purpose and I build a big temple for the Lord.
So, there will be some people, even the devotee community, who have that instinct. I want to build a temple for the Lord. So, that is an instinct some people have.
But Srila Prabhupada, the way he presented is the temple is meant to help us, it is meant to become like the centre for outreach. So, we want the temple primarily as a facility for doing vibrant outreach. Now, if we have a good congregation in a place and we have good preaching programmes going on by which that congregation will be maintained and will expand, then having a big temple can serve as a big fillip, big boost for the preaching.
How does that happen? Because generally when we are doing preaching, one of the biggest challenges is to invite people. How are people going to come to promote the programme? So, generally people who are in the material world, they are attracted by materially impressive things. So, there is a big temple, they will come to see what is the big temple.
If it is a small temple, okay, they will go, they will not go. So, the challenge comes if we build a big temple, but in building that temple and maintaining that temple, so much of the energy goes that because of that preaching stops. So, the energy that was done for getting people to Krishna, that energy gets diverted to building a temple.
And then people are coming to the temple, but there is nobody to preach to them. Because everybody is caught in fundraising, everybody is caught in maintenance. So, that’s why in general, the mood which we have is first have a congregation, stable congregation, then build a temple and then the temple will expand the congregation.
So, if without a congregation we try to build a temple, after that we will attract a congregation. Yes, we will attract a big congregation, but there will be nobody to actually connect the people who are coming to temple to become devotees. So, then that’s when the temple becomes more like a centre for religious tourism, not a centre for spiritual transformation.
There are many temples which are on the tourist locations of a particular place, and a lot of people come there, but then it doesn’t lead to spiritual transformation. So, if we have a structure for preaching going on and we are able to continue that study, then a temple can actually work to attract a lot of people also. And we have to, there is both, there is the element of using our intelligence in Krishna’s service.
So, sometimes we say that do we surrender with our intelligence to Krishna or do we surrender our intelligence to Krishna? Isn’t it? That means do I use my intelligence to surrender to Krishna or I just surrender Krishna, Krishna I don’t know how this is going to work out, this is what you want, I will do it. So, there are both. Prabhupada, when he went to America, he had no idea what kind of people he would meet, what would happen.
So, he surrendered with intelligence in the sense that he took a stock of vegetarian food with him, he took some of his books with him, he made sure that 62, 63, 64, 3 years, he wrote his books, so that he would have something to authenticate him. So many people can go, but these big volumes he has written, that made him, that gave some weight to his being a spiritual teacher. And so, he surrendered with intelligence.
But actually when he went to America, it was extremely, you could say, either you could call it a courageous act or you could call it a rash act. An old person going all alone to America. So, it is said in Krishna consciousness, sometimes people ask, do you believe in miracles? He says, we don’t believe in miracles, we depend on miracles.
So, Prabhupada, actually, it is almost like when he went to Jal Doota, he was demanding Krishna, perform some miracle. Otherwise, how will things happen? So, there are both aspects in bhakti. We use our intelligence as far as it goes, but sometimes we have to surrender our intelligence also.
Krishna, you have a plan, you will work it out. And if we build a big temple, then that also attracts people. Say, there are many people who have, not many in the sense of huge number, but there are significant number of people who want to do something significant in their lives.
They want, they have a zeal, they want to contribute. But often such people, they say, okay, I want to be a part of some organisation. You say, which organisation is big? Which organisation is influential? That’s where they go and explore.
And if they feel okay, they will get connected with that. But if, say, even if we have a temple which makes us a part of the religious tourism map or the spiritual tourism map, then people who have an activist zeal, they come there because of that. And then they get connected.
So, at one level, we use our intelligence in wanting to do big things for Krishna. But at another level, we also understand that Krishna, Krishna’s intelligence is bigger than ours. And we surrender to Him also.
So, if, again I said that it’s more of a stretch, you know, you talk about comfort zone, stretch zone and panic zone. So, it’s like if I can lift 10 kg, I lift 11-12 kg, that’s good. But if I start lifting 50 kg, it’s a problem.
So, similarly, we may have a big plan for a temple, but that should not become so much of a pressure that it disrupts our normal devotional activities or our normal life. Certainly, we have to stretch ourselves. But it shouldn’t become an overbearing tension.
So, if you find that it is becoming an overbearing tension, then we may decide that, okay, this was our deadline. But in bhakti, you know, sometimes we have to make the deadline into a live line. Okay, not this.
You can do it little later. Little later. That’s okay.
So, the desire to do something wonderful for Krishna is a wonderful desire. At the same time, we have to temper it with, there is, in bhakti, there is transcendental faith and there is sattva guni intelligence. So, both are required.
That sattva guni intelligence means if my intelligence is analysed, what is realistically possible, what is not realistically possible. But then there is transcendental faith also, which goes beyond the sattva guni intelligence. So, we just do our best and we can make a big plan for Krishna.
And if it doesn’t materialise immediately, then we don’t become compulsively attached to it. Srishti Prabhupada had big plans for Krishna. At the same time, he was also flexible.
He tried so many things. He tried League of Devotees, it didn’t work. He tried Back to Godhead, it didn’t work.
He worked with his Godbrothers, it didn’t work. He went to, he just focused on writing his books and distributing his books on the street, both in the libraries. That worked to some extent, but not much in terms of getting it.
So, he was flexible in trying different things. So, we see that the purpose is to glorify Krishna by building a big temple and we focus on sometimes having a tangible, substantial goal. That is what drives people to do something.
Otherwise, we have some rajo guna within us. And for most of us, if we didn’t have some tangible things to do, bhakti would be too sattvic. If you tell somebody, study shastra, okay, yeah, I’ll study.
You have bhakti shastri exam now, study shastra. Okay, okay, I’ll study now. So, what happens is, even when we want to do transcendental activities, unless there are some tangible goals, it’s very difficult for us to do that.
So, in that sense, although sometimes it may appear like we are in the mode of passion, but if we are pursuing a transcendental goal, then we are channelling the energy of passion which is already there within us in Krishna’s service. And if we don’t do that, then we will end up doing something else with that passion. So, we can see these sort of challenges, challenging services in bhakti as avenues for channelling our passion which would otherwise drag us in different directions.
Does that answer your question? Yes, sir. It’s a combination of Krishna from previous class and his previous class. So, I think it’s related.
So, he said, the flight and fight, the third is more of goodness side. So, when you have Krishna within, so, because lack of Krishna within, that is a problem. But, I mean, constant newness is also Krishna.
I think you said today, the state of heart. So, I want to know these two questions. Now, what is the newness? Because channelling, reading, hearing, association is there, but the same activity finding newness, and that’s one.
And the second thing is that, it’s the fight and flight, the development of goodness, and the content is Krishna within. What does it mean, thinking Krishna? I am seeing Krishna is Krishna within me. Or when ambiguity comes, acting in such a way that, so, how does that, I don’t know how to put these two points.
What is the first part? First part is newness. And the second thing is that… So, when we say that Krishna bhakti, there is constant newness. And then we also say that by having Krishna in our hearts, we can go beyond the fight or flight responses.
What does it mean? With respect to remembering Krishna constantly, one of the most realistic ways in which we can be conscious of Krishna is being conscious of our purpose in Krishna’s service. In the lecture, Vishal Prabhupada says, how do we know whether we are Krishna conscious? He says, if you go to the temple and look at the deities, if you feel Krishna is asking you, what are you doing for me? Then you are Krishna conscious. It’s a beautiful definition.
What are you doing for me? Most people go to temple and ask, what are you doing for me? So, that is the Karmakandir kind of approaching God, which is also a catalyst for approaching God. But then there is the, there could be a sahajyik way of approaching God, you know. I think, oh, always chanting Krishna’s name, Radhe Radhe, Shyam Shyam, chanting Radha Radhe Krishna’s name, that is also good.
But at our level, it can be sentimental. So, we, our relationship with Krishna is primarily a relationship of service. Once a person came to Prabhupada and he says, Swamiji, Krishna came in my dream yesterday.
So, Prabhupada nonchalantly looked at him and said, alright, serve him today. Serve him today. OK, even if Krishna comes in the dream, that’s fine, if he comes also.
But what is our effect? Our relationship with Krishna is primarily based on our service to him. So, the most tangible way we can be conscious of Krishna is conscious of our purpose in his service. So, in the Bhakti Sambha Sindhu, it talks about naam dhyan, rupa dhyan, leela dhyan and seva dhyan.
So, meditating on the name, meditating on the pastimes, meditating on the form and meditating on the service. So, for us, as a sadhana, we do naam dhyan, rupa dhyan, leela dhyan also. We hear about, we meditate on the deities, we chant the holy names.
But actually the most realistic for us to do is the seva dhyan. So, we become conscious of Krishna by being conscious of our purpose. What is my purpose in Krishna’s service? Having said that, if we keep the purpose in the centre of our consciousness, then slowly everything falls in place.
Purpose provides perspective. Purpose provides perspective. What do you mean by that? Suppose, you say, we are going to some important meeting.
And along the way, we meet someone. And they want to talk with us. Now, as a courtesy, we talk for a few minutes.
If the meeting is very important, we will say, okay, we will talk later. I have a purpose that helps me to decide how much time to give to this, something really important. Let’s fix up a time, we will meet tomorrow and talk.
But if I don’t have any purpose, then I might just go and I might chit-chat for several hours also. So, if I have a purpose, then that helps me to see this is more important, this is less important. So, in fight or flight responses, basically, our purpose doesn’t stay in the focus of our consciousness.
Simply our security or our position, that is what stays in the centre of my consciousness. So, you know, if this person is threatening me like this, how dare I will show you. Then our focus becomes on retaliating against that person.
Or it can be that this person is so powerfully threatening me to get out of here. So, if my focus is, okay, I am here to serve Krishna and this person is acting in this way. How best can I serve Krishna in this situation? Sometimes I may choose the same response, I may fight or I may just go out of the situation, that’s also okay.
But I will do it with the understanding of how best I can serve Krishna. So, this purpose, how does it come? To some extent it comes by sadhana bhakti because the desire to serve Krishna is what is strengthened by the practise of sadhana bhakti. One time one devotee, yesterday, he said, I am afraid to chant Hare Krishna.
I said, why? He said, chanting Hare Krishna means praying to Krishna, please engage me in your service. I already have too much service. So, actually, chanting Hare Krishna is, please engage me in your service.
What it means is, please give me more desire to serve. Nobody expects us to have more than 24 hours in a day. Nobody expects us to be at more than one place at the same time.
That’s understandable. But what we are asking for when we say, please engage me in your service means, please give me the desire to serve. So, our sadhana bhakti is what strengthens our purpose in Krishna’s service.
Similarly, associating with like-minded devotees also strengthens our sense of purpose. And especially our desire to serve and please senior Vaishnavas, that is a driving, that can give us a driving sense of purpose also. Yashya prasada, bhagavad prasada.
So, sometime that purpose may come through a specific instruction. Like say, Hanuman was told to go and find Sita. He got a specific purpose.
Prabhupada was told to go and search in the western world. But if you see, Arjuna was never told, never on a particular point Arjuna was given a specific purpose. He was told that.
He just observed himself when he was in Drona’s gurukul. He found that he was good at archery and he developed that. So, if we have that intention to serve Krishna, then the specific purpose, how we can serve him, that will also be revealed gradually.
And if we keep that purpose clear, then that purpose is what will bring newness at our level. Because satsvarupa maharaja, that Lila Murthy writes that preaching is adventure in the service of the Lord. Because, yes, many activities in bhakti, I go to, I chant every day, I do deity worship.
They are at a spiritual level, when we connect with Krishna, because Krishna is unlimitedly attractive, we will start wishing the attractiveness of Krishna. But at our level, sometimes it appears monotonous. And we can’t just wish away that feeling of monotony.
It is there, I think. So, sometimes we say that we give a class and everybody seems to be asleep and tired or bored, not interested in the class. I was at a class and there was one devotee who was giving a class.
And he was, with all due respect, giving a very boring class. And then when he was doing that, everybody was falling asleep. He says, all of you should have a taste for Krishna katha.
So, now, I was thinking in my mind, yes, I don’t have that taste. But at one level, if we all have a service attitude, then that means the hearers should think that, you know, I should try to hear attentively. But the speaker should also think that I should speak in a way that helps the audience to become absorbed.
The speaker should not just demand you should have taste. Rather, speaker should speak in a way that gives audience the taste. So, that’s what Prabhupada writes, realisation means to speak in a way that is interesting to the audience.
So, I understand where the audience are at, what is their level of consciousness, what are their needs. What are their interests, what are their concerns. And then I speak accordingly.
So, at our level, because we cannot spiritually connect with Krishna directly, Chaitanya Mahaprabhu said that, could hear hundred times the past tense of Dhruva, past tense of Prahlad. We are spiritually connecting with Krishna directly. But because we can’t spiritually connect with Krishna at our level of consciousness, sometimes it may happen, but not regularly.
That’s why in our activities, we have to have a sense of purpose. And if I am doing some purposeful devotional activity, then that purpose gives me some excitement. Some sense of excitement, some sense of achievement.
Okay, I want to do this programme. We want to get this many people for this programme. We want to distribute this many books.
We want to build this temple. These alone are not devotion. It is our internal attitude that is devotional.
But these help us to have the connection by which that internal attitude will gradually develop. So, sometimes, going back to your question earlier, sometimes, you know, trying to do something wonderful in Krishna’s service, that is what actually helps us to see the hand of Krishna. Sometimes we just chant the holy names again and again and again.
But I may not feel any connection with Krishna. But sometimes I try to do something very difficult in Krishna’s service. And then, when we find that it’s not going to work at all, we try our best and realise it’s not going to work, and then we just surrender to Krishna.
And then Krishna suddenly makes it work. So, then we start saying, actually, it’s Krishna acting. It’s Krishna acting.
So, sometimes, for us, that’s taking up challenging service in Krishna’s service, that gives us a sense of newness. Both newness in terms of we have some stimulating engagement and then we also see Krishna’s reciprocation in our life. So, that way, we don’t necessarily have to think that the same forms of devotional service cannot give newness.
They can give. But if they are not giving us something new right now, then we have to create stimulation for ourselves. So, Srila Prabhupada talked about chanting constantly.
He said that. But Prabhupada also created challenging engagements for devotees. He said, go and distribute books.
Prabhupada was amazing in giving challenges to people. When he came back in 1968 to America, after he was sick for some time, he had gone to India. So, they had a globe over there.
And Prabhupada told his disciples, all of you, take one country. Go there, preach Krishna consciousness and deliver the country. Now, most of his disciples were 20, 22, 25 years old.
One Janaki Mataji was 19 years old. She said, Prabhupada, what about us girls? He said, we are not boys or girls. We are souls.
You also pick up one country. So, Prabhupada actually gave very stimulating, challenging activities for people to do by which they could channel their passion. So, they could get that sense of adventure, newness.
So, we will find the newness primarily in our service to Krishna. But if we are an association of very advanced devotees, whenever we get it, sometimes we go to Yatra and there are some very advanced Vaishnavas who speak Krishna Katha. If you will be saying Krishna Katha, that time you will find there is so much taste over there, so much relish over there.
So, generally that spiritual newness is relished when we are at the spiritual level of consciousness or when we are associating with someone who is at the spiritual level of consciousness. So, just like sometimes some advanced devotees do kirtan, they may sing a simple tune. You can absorb it so deeply.
Otherwise, if you want to be absorbed in kirtans, then if some devotee comes in very good at music, nice instruments and then, we will like the kirtan. Because there, although it is a holy name, it is more of material newness. Some new tune is there, some new instrument is there, some new singer is there.
So, our operational principle is, ye na ke na prakaare na mana krishni yashit. To fix the mind on Krishna, somehow or the other. So, if we can experience spiritual newness by our own spiritual advancement or by association of spiritually advanced devotees, that’s wonderful.
If we can’t, then through having challenging services in Krishna’s service, we create newness. That’s how we realise Krishna acting in our lives, Krishna empowering us in our lives. So, both in terms of our endeavour and in terms of Krishna’s reciprocation.
Both we experience some newness, some challenge, some stimulation over there. Our mind keeps judging others what to do about it. Generally, the mind is, it has its own habits.
And we can’t suddenly get rid of that habit. We can’t just undo it. So, the best thing to do is to have something else to do.
That means, if I am interacting with someone, then this person is very forgetful, this person is very irresponsible, this person like this, this person like that. My mind is saying like that. So, many times, when we are in some situation, we are not in tune with the situation.
We are in tune with our mind’s commentary on the situation. And that’s why, we are not dealing with that person, we are dealing with what our mind is telling us about that person. Then, we can’t effectively have that interaction.
So, if we just, okay, the mind is judging like this. If we try to argue with the mind, the mind is so expert. It will, even if it doesn’t defeat us, it will defeat our purpose.
Because why? Even if we win the argument, no, no, it’s not like this. But we have got distracted over there. So, in some situations, we may have to reason with the mind also.
But in general, the best thing to do with it is just focus on something else. So, okay, I am here for discussing about this service, let’s do it. So, if I focus on that, then, okay, the mind is saying like this.
It is saying, but I don’t focus on it. Tomorrow in OSC, I am going to speak about this elaborately. If we, the topic I am talking, net surfing or net suffering.
So, basically, if we consider, our mind is like a monitor. In which, say, we want to, I am talking with this person, right now. So, that is what should be the focus of my mind.
But our mind is like a computer monitor on which many tabs are open. So, what happens is, so while we are talking with that person, the mind opens up a tab. This person is lazy, this person is forgetful, this person is manipulative, this person is like this.
And then, now when that tab opens, it is right there. Now, sometimes some tabs open in such a way, some advertisements are there, you can’t find the cross, where is it? Remove it. So, like that, if you try to cross, you know, it is quite difficult to find it.
But, if we just, ok, that tab has opened, push it a little bit aside and focus on what we are doing right now. As Prabhupada says that one of the best ways to deal with the mind is neglect. Neglect means that we don’t get into a discussion with the mind at that time.
Ok, this has popped up, let it be there, but let me focus on this. So, it is like a pop-up, maybe later on we can close it, later on we can evaluate it, we can discuss it. But sometimes, if we are in the heat of action, at that time to deal with the mind it becomes quite difficult.
So, at that time I just focus on my purpose and keep that suspended. And it’s not that always what the mind says is wrong. Sometimes we have had experience that this person is always very forgetful.
If I have something important to do and if I count on them and they forget, I will be in trouble. So, we may remember that also. So, basically now I am not going to go into difference between mind and intelligence here.
Something pops up within us and something passes judgement. So, now, what we have to do is, later on, at that time just focus on doing what requires to be done, but afterwards we can evaluate. So, I had this thought at this time.
And yeah, based on my past experience, this devotee forgets all the time. Then maybe I have to make up some backup plan or make some backup plan. Or, ok, it just happened once, but everybody else says this devotee is very reliable.
So, I shouldn’t extrapolate based on one experience. Let me give the benefit of doubt to this devotee. When the mind passes comments, at that time, if we try to deal with the external situation and also deal with the internal comment, it becomes overload for us.
So, at that time we can just keep it suspended. And especially if we are interacting with someone regularly, then we know how our mind passes judgments. Then at that time when we are calm, reflective, at that time we evaluate what the mind is saying.
And then we arrive at our own understanding of how to respond to the mind. So, judging is a habit which everyone has. Some have it more, some have it less.
What we need to do is we make sure that it, whatever the mind is doing, we have to evaluate whether it’s assisting me in my service or it’s impeding me in my service. Sometimes if I have a responsible position, I have to get things done. Then understanding who has what strengths and weaknesses, that is important.
But if I’m just interacting at a social level with somebody, then trying to have, entertaining negative thoughts about others, that is simply going to impede my devotional interactions with them. The other way to look at this also is that, yes, I’m judging this devotee for this fault, but I also have faults. So, generally what happens is, if we are good at something, and somebody else is poor at it, then we become quite judgemental about it.
So, we often compare others’ weaknesses with our strengths. But we compare their weaknesses with our weaknesses. My weaknesses may be in some other field.
Okay, this person is very forgetful. Okay, they are forgetful. But then I may also have my weakness.
I may be not very sensitive. I’m a little short-tempered. And then if I think that I want to give up my short-tempered attitude, but it’s so difficult to give it up.
Just as I have a struggle in overcoming my conditioning, similarly they have a struggle in overcoming their conditioning. That may not be a weakness for me, but it is for them. So, if we see that we all are souls who want to serve Krishna, and we all are impeded by our particular conditionings.
So, the specific conditioning will be different, but the principle that material nature has infested us with certain conditionings that limit our service to Krishna, then what happens? We don’t see us and them on opposite sides. We see we are all on the same side in the battle against material nature to serve Krishna. The specific weakness with me is different, specific weakness with them is different.
So, if we can see that rather than judging this devotee, this is the weakness in them, we can identify that. We can’t neglect that completely. But if we see, yeah, I have my weaknesses, they have their weaknesses.
But all these weaknesses are ultimately created by material nature’s conditionings. And that material nature is what we are all trying to fight. Then rather than we and they being on the two opposite sides, we can both be on the same side.
And we fight together against material nature to serve Krishna. So, instead of criticising and condemning, we can be complementing and complementing. Complement is complement, L-I-M-E-N-T-E and L-E-M-E-N-T-E.
Complement means appreciate the good that is there in them. So, okay, I can see this fault, but I can see this good also is there. So, appreciate the good and if they have some weakness, let me make up for that.
Let me complement that. So, yeah, okay, this devotee is forgetful. That means, I may have to give an extra reminder to them or two extra reminders to them.
So, if we can see that we are all partners rather than opponents, then the judgemental attitude can go down substantially. So, we can’t deny if somebody has some weaknesses. But we won’t harp on it.
Rather, we’ll help each other to deal with it and move onwards. Okay, thank you. So, yes, go on.
This question is about four sampradayas. So, is the destination of all four sampradayas same? Sometimes it appears that destination of one sampradaya is superior to others. Okay.
Three sampradaya they talk about are Narayana. They don’t go beyond Narayana. So, what is the exact difference between the destinations and only the destinations? Is the destination of the four sampradayas the same? It is same in the sense that everybody is going to be liberated.
Everybody is going to attain Krishna. Within that, based on individual attraction to a particular form, each may go to a particular destination. So, there is, in bhakti, there is a confidential or specific aspect and there is a universal aspect.
And at the right time, we have to focus on the right thing. So, for example, our Gaudiya Vishnu Acharyas, when they are talking about the glory of Krishna, when they are talking about the glory of Prarindavan Krishna, they will glorify it in such a way that all other destinations may seem not so good. Golok Prarindavan, that is the highest.
But if you don’t see that proper perspective, we start treating Golok Prarindavan as my goal. And Vaikuntha, that’s like my backyard. We start treating it like that.
Vaikuntha is also the spiritual one. In Chetan Charita Amrit, even Shantaras, it has two characteristics. One is complete detachment from matter and complete attachment to the Lord.
Such a limited state in Shantaras. So, in specific occasions when we want to understand the speciality of Gaudiya Vaishnavism, we may talk about the difference between Golok Prarindavan and other places. But at other times, we understand that it’s all the abode of the Lord, it’s all a liberated destination and everybody will be supremely satisfied in that.
In the Brihad Bhagavata Amrita, when the Gopakumar goes to the spiritual world, first he goes to Vaikuntha. And then he stays in Vaikuntha, he’s delighted to be in Vaikuntha, but then he’s not satisfied. He feels some discontent.
And from Vaikuntha he goes to Ayodhya. And he’s with Ram and associates of Ram. He’s very satisfied for some time.
But after some discontent comes in. Then he goes to Dwarka. He’s with Krishna himself.
He’s satisfied. But then, again he feels a little discontent. He feels, you know, oh, I’m a Gopakumar.
I want to worship Krishna as Gopala. As I said, he comes to the material world in Golok Prarindavan, he performs sadhana, he goes to Golok Prarindavan. So through this, Sanatana Goswami is describing how Golok Prarindavan is the highest destination.
But the significant point is, he’s describing that when he’s in Vaikuntha, at that time the Vaikuntha Vasis think that Vishnu is the supreme. And they think Krishna is the avatar of Vishnu. When he goes to Ayodhya, they think Ram is supreme.
And they think all the avatars, they come from Ram. And Sanatana Goswami doesn’t give in parenthesis, no, by the way they are wrong. He doesn’t do that.
There is room for transcendental subjectivity. In the material world, when we say subjective, it means, you know, it’s just your opinion. But in the spiritual realm, the highest is not just tattva, highest is rasa.
So you want to understand the tattva, but ultimately you want to experience rasa. And if a devotee has attraction to Ram, and in that attraction to Ram, the devotee feels that Ram is my lord. I don’t know anyone other than Ram.
And that is perfection. Not to speak of talking about Sanatana Goswami and Bihar Bhagavatam, even in Chaitanya Leela also, when Murari Gupta is devoted to Ram, Chaitanya Mahaprabhu is pleased with this devotion. He tells him, worship Krishna.
He says, no, I can’t do that. I worship you. I’m delighted.
So now, it is also true that in our tradition, Murari Gupta doesn’t become initiating guru. Ganadhar Pandit is there, Nityanand Prabhu is there, otherwise Acharya is there. The lines are coming down.
Murari Gupta doesn’t become an initiating guru now. But that doesn’t mean that his devotion is not appreciated. But in Mahaprabhu, exemplary, he says that, the lord never abandons the devotee and the devotee never abandons the lord.
Such is the greatness of bhakti. So, he appreciates that as an example of bhakti. You know, you are worshipping Ram, lower level.
Not like that. So, we have to respect devotion wherever we see it. And the lord is so infinitely all-attractive.
Brahmaji in his prayers for creative energy, he says that, my dear lord, you are so merciful to your devotees that the devotee in whichever form the devotee worships you, you reciprocate by manifesting in that form. So, if a devotee is attracted to Ram, then the lord will reveal himself as Ram. And in Ram, that devotee will find all the attractive qualities of the lord.
So, the destination is same in the sense that everybody will get the full satisfaction of pure love and pure loving absorption in Krishna. So, in the lord. In which form of the lord, that may vary based on their rasa.
But it is not that in terms of their experience, they will not have anything missing. It is that Hanuman doesn’t think that, you know, I am only worshipping Ram, I want to go to Goloka. He doesn’t think that, oh, you know, I am only in Dasya rasa.
I want to be like Bharat. He is fully satisfied in his devotion. So, in that sense, in the sense of getting full absorption, full satisfaction, pure love, the destination is the same.
Thank you. Oh, okay. Yeah.
Okay, fine. Yeah. If they worship Vishnu, they worship Vishnu primarily.
No, no. Shiva is a primary teacher. They are worshippers of Krishna.
They are not worshippers of Shiva. Shiva is a primary teacher for them. Yes.
By the way, are we having prasadam here? Maybe if you want to start prasadam, you can start because it is already quite late. It is almost 8.30. We will start. We will pass.
Yeah, you can pass the plate and you can continue. Question and answers. Can I describe the falling of the soul from the spiritual world to the material world? No, I don’t know.
This is a question which is, which is the favourite way of devotees to give themselves an intellectual headache. Yeah, I think it’s like, no, it’s basically, it’s something which happens, something which is not in the domain of time. It is not in the domain of time, it’s quite difficult to understand.
So, how the soul came from the spiritual world, whether the soul came from the spiritual world. The different acharyas have given different statements. So, Jigoswami has said something, Bhaktivinoda Thakura has said something.
In Shila Prabhupada, sometimes he says, Prabhupada says the soul fell from the spiritual world. But that’s not the only thing that Prabhupada said. In the fourth canto that Jaya Vijaya, falling curse, past tense.
The statement Prabhupada says, therefore the conclusion is that a soul never falls from the spiritual world. So, when our own acharyas have given different statements, then it’s best not to become a campaigner for or against any statement. You know, if you are walking along the road and if there is a banana peel, what happens? Put your foot on the banana peel, slip and fall.
So, this question is like an intellectual banana peel. As soon as you get into this question. So, I would say that because our acharyas have given different statements, so, whichever statement makes sense to us, we accept that and move on.
This is just not a question which is resolvable very easily. And there are some questions which we can, by discussion, get some resolution. And if we get resolution, we can make that as our operational conviction and move on with our life.
Sometimes if we don’t get resolution, we can take that also as a, this is something which I can’t understand. Keep that aside and move on in our life. Don’t get, it’s a unresolvable, it’s not a definitively resolvable question either way.
So, you know, whatever explanation you give, I have a reputation for that. I can argue for this and I can point the problems with this. I can argue for this and I can point the problems for this.
So, let’s not get into this. Yeah. So, when our emotions take over, then it’s very difficult to maintain gratitude.
Either past hurts or future goals, they come into our mind and then we lose our gratitude. Yes, two distinct things here. First is that being grateful doesn’t mean living in denial of the bad things that happen in life.
When bad things happen, they are bad things. It’s not that somehow we are supposed to imagine that they are good things. So, when bad things happen, it’s difficult to be grateful.
If we get some terrible disease, if we lose our job, some relationship, big complication comes up. Lots of bad things happen in life and it’s difficult to be grateful at that time. But we can differentiate between two things.
We can’t be grateful for all situations but we can be grateful in all situations. That means, if something terrible has happened in my life, I can’t wish it away. And it is terrible.
It is when Draupadi is dishonoured, after that when she goes to the forest, Krishna comes to meet them all over there. And Draupadi is so upset. She says, Krishna, I called you.
Such a disaster happened. Why didn’t you come? He says, I am your friend, I am your cousin, I am your devotee, I am your relative. Why didn’t you come to help me, Krishna? Now, Krishna doesn’t say over there, I have my perfect plans.
How dare you challenge me? Krishna doesn’t take that at all. Krishna says, actually this demon Shalva had attacked Dwarka. And I was caught in defending, protecting Dwarka and securing Dwarka.
As soon as I came to know what had happened, I immediately came. If I had known the gambling match was going to take place, I would have come and stopped the match from taking place. So Krishna, Krishna doesn’t take, even God doesn’t take a holier than thou attitude over there.
He takes an understanding attitude. And then he says, even in such a difficult situation, you acted in a very honourable way. And your honour will be redeemed.
Your offenders will be punished. Stay on the path of dharma. So now we say that Krishna did come and he protected her honour.
But actually nobody saw Krishna at that time. She just called out for help and an endless cloth came over there. But nobody saw Krishna.
So that is Krishna directly and a personal vision was not there. So I am giving this as an example to illustrate the point that when that terrible atrocity had happened on Draupadi, it was not that she was grateful for that and nor was it demanded that you be grateful for that. So bad things do happen in our life and at that time it is difficult to have a devotional disposition or a grateful disposition.
So that’s understandable. See, spiritualising ourselves does not mean dehumanising ourselves. There are certain human emotions that do come up.
So if we lose someone, there is going to be grief at that time. And there are, even in the Vedic tradition, there are practises by which grieving is done. When Dashrath Maharaj passes away, there is a ten day statewide mourning that is done in honour of him.
So there are natural human emotions that are there in various situations and they are understood. They are not to be denied. But what we need and do is, we don’t have to value those emotions.
To give a simple example, actually I gave a series of classes when I was in Melbourne. I gave Emotionally Healthy Spirituality. So what that means is that, say, if I had an accident and my hand got broken, then I will have to rest my hand.
Even if I am very spiritually advanced, that doesn’t mean that my hand is going to function like normal. I will have to rest the hand. And by resting, I will let it recover.
And then gradually after that, I start exercising my hand, according to medical advice. And then the hand recovers and can function normally. Just because I am spiritually advanced doesn’t mean my hand injury will not affect me.
It may not affect my consciousness, but it will affect my functioning. So what applies at the physical level also applies at the emotional level. Sometimes bad things happen and they can emotionally wound us.
And if we get emotionally wounded by something, then we will need time to recover from that emotional wound. So giving ourselves that time, either we have to make time for it ourselves or others have to be understanding and give us that time, the understanding, the sympathy, then we take the time to recover. But if we just keep wallowing in that forever, you know, why did this happen, why did this happen, why did this happen, if we just keep that as a perpetually replaying movie in our mind, why did he do this, why did this happen, then we will never recover.
It’s like I have a fractured hand and I never do any exercise. Or I keep scratching the band-aid or whatever, it’s worsening it. So we don’t have to deny our human emotions, but we don’t have to perpetuate them either.
So we acknowledge that sometimes when it’s going to be very very difficult to be grateful. So I broadly say that at this time we can do three things. I said when we can’t be grateful for all situations, but we can be grateful in all situations.
So how can we do that? Three broad things. First is that we can, when that bad thing has happened, we can look at what good things are there in my life. Okay, I got this terrible disease.
I have a supportive family. I have good health insurance. I have got a community which will help me.
And I have overall a sturdy body. I am young. So many things are right in my life.
So we can’t be grateful for that particular thing, but we can be grateful for other things that are right in our life. That can at least give us some peace of mind. Otherwise what the mind does is it sees one thing going wrong and it makes it appear as if now our whole world is collapsing.
It’s the end of the world. But by consciously shifting our attention towards the things that are good in our life, we can actually bring some amount of peace. Then second is we can look for the good things that are helping us to deal with this bad thing.
So I have many good things in my life. But okay, I found a doctor who is expert in this field and who has got a treatment that works. And I can be grateful for that.
So generally what are the good things in my life and specifically what are the good things that are helping me to deal with this bad thing. And thirdly, bad things may happen but Krishna is so expert that he can bring even good out of the bad. So how that will happen, I don’t know.
When that will happen, I don’t know. But if I just try to maintain a devotional disposition, Krishna can bring good even out of the bad. If you look at the Pandavas, terrible things happened to them.
But each terrible thing actually made them stronger. When Duryodhana tried to poison Bhima, he poisoned him and threw him into the river. But then through that river he went to Varunadev and Varunadev gave him several jars of celestial nectar which made him hundred times stronger.
When the Kauravas tried to burn the Pandavas in Varanabad, they escaped from there and for some time they were just living like fugitives, incognito, in poverty. But eventually through that they came to Drupada’s kingdom and they won the hand of Draupadi. And at that time there were two powerful kingdoms.
One was Kuru kingdom, the other was Drupada’s, Panchala kingdom. So once the Pandavas formed an alliance with Drupada by marrying his daughter, then the whole game changed. Because till then they were orphans living at Dhritarashtra’s mercy.
But now they were the in-laws of, the king was as powerful as he was. So through all those adversities they became more powerful. So we may not be able to see right now, we don’t have to say that this is good.
But Krishna can bring good even out of this bad. That way we can try to get a more grateful disposition. Did I answer your question? Thank you.
Other questions? Sometimes when somebody is about to leave the body, the body is called off, even though they have not done anything, any spiritual activity in their life. Can you just get my laptop power cord, it’s getting discharged. So throughout their life, they may not have done any pious activity at all, in that particular life.
But when devotees go and offer Tulsi and garlands of babies, what would be the destination of the devotees? What exactly happens to them? So if we offer Tulsi or flower garlands to Jain Hare Krishna, someone who is dying, who has not practised bhakti at all, what would be their destination? Basically, remembering Krishna at the time of death is not a trick. It’s not that I can live sensually throughout my life. When I had enough of life, I take a gun, put my gun near my forehead.
Hare Krishna! And shoot myself. I can’t trick Krishna like that. It is I have to remember him.
And this recollection is not like a factual recollection. Like you know, what is 7 into 8? 56. It’s not like a factual recollection.
This recollection that Krishna talks about, it’s more of a calling of the heart. Basically, if we have taken generally, what will we remember at the time of death? Usually, whenever there is danger, we gravitate towards that which gives us shelter from that danger. Say, if I know a big tornado is coming, then I will go immediately to the secure most part of my house.
I may go to the go down or some cellar where it’s very secure. So like that, similarly at a psychological level or a certain level of consciousness, when death, which is the greatest danger, when death comes upon us, at that time, we will naturally think of that thing where we have experienced the greatest shelter. So, if I have experienced my greatest shelter in, say, watching cricket.
Then at the time of death, even if chanting Hare Krishna is going around me, I will not be chanting, I will not be thinking of Hare Krishna. My thoughts will go to cricket. If my greatest security has been in money, then my thoughts will gravitate towards money.
So, if we are actually to remember Krishna at the time of death, then we need to experience Krishna’s shelter before death. Not just experience Krishna’s shelter, but rather we should experience our greatest shelter in Krishna. We get shelter in many different things.
We get shelter in our family members. We get shelter in our wealth. We get shelter in our social position.
And all these shelters are fine for functioning in this world. But we have to have greatest shelter in Krishna. Without that, we cannot attain Krishna.
Because our heart is not attracted to him. It’s like, say, if we have a devotional satsang programme and somebody who is not at all a devotee, they come over there. They come over there, they feel out of place.
What am I doing over here? So, like that, somebody who has never practised bhakti, even if they go to the spiritual world, they will feel out of place there. What am I doing here? So, what Krishna can do is that there may be a little bhakti also, Krishna can maxify that. Like he did it with Putana.
A little inclination of service, Krishna saw that and he highlighted that. And at time of death, he cleansed her of all her sin and their reactions. But there has to be at least some devotional inclination has to be there.
So, what we are trying to do is, when a person is about to depart, we try to create as devotional setting around them as possible. By that, there will be at least some remembrance of Krishna. It may not be in their foreground, but it will be somewhere in the background.
And at that time, like in Ajamil’s case, initially when he called out, he was calling out to Narayan, addressing his son. But Vichandraji Thakur explains that initially when he called out Narayan, he was addressing his son. But as that intention to address his son came out as his words, then when he heard those words Narayan, at that time, he remembered Lord Narayan.
And he thought, oh, what can this child protect me? It is Lord Narayan who will protect me. And it was that recollection of Narayan, he didn’t intend to chant Narayan, but when he chanted, he remembered Narayan. And that was what actually saved him.
I mean, that did not liberate him. What it did was, it saved him from hell and gave him another chance. That book of Shri Prabhupada on his story is called Second Chance.
So, I would say that if we create auspiciousness, devotional auspiciousness for somebody, that will definitely lead to an auspicious destination for them. Now, what exactly is the nature of the auspicious destination, that depends on their own devotional inclination or lack of. If there is some remembrance of Krishna, that will count for their future spiritual progress.
But Krishna doesn’t impose on anyone’s free will. So, that soul at least has to have some desire for Krishna. Generally, for us to go back to Krishna, if Krishna is our only desire, then we will surely go back to him.
But even if that is not there, at least if Krishna is our greatest desire, I may have desire for this and that and that, but if Krishna is my greatest desire, then also I can go back to Krishna. And if I have a small desire for Krishna, Krishna can magnify it also. Krishna can magnify it by his mercy.
But unless we have some desire, we cannot go to Krishna. But that stimulus at that time will create some auspiciousness. Because they have remembered Krishna at that time, at least in the background of their awareness, they may go to a place where they can remember Krishna more.
So, we don’t have to get too much into the zone of specifics, what decision they are going to get. Because in every situation, something is in our hands and something is not in our hands. So, what is in our hands, we do our best and what is not in our hands, we leave it to Krishna.
Thank you. Yes, anybody else? Yes, Mataji. Anyone not asked, no? So? Okay.
I want to ask one thing. How can we get, like, good relationship with friends, you know, with devotees? But sometimes there is tension in the place or we have like some thoughts. But still we have to deal with devotees every day.
And we have to develop Krishna consciousness every day. I am doing our service, our job, but I am dealing with devotees. How can we take some time in Krishna and not commit apayada? So, if you have a small community, then and if we have to interact with some devotees, but the relationship is strained, then how can we continue our service without committing apayada? Generally, there are some devotees whose association gives us strength.
And there are some devotees whose association takes our strength. So, both kind are there. They said that some people bring happiness wherever they go.
And some people bring happiness whenever they go. So, and curiously, you know, it’s not the same person for everyone. For some person, I feel relief when they go away.
But for somebody else, when they come, they welcome them. So, it’s not necessarily their fault or my fault. It’s just that sometimes some people’s chemistry doesn’t match.
So, now, if we have to work with some devotee with whom we are not able to get along so well, then we see that as an opportunity to do two services. One is doing the service and second is doing that service with that person. Krishna knows that it is what we are going through.
In the Bhagavatam in the 10th canto, it is described that when Krishna got one parijat flower for Rukmini, and after that, Satyabhama got annoyed and she demanded. So, he got a whole tree for her. And then after that, when Krishna went to Rukmini, he thought, Rukmini will ask something from me.
Rukmini will be upset. But Rukmini did not show anything at all. And later on, Krishna told, by this you pleased me so much.
So, Krishna knew what Rukmini was going through. And Krishna appreciated that still she maintained her service attitude towards him. So, the point I am making is that if we are not able to get along with some devotee, then Krishna knows that.
And if still we are trying to work with that devotee, Krishna will appreciate that. So, in some cases, serving with some devotee is also a service. So, it is difficult to do that service.
But that’s why Krishna sees that and Krishna appreciates that. So, if there is difficulty in working with some devotee and still we work with that devotee, then we make spiritual advancement through that. Because we are curbing our natural impulses and we are trying to maintain a devotional disposition, Krishna will see that.
So, it’s not that Krishna is unaware of the difficulties we are going through. So, sometimes we serve with some people. Sometimes we serve through some people.
That means they are like our representative spiritual masters. Sometimes we serve some people. Just do it for them.
And sometimes we serve in spite of some people. So, there are different permutations that may work. In general, if it is difficult to work with some person, then it is… and it is not possible, say, to avoid working with them.
Then it is good to have some well-defined boundaries. Generally, it is said that good fences create good neighbours. That means if there is a quarrel between two neighbours, this fruit came in my garden.
With no fence, they will keep fighting. So, if we create some well-defined expectations, this is what I am expected to do, this is what you are expected to do, then there will not be constant to and fro. Because what happens when there is tension between two people, then even a small problem can lead to an explosion.
And to minimise that, if at a time when both of us are relatively calm or both of us are with somebody who is senior and trustworthy, we plan out and this is how we are going to work. And when there are well-defined expectations, then the chances of provocation and explosion become much lesser. Also, when we work this way with relatively well-defined expectations, then gradually by working like that, we can eventually even learn to appreciate the good side of the devotee.
Initially, I have this problem, but when I see, when I work with someone, this is good about this person, good about this person. Sometimes, some relationships keep us in our comfort zone. Because I like this, I like that devotee, that devotee likes me.
And that’s good. But sometimes we may not develop much Vaishnava qualities in that. We may, we may not also.
Sometimes some people lead us by the hand towards Krishna. Some people make us run towards Krishna. So, different people, if we see that they are a part of Krishna’s plan to help us become more dependent on him, more connected with him, then we can appreciate even the way they are acting.
But in general, if we know that there is some people or some interactions where there is some volatility, there is some tension, likelihood of tension, it’s best to clarify expectations. In the Mahabharata, it is described that when the five Pandavas got married to Draupadi, when they came back home, Naraduni came to meet them. Naraduni is a sage, he came to meet them.
And the whole meeting is, you know, how are all five of you going to associate with Draupadi? And they made a plan over there. This is this, this is this. And then when Arjuna did not act according to that plan, one time he went to the forest for one year.
They took it very seriously. So, there, although they were very good, they were not just brothers, but they were best of friends. But there was a situation where some volatility was there.
They made a plan how to deal with it. So, in general, where volatile situations are likely, it’s vital to have some clarification, clarified expectations. Specified and clarified expectations.
And that decreases the chance of, chance of unnecessary misunderstandings or confrontations. But in general, these are opportunities where we can make spiritual advancement much more. Although it may be a little bit of tension, but we can make spiritual advancement to that also.
Okay? Thank you. Well, sometimes our japa, it falls a little late. We can’t finish in the morning.
But then once we, once we get there, then more services come up. But in chanting, we’re asking for more, more, give us more service. Krishna happens to give us some more desire to do a service.
So, is it better? So, should we not do the service and focus on our japa? Or should we do the service and then do japa at a later time? Okay. If you’re not able to chant in the morning, and then later on, either we can chant or we have some service to do. So, should we do the service? Because we are praying to Krishna to give us service only through chanting.
Or should we focus on chanting? There’s no absolute over here. In general, we have to see the time, place of concerns. And we have to decide accordingly.
If some services can be done later, we do them later and do our japa. Sometimes some services have to be done at that time. That’s fine.
So, sometimes Prabhupada would say Krishna Consciousness. Sometimes our devotees would ask too many things. Should we do this? Should we do that? When they’re caring for Tulsi, first time they brought Tulsi Devi to America, and they’re trying to care for Tulsi Devi.
Devotees ask a long list of questions. Should we do this? Should we do this? So, Prabhupada answered several of the questions. And then for last, the remaining question is, Use your intelligence.
So, what that means is that ultimately, we can’t predict any and every kind of situation that we’re going to find. So, if we understand broad principle, japa is a very important way in which we want to connect with Krishna. And the earlier we do it is better.
But sometimes other things come up. And sometimes we may also feel that, in the heat of this moment, I have 10 minutes, I can chant two rounds. But then my mind is constantly caught in the next thing which I have to do.
Then if I have time in the evening, I may decide, in the evening I’ll chant peacefully. But then we go in the evening and we find out something, this came up, that came up, that came up, and then late night I’ll chant. Then I may decide that, okay, this putting off in the evening, it doesn’t work so well.
So, we have to learn from our own experience, how we can best serve Krishna. Best in terms of offering our consciousness during chanting to Krishna and also best in terms of how we can integrate chanting into a life of service to Krishna. There is no need to absolutise this kind of things.
Some devotees may say that during chanting I’ll not talk. I’ll complete this round and then I’ll talk. If that’s what they feel inspired to do, that’s okay.
But that doesn’t mean that somebody who talks during chanting is less serious about their chanting. You see, they may think that, okay, this devotee has come to talk with me, why should I keep this devotee with me? They may have a service attitude about that. So, in bhakti, there are principles and there are preferences.
So, if we make preferences into principles, we become fanatic. That means, what is a preference? Some devotees may prefer to sit and chant. Some devotees may sit to stand and chant.
Some devotees may prefer to walk and chant. Now, is it that those who are walking and chanting are less serious and those who are sitting and chanting are more serious? Could be, but need not be. Ultimately, it’s the amount of attention.
Generally, we could say that sitting and chanting is likely to be more attentive. But sometimes, you may be sitting and you may be sleeping. Or you may be sitting and still you may be just looking who all is sleeping.
So, how I chant, whether I walk and chant or sit and chant or stand and chant, that’s the preference. Chanting is the principle. So, similarly, if I am, if in the course of the day I have some service to do and I have chanting to do, some devotees will say, first complete your chanting.
That is a wow. That’s what you want to do. That’s most important.
OK. That’s fine. You should know the service that you need after the chant.
That’s the preference. So, I think what our preferences will be, that will vary from person to person and also in time, place, circumstances. So, no need to absolutise that.
Thank you. So, OK. Yeah.
OK. Go ahead. So, sometimes in pictures they draw soul as a blue spark and sometimes they draw soul as form.
So, what is this? Good question. Sometimes in pictures we show soul as a blue spark or a spark of white light. Sometimes we show it as having a form.
Yes. The soul, one of the characters Krishna says is avyaktoyam achintyoyam. Avikaryoyam uchyate.
Is unmanifest, is inconceivable, is unchangeable. So, achintyoyam means that the soul’s form, whatever form you want, soul’s form or souls, OK, soul’s form only, does not manifest to us and is not conceivable by us. So, what the soul is that itself is not manifest or conceivable to us.
The only way we conceive it is through its symptom of consciousness. So, for the purpose of depiction, at particular, sometimes the soul at present is a spark of consciousness. So, in that sense, the soul is depicted as a spark of effulgent light.
But in some situations, say for example, in the case of Ajami, if you see that picture, it’s shown that the Yamadutas are coming and they are catching Ajami and taking him out. So, in that sense, maybe there is Ajami’s body and there is another form which is similar. Yes.
So, there, what is being depicted is the subtle body, not the soul. So, now, in some cases when the soul is depicted as having a particular form, if you see the context, if it’s a pure devotee who has awakened the Swaroopa, then that Swaroopa might be depicted over there. But in general, to depict the soul as having a particular form right now, that would be a little problematic.
Sometimes just to illustrate the point that the soul is not just an impersonal spark of consciousness, but soul is a person. For that purpose, the soul may be depicted as a particular form. So, in general, this whole, what you are going to call it, Chitra, Chitra picture as a means of conveying Tattva, that is, it is not possible to Chitra, to pictures to give exact philosophical truth.
Because philosophical truths are often beyond simple depictions. But they are used to give certain indications. So, we have to see the context and then understand what was indicated through that.
Yes, sir. So, we have a tendency, like, I mean, if you are in the Sarvaka stage, you can put a fence and maybe associate with the neighbour. But as you grow as a leader, how do you actually, you know, really, do you really forgive or do you act like as you forgive or just like a tap goes on and then all the bad things just come from the monitor? So, if somebody has done something which has hurt us and then you want to keep the relationship good, but those past hurts keep coming up.
So, do we forgive or what do we do, how do we continue at that time? There are three different things. There is forgiving, there is forgetting and there is trusting. So, forgiveness is for the past.
And that should always begin. But trusting is for the future. And trust has to be earned.
If we have given some money to someone and they lost the money, ok, I may forgive that. But if I again give money to them, I will be being foolish. So, trust, sometimes we equate forgiving and trusting as the same thing.
And then we say, how can I forgive? But no, forgiving is for the past. What wrong has happened? Ok, let us close the chapter. But trust has to be earned.
And unless that trust is earned, just if we conflate forgiving and trusting, then we will be taken for a ride. The person may just keep doing the same thing again and again and again. And we will be fooled by that.
So, broadly speaking, we can talk about forgiveness in two terms. Forgiveness in terms of our emotions and forgiveness in terms of our actions. So, in terms of our emotions, we don’t hold a resentful or a vengeful attitude towards anyone.
We understand whatever they did, it was because of their condition. If I suffered because of that, it was because of my past karma. And I don’t keep that replaying again and again in my mind.
Should this happen? Let’s close this chapter. So, forgiveness enables us to, basically forgiveness is, whenever somebody does something wrong, our mind basically keeps replaying it. Did this, did this, did this, did this.
This keeps happening again and again. But when we forgive, forgiveness basically is a way to power off the mind’s auto-replay of that past. When I forgive, it’s a decision I make, I won’t hold this again and again in my mind.
Still the replay may go on, but if we don’t invest our emotion in it, if I am not resentful, if I am not vengeful, then that replay’s power is going down. So, in terms of intention, we forgive. Now, in terms of action, we have to see practically.
Because in general, there is a principle of forgiveness and there is a principle of justice. And if we see Krishna, when he went to Duryodhana as Shanti Doodh, although the Kauravas had done grievous wrongs, Krishna was ready to end it all. Just give five villages.
But they refused to accept even that. In fact, they tried to arrest Krishna. That means, they were not only not ready to compromise, arrive at a mutual settlement, actually continuing their past mentality.
Then their forgiveness would have been stupid. Krishna fought. Now, the Pandavas did not fight to take revenge.
They fought for justice. They fought for establishing Dharma. Generally, when punishment is given, or some disciplinary action is taken against someone, that has three broad purposes.
One is to teach that person a lesson that actions have consequences. And for them to register the gravity of the wrong they did. Second is to set an example for others that if we do this wrong, this will be the result.
And third is to acknowledge the pain that the victim has gone through. So, now that pain cannot be compensated by causing pain to another person. But still the principle of justice means, if you have caused pain, you have to get pain.
So, now, in our sense, if we forgive this third part, that you caused me pain, so I will cause you pain. That we may not want that. But still, the first and the second apply.
If that person is not taught a lesson, then they may do the same thing again. They may do it once. And not only that, others may do it also, by seeing their example.
So, in that sense, forgiveness is a… Actually, I have a whole seminar on forgiveness, which I am not going to. But forgiveness at an individual level is a brahminical principle. But kshatriyas who are administrators, they cannot operate on the principle of forgiveness alone.
Kshatriyas also have to operate on the principle of justice. Kshatriyas may also forgive sometimes. But the driving principle of a brahmana is forgiveness.
Whatever you do, I will forgive. Of course, brahmanas sometimes get angry and they give curses. But that is un-brahminical behaviour.
In general, brahmanas are expected to forgive. That is their quality. Kshama is the quality of brahmanas.
But kshatriyas, they are administrators. They have to maintain order in society. So, their normal operating principle is justice.
They may also forgive on occasions. But kshatriyas are more like judges. Judges, they have to evaluate the magnitude of the crime and give appropriate punishment.
And if the criminal is very repentant, if the criminal is behaving well, then they may minimise it also. But judges don’t operate on the principle of forgiveness. They operate on the principle of seeking justice.
So, now, when we work in the devotee community, at that time, forgiveness is something which we would like to practise. Because ultimately we are all sadhakas, we all struggle, we all make mistakes. So, forgiveness is what we would like to operate on.
But at the same time, we are not just isolated sadhakas. We are sadhakas living in a community. And each person’s actions, they have consequences.
So, you know, once, I am one of the editors for BTG. So, there was one person, one boy who was in jail. And there he met devotees.
And he became a devotee. It’s quite a dramatic transformation of life here. So, then we decided to publish an article about history.
It was an article about jail preaching. And then he had become a devotee over there. Through jail preaching he became a devotee.
But then just before we published the article, at that time we got a letter from some other devotee in that community. And apparently this boy had gone to a jail because he had molested a devotee girl before. Now, can we portray him as an ideal devotee? Or any kind of devotee and transform him? It’s a serious question.
So, then we just deferred the decision to that community. Because in this case, he has been transformed. But, you know, we are living in a community.
If it is simply a story of his transformation, that’s a testimony of bhakti. But there is a community over there. And there are other people’s emotions involved over there.
And if we highlight this person, it may hurt those who have been the victims of the past crimes. So, we have to balance over there. That’s why, when we are living in a community, there has to be both the brahminical principle of forgiveness at an individual level, but there also has to be sathriya principle of justice at a managerial level.
And how to balance this? This has to be seen in a called time, place and circumstance. And in general, as I said, trust will have to be earned. So, maybe sometimes, once a person commits a mistake, he may decide to forgive.
But then we can’t just give the trust. They will have to act in a trustworthy way by which they can earn the trust. Sometimes even one mistake may be so grave that it has consequences on others.
And within the community, we may have to take some action about it. But in general, if it is a devotee who is overall serious in the spiritual life, then we don’t have to hold the past against them. But by interacting with them, if we see that they are behaving in a responsible way, they are trusting, then we can move forward.
And then the trust can be earned. And as far as forgetting is concerned, it’s quite difficult. Again, if we equate forgiving with forgetting, then we say, how can I forget? As soon as I see this person, even when I don’t see the person, the replay is going on in my mind.
That if I see the person, how can the replay not go on? It’s true, it will go on. It’s like a scar. If I was injured, I got a scar on my hand.
Now, the scar, I can’t wish it away. The scar is there. But, if it is a raw wound, and I scratch it, it will keep worsening.
But if I let it be, it will heal. And once it heals, the scar is still there, but just touching it or thinking of it won’t hurt. Because the wound has got filled and healed.
Similarly, when the wound is raw, somebody has done something wrong, at that time, every thought of itself will agitate us. But when we forgive, that means we decide, this was my past karma, this person was just an instrument, and Krishna had some plan. So, I won’t hold this against this person.
I won’t seek revenge. I won’t resent. We accept that.
Then that acceptance is what allows the wound to heal. And then after that also, when we see that person, we may remember. Or we did like this.
But that’s like, it’s a memory which has been divested of its emotional power. Because we have allowed it to heal. We’ll remember, but not in an emotionally agitating way.
Okay, that event happened in my life, it’s a long time ago. Or it happened, it’s okay. So, we can forgive in terms of intention, not hold it against them, not resent or not seek revenge.
In terms of action, what we have to do, that we have to see upon time, place, circumstance. And generally, we have to think of not just our emotions, but we also think about that person’s well-being. They keep repeating it.
Or that person, what example they are setting for others. So, with respect to justice, we have to think of all these factors and then arrive at a proper decision. Okay? So, oh.
Okay. So, till how much time should we go on? Or maybe… It’s 9.15. That’s why we go on. Yeah.
So, it is… It is misleadingly favourable, right? It’s 9.30. Okay, fine. It’s okay? So, how many have left? One, two, three, four. Okay.
You keep the time. Tell me when four minutes are over. Yeah, you had a question? Yes.
So, this was maybe an extension about this question of forgiveness. So, there is one situation… So, you mentioned that the Brahminical principle is that Brahmins always… The general principle is to forgive. Yet, there is one situation which is that… And, of course, a Vaishnav doesn’t ever consider that they themselves have been offended.
But, you know, they don’t even think that they can be offended. They don’t even think that they’re somebody to be offended. But, it says that one is not supposed to forgive an offence to somebody else.
In fact, in the Nectar of Devotion, it says that if one witnesses a Vaishnava fraud, then one has… What can I… Yeah, that’s true. …vehemently protest or commit suicide or leave. So, usually, we don’t try to commit suicide.
But those are the three options. On the other hand, if one takes this principle too far, then one can just, you know, be seeing Vaishnava fraud everywhere and imagining it, and it could cause a lot of problem. But, on the other hand, we don’t have the right to forgive a Vaishnava fraud against someone else.
A Vaishnav will not forgive them. It says only that that Vaishnav can forgive them. So, then how… So, generally, we say that a Vaishnava fraud cannot be forgiven.
We should vehemently oppose it at least or walk away from it. But we can’t forgive it. So, what do we do? In general, no principle in Bhakti should be absolutised.
The absolute principle is that Krishna is our Lord, we are His servants. And everything else is meant to assist us in that. sarva-vidhi-nishedhastu etayorohimkaram smartha-vesatatam vishnu smartha-vinajatatam All rules, their purpose is to remember Krishna.
So, if we consider the Daksha Leela, the fourth canto of the Bhagavatam, where Daksha disrespected Shiva. He did not have a place for him and the offerings for him. And then he neglected Parvati also.
And seeing this disrespect of Shiva, the servants of Shiva got angry and they cursed. And then the Brahmanas counter-cursed. And the whole thing became a disaster.
So at this point, where did things go wrong? Where could things have been stopped? And Shiva was disrespected. We could say that it was his followers, it was their duty to protect the honour. Yes, so we say yes, it is their duty to protect the honour of their spiritual master.
But at the same time, we have to act in a way that makes things better. Not act in a way that makes things worse. So we have to act in a way that we can remember Krishna and we can help others to remember Krishna.
If the confrontation becomes just too aggravated and ugly, then nobody is remembering Krishna at that time. So, it is also the principle. On one side you say that we shouldn’t forgive and offence to devotees.
But there is also, Chaitanya Bhagwat says that if there are two Vaishnavas who are in conflict, don’t take sides in that. Yes, same statement. Especially that two advanced devotees have differences.
Now again, is that absolute principle? One devotee might be operating on a partial understanding and then we are criticising some other devotee. Then if we are in a position, we may have to clarify. So I would say these principles, they are important, they indicate the gravity of the situation that don’t get caught in sectarian battles with devotees.
Don’t take criticism of a devotee lightly. But the literal enactment of that, rather than taking that as a literal principle which you have to enact every time, we see that these are indicative of how grave they are. And what specifically we do, we see that based on the broad principles of Krishna Bhakti.
Of what is anukul for our bhakti, what is anukul for other’s bhakti. Yes, nowadays with internet available, anybody can just criticise anyone. Just press one email and it can go to hundreds, thousands of people.
So what can we do at that time? We have to see what is anukul for our bhakti and what is anukul for other’s bhakti. So with respect to forgiving or not forgiving offences to others, we have to see what is our service, what is our seva. Is it say, for example, if I am in a position of being a protector of that devotee, do I have that adhikar? If I don’t have that adhikar, then it is becoming something like a self-appointed service.
Then it can unnecessarily lead to complications. So if we can clarify, generally speaking, when there is criticism, there are three broad things we can do. One is talk with that devotee directly and try to address that.
Second is we talk with others who are affected if that devotee is not ready to understand. You talk with others who are affected and help them get a proper understanding. Or third is we just neglect it.
There are three broad options. So now which option is best for our service to Krishna, we will have to see. Sometimes some devotees are completely fixed about their opinions.
They are just not willing to change. So talking with them is of no use. And sometimes we may decide, okay, let me talk with others because they are affected by it.
But sometimes it may be that by talking about some criticism we give it more attention. And in one of my services was communications. So they say that we get some negative press if somebody criticises us in newspapers.
If we try to refute that, sometimes that refutation increases the attention also. So we have to be very careful what we do at that time. So there is no one simple principle that we can apply at all times.
Using our God-given intelligence we have to find out what will help best to resolve this issue. What will help to minimise attention. Whether it will be confronting that devotee itself, whether it will be clarifying others, or whether we just be neglecting and moving on with life.
In most situations in today’s world, it is just moving on with life. That’s what is required. Yes, who was next? You mentioned that if we are not in devotional mood and we forget the spiritual world, then we are going to be out of place.
But there are instances of special mercy of Krishna, like for example, putting love into spiritual world. And I heard Aghasura also went to spiritual world because he had affection for his sister Putana. So what happens then? So if we say Putana and Aghasura, how did they go to the spiritual world? When they did not have devotion actually? Well, they did not have devotion, but they had some devotional action or devotional intention.
Putana, she offered her milk to Krishna. It was malevolently, but the act itself was like a nurse. Aghasura, he offered his body as a playground to Krishna’s friends.
So Krishna saw that. In the Vishnu Sahasranam, it is said that there are two names of Vishnu. Guru, Guru Tamo, Dhama, Nimisho, Animisho, Nimisho, Swagri, Vachaspati Rudharathi.
So Nimisho means one who blinks his eyes. Animisho means one who never blinks his eyes. So there are two contradictory names.
Baldevidya Vishnu has written a commentary on the Vishnu Sahasranam. And there he says that what does it mean? He says when a devotee tries to sincerely serve Krishna, the devotee commits a mistake and Krishna blinks his eyes and overlooks the mistake. And on the other hand, if a devotee does even a small service to Krishna, Krishna unblinkingly notes that service and rewards that service.
So in this case, Krishna noted the small incidental service that Putana and Agasya did. That’s how they attained Krishna. So it’s so much to hear.
Now how do we stay focused and not get just overloaded? See broadly, there are two aspects. One is that if there is something interesting, something stimulating, you would like to read that. And sometimes you may actually find something more stimulating also.
But at the same time, the other is that the mind is by nature restless. And if you just keep, OK, let me find someone new to hear. Then we will never hear in a sustained way.
So I would say that if whatever time we have, if we decide, say, OK, I have three hours, five hours in a week, ten hours in a week, whatever it is, some part of a time, we focus for systematic study. So it may be one book I take and read that book. Or one devotee I take and not just hear different classes.
Or if I want to develop a relationship with that Vaishnava, a spiritual master or a spiritual mentor, I may hear them. Or it’s better that I take one, if they have spoken on one topic, I take that and hear that. Bhagavad Gita they have spoken systematically.
Or they have spoken on some other book. So some time of our hearing or reading, we keep for systematic reading and hearing. And some time we can keep for inspirational.
So the exact percentage we can vary based on time, place and circumstance. Sometimes we may find that in the inspirational, we may find something which is very good and then we may make that systematic in future. That’s OK.
But if all our hearing is only inspirational, then what happens is sometimes we may not get inspiration also and we just go at the level of the mind. I hear this lecture, it’s boring, let me go to someone else. Then we don’t connect with Krishna.
So we have to have a service attitude where the purpose of hearing is not just to get intellectual stimulation or even intellectual comprehension. The purpose of hearing or reading is also to serve Krishna with our intelligence. So we of course want understanding and we will get understanding also.
But at one level, it’s just we are serving Krishna with our intelligence. The Bhagavad Gita Krishna says in 18.70 that those who study this conversation of ours, they are worshipping me with their intelligence. So like we may do puja with a lamp, we can do puja with our intelligence also.
So we want to have that service attitude. That’s why some systematic hearing, even if it doesn’t seem to be so stimulating, we can decide a finite time. OK, I want to read Bhagavatam’s first canto now.
So then in the next, if I read every day 10 pages, in the next 3 months I’ll complete the canto. So then I may not be able to read exactly 10 pages every day. Some days I may reach 20, some days I may not be able to read anything.
But at least I have that direction. That is my systematic study. Along with that I have some time for inspirational reading, inspirational hearing also.
That way we can balance both. Thank you. Yes.
Ask him. So I’ve been giving to Bhagavat Sahaja Maharaj, so one of the lectures he was mentioning about the material world, itself being an illusion. So there is a big context in the discourse I was reading there.
So Maharaj was mentioning something like we have dreams. We know it’s not true. The next day we get up, we know it’s not true, and we dream again.
But again and again we are seeing something happening. So why do I, if that is not true, this also will not be true. Why do you think this is true but that is not true? So this and actually… I have another follow-up, and actually Srila Prabhupada also in one of his rooms, he has spoken about this.
So Prabhupada comes up to the point that so that’s okay, this is not true, but the thing is this opportunity to serve Krishna, that will get away with this. So don’t miss that. So other things cannot be said, but the opportunity that is true, that is something we cannot miss.
I wanted to ask you, because again, this, the way the whole thing, explanation is like, it goes all the way from the Mayavadi philosophy, to the Upanishads. So is the material world real? If it is like a dream, then isn’t it unreal? Or how do we exactly see it? Actually Baldevdaya Bhushan, in his Govinda Bhashya commentary on Vedanta Sutra, turns this whole thing around. And he says, because our waking state is like the dream state, therefore even dreams are real.
And he gives reasons, he says, why are dreams real? He says that sometimes in the dreams, the Lord also appears. So the supreme reality is appearing, how can the dream be illusion? And then he also says that in dreams, different people have different kinds of dreams. In some of our dreams, we are just spectators.
In some of our dreams, we are participants. But in none of our dreams, we are the controllers. Sometimes we say, it was like a dream.
But actually, even in a dream, everything doesn’t happen according to our will. So he says, why do different people get different dreams? Some people, I knew one devotee, he is afraid of sleeping. Because as soon as he sleeps, he gets nightmares.
You know, some people get bad dreams. Some people wish each other happy dreams. It’s not the sentiment.
People who get bad dreams, it’s a problem. So he explains over there, that the same Ishwara, who is the controller of the waking world, is also the controller of the dreaming world. And that Ishwara uses the dream world to give us reactions to our minor karmas.
So if I get nightmares, that is a reaction to my own karma. Some people get good dreams. Some people get dreams, they don’t even remember it.
So it doesn’t matter. Some people get bad dreams. That’s a reaction to karma.
Just as we get bad situations in waking life, similarly, we get bad situations in the dream also. So in that sense, he says, even the dreams are real. So now, this world is also real.
Waking level is also real. Dream level is also real. Now, this is from a philosophical perspective.
Now, from another perspective, we can say that it’s all unreal. In what sense? In the sense that it’s all temporal. Prabhupada explains reality, I think in Science of Self-Realisation, in an essay he says, reality means that which is not vanquished by time.
That is the definition of reality he uses. And he, I think, quotes, ना सतो विद्देते भावो ना भावो विद्देते सताः 2.16 he says that, Bhagavad Gita is that, of the eternal there is no cessation, and of the temporary there is no endurance. So, in that sense, because this world is temporary, so, in that sense, it is unreal.
Now, the Mayavadi understanding is very different from the Vaishnava understanding. Even when we say this world is unreal, what we mean is it is temporary. The things here don’t have any enduring reality.
But right now, our actions have real consequences. And also, it is our actions here that will take us to reality. It is only when we become purified by the practise of bhakti, sadhana bhakti, in this world, that we will rise to the supreme reality.
So, he says the difference between the Swapna and the Jagruti state is that, in Swapna, we can use, in Jagruti, we can use our Sveksha to do sadhana. In Swapna, we can’t do that. In Swapna also we may see Krishna, but that is Krishna’s mercy.
We are not doing any sadhana over there. So, we get conscientious, by our efforts we get purified in the waking state. In the Mayavadi understanding, when they say this world is illusion, their idea is that not only is the world illusion, they say we also are illusion.
So, basically, right now, when I am looking at you, so, if I am the subject of consciousness, you are the object of consciousness. And in between is the stream of consciousness. So, our understanding is that what is the illusion? If I think that you are meant for my enjoyment, or the world is meant for, the object of consciousness is meant for my enjoyment, then that is illusion.
The object is real, the subject is also real, the stream of consciousness is also real. What is unreal is, the conception that the object is meant for the subject’s enjoyment. Rather, both the object and the subject are meant for Krishna’s service.
So, the Bhagavatam defines maya as, When we see anything disconnected from the Lord, that is maya. So, the object is not maya, it is our seeing it disconnected from the Lord, that is maya. So, for the subject to see the object as a source of enjoyment, that is maya.
But the mayavadi idea is that both the subject and the object are illusion. Only the stream of consciousness is the reality. So, our understanding is, pure consciousness means, consciousness that sees everything connected with Krishna.
Their understanding is, pure consciousness means, there is only consciousness. There is no subject, no object. But, that raises the question, if you get liberated, who gets liberated? Because the person who gets liberated itself is dissolved.
The subject is not there. So, there is no one to, there is no one to actually enjoy liberation. Sorry? Yeah, that’s a fundamental question.
If there is non-differentiate consciousness alone existing, then where did the subject-object duality come from at all? So, the philosophy has a lot of problems, but suffice it to say, our understanding, if we start taking this world too seriously, thinking that I will enjoy in this world, in that context we say, it’s temporary, don’t take it so seriously. It’s illusion. It’s illusion in the sense that, it has, it has, pursuing it independently, of the ultimate reality, is going to keep us in illusion.
But, it is not illusion in the sense that it doesn’t exist. It is illusion only in the sense that, getting obsessed with it, will keep us in illusion. But if you see it in connection with the supreme reality, then this world is the way we can go towards the supreme reality.
In fact, bhakti, redefine, the senses are normally seen as the pathways to bondage. But bhakti, redefine the senses, as pathways to liberation. Now, our eyes can bind us, the devotee’s prayer is that, not that I don’t want to see anything, I want to see the Lord’s form.
Our tongue, we can do gossip and bind us, but our tongue, by glorifying Krishna, we can get purified. So, bhakti is in that sense, it uses this world, to go attain reality. Okay? So, thank you very much.
Shri Prabhupada Ki, Jai! Gaur Bhakta Vrinda Ki, Jai! Very good. If you are interested, please let me know. You are all welcome to OEC tomorrow.
The question and answer session will also continue. Tomorrow’s topic is very nice. Parikshit, what is the topic tomorrow? Serve, serve, set, or suffer next.
7 to 8.30, tomorrow at 10.30,