Appreciating Radhanatha Maharajas holistic faithfulness to the Gaudiya tradition including to the flexibility of the tradition

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Hare Krishna. So today I'll speak broadly on three points and then we can have some questions. So overall the topic which is mentioned which I'll be discussing is appreciating, okay, understanding what faithfulness to tradition means and not just faithfulness but a holistic understanding of what faithfulness means and then based on that we'll talk about how even in a tradition there is some flexibility and then I'll move forward.

So I'll start with, I'll be talking three themes, a little more on journey home and our writing according to time, place, circumstance, then western outreach and how what there is a focus on yoga and I'll explain why there's focus on yoga and then I'll talk about Govardhanika village and then I'll talk about expanding the definitions of devotional success. So first I'll begin with a quote of Srila Prabhupada. Like last time I mentioned that there are, we often hear of Prabhupada being strongly and using strong words and we think that being faithful to Prabhupada means that but there is an entirely different aspect of Srila Prabhupada which has been to this large extent overlooked in our movement.

So this is a letter that Prabhupada wrote to Balwant Prabhu in 1972 and he says, now I want that we shall recruit more and more our men among the intelligent class of men. Now this was 1970s where men was a gender inclusive term, it's men and women at because they are a little educated or they have got some wealth or fame or ability so they will be sometimes little puffed up but that is all right they deserve it. Now we shall have to learn the art how to approach a higher class of men and attract them to apply themselves to this Krishna consciousness process of self-realization that requires much tact and we shall have to expect to meet all challenges by sharp minds but if you remain always absorbed in remembering Lord Chaitanya how he converted so many intelligent men even sitting for three days and nights to hear them speak without himself speaking anything and if you remember how Krishna was so much patient to explain everything to Arjuna even Arjuna was speaking like a fool in this way being always tolerant of others and appreciating their points of view it will be easy for us to convince them gradually to join us letter to Balwant December 13 1972.

This is such a profound letter and we could have a whole class on this but I'll speak highlight three points from this letter first thing Prabhupada says they deserve to be puffed up he's talking about people who are wealthy or famous or educated or successful so they are successful in by their by their definition of success and Prabhupada says we need to appreciate that Prabhupada is not here saying for example without Krishna everything is zero and whatever you achieved it's all nonsense no people have achieved certain things and there are certain definitions of success in society somebody is very well educated now we may say okay modern education Prabhupada said is a spiritual slaughterhouse well if we say that to a person who is very well educated actually it is we who are being spiritual slaughterers because whatever be the deficiencies of modern education it requires hard work it requires talent and somebody who has been successful in that they have certain ability certain diligence and we need to respect them for that so Prabhupada said they deserve to be puffed up Prabhupada is not saying say pride is a demonic quality there are the spiritually ignorant respect them for what they have achieved in their terms and then we need to learn learn the art of how to approach a higher class of men so Prabhupada is not saying you have to go and teach them you have to learn how to teach them that means we need to learn from our audience how they think just because we know what is right doesn't mean we know the right way to present it we need to talk with people not to them to them means or talk down to them you know I know the truth you are ignorant here I am to enlighten you no there has to be an exchange so we need to we need to learn from them how we can share spiritual wisdom with them so probably the onus is on us to learn the art and why is all this important because this is the background for understanding what it means to speak according to or to present the wisdom according to time place circumstance so it is now what is the time place circumstance who is going to teach us can we just observe and learn well we can to some extent but Prabhupada spent time in America in the early days at least trying to understand the way American way of life so our audience will teach in the process we need to learn the art of how to approach and lastly you could say from it's such a radical perspective Prabhupada said this is right this is wrong anybody who says anything wrong is a fool and a rascal that's the conception of Prabhupada we have had but Prabhupada is appreciating their point of view points of view now we may say this is wrong but I know what is right because I know what is scriptural teaching but Prabhupada is saying appreciate their point of view so don't just view their view we can't just judge their viewpoint from our perspective this person is a materialist this person is atheist this person is mayavadi this person is sahaja this person is a whatever it is sometimes our philosophy just becomes like a bag for us to pop out labels and fix dismissive labels on people so instead of judging their viewpoint but to understand why do they think the way they do if we actually want to connect with them rather than evaluating their thoughts we need to understand their thinking what is the way people are thinking why are they thinking in this way and how can I okay this is the way they think then how can I present to them the spiritual message in the way they think so Prabhupada also says in the first canto that realization means to present things in a way that is interesting to the audience so now what is interesting to the audience how will we know that and we could say humor and jokes and entertainment and that's one thing which interests but are we really giving spiritual stuff over there that might be a part of some presentation but within what we have to give how can we address how can we interest them that's the important question so this brings me to appreciating their point of view what does it mean so if you consider living today outreach according to time place circumstance what does it mean so here you will see a tradition is something which comes from the past and the contemporary world is like a disc below and the small at the center is the living tradition so the living tradition is connected to the past the tradition as it is in the past by fidelity fidelity that is faithfulness and the living tradition is connected to the contemporary world by flexibility and these two together enable a person and enable the tradition to stay living so fidelity keeps us connected with the past flexibility keeps us connected with the current situation now in every moment there are conservatives and liberals we could say broadly the conservatives are concerned with fidelity we need to stay faithful to the way things were done in the past and liberals are considered concerned with flexibility we need to make sure that whatever we want to teach is accessible to others so now if there is only fidelity without flexibility then what happens the tradition becomes like a museum piece there's no way we can actually reach out to people because we say if Prabhupada went to America and gave classes in Sanskrit or Bengali if he had not been flexible to speak in English he people would have treated him like a curiosity object or strange Swami has come from India but he would not have been much more than a museum exhibit on the other hand if there's only flexibility and no fidelity then what happens we just become a fashion trend we just become a part of the contemporary landscape the connection with the tradition is lost but when there is fidelity and flexibility both together that's where there's a living tradition that's where there is a living tradition so now if you consider the living tradition how does it work we see now as i said we could have generations 1960 was Prabhupada 1920 was around the time and Bhakti Santhak was preaching was at its peak 1890s was the time and Bhakti Santhak was preaching on the peak now of course they preach for several decades but i'm just taking one representative decade so now every Acharya has done things which are required for connecting with the people of their times so for example Bhaktivinod Thakur what did he do he did many radical things but one thing was he was the first person in our tradition to write novels now there are works of works of drama which are profusely written in our tradition but novel was not written in fact the genre of literature called novel which is so novel so common now it was not very common in the past and when from when western people came to india and they started colonizing india and indians started getting educated in the western way of and Bhaktivinod Thakur wrote novels like Jaiva Dharma like Prem Pradeep and in that way he used the genre of fiction to convey wisdom convey devotional wisdom now nobody had done it in the past why did he do it because that is the exhibition of flexibility the message was the same as in the past messages of Gaudiya Vaishnavism but he made a genre of literature which is flexibility flexibility in terms of he used a novel now if you go back further to the time of Chaitanya Charitamrita in the Chaitanya Charitamrita he said that a devotee should be a Kavi a devotee should be a poet now is it that all of us if we can't write poetry then we can't be devotees no what is the point over there now Kavi can mean a philosopher also but clearly in Chaitanya Charitamrita it is referring to poetry so the point is when Chaitanya Mahaprabhu and his followers were there in Bengal at that time Kavya and Natya poetry and drama were very popular very influential in Bengali culture and the devotees they learned they were expert in this genre of poetry and dramaturgy and they wrote dramas Jagannath Priya Natakam, Chaitanya Chandra Uday Natakam and so many other things like that they wrote poetry they wrote drama and they made the teachings of Gaudiya Vaishnavism accessible to people so now even now today dramas are useful but they're not that popular as they were so now so to understand what is the culture at a particular time and what is appealing to people at that time and to present the wisdom accordingly that is the intelligence of an Acharya now if you consider Bhakti Sahasranath Thakur he also did many things let's focus on this one thing this is theistic exhibitions now what were these theistic exhibitions there are huge exhibitions in which one part of it was directly spiritual and a large part of it was almost half or more of it was from a critical perspective it was mundane what was mundane he invited prominent educationists scientific researchers social developers to come and exhibit the latest developments in science and technology were exhibited over there now we may say what is the point of that so but Bhakti Sahasranath Thakur gave a profound example to illustrate that so he said suppose somebody for many generations has been going to bathe somebody's family many generations have been going to bathe in the Ganga they live near the Ganga and the Ganga is maybe half a kilometer away from them and they go to bathe there and this person learns okay I should go and bathe in the Ganga but then for us rivers are big powerful things and we think this is where the river is but if you look at the history of the world rivers change paths and sometimes entire civilizations can die or emerge just because of a river changing its path so if the Ganga changes its path and say the person was living here and the Ganga was here so the person's ancestors would go to bathe over there but now the Ganga is over flowing from here and if the person simply goes there again where the Ganga was earlier flowing and just goes and stands over there well there's no water over there is that person really bathing in the Ganga he says if you want to bathe in the Ganga you have to go where the Ganga is not simply go where your ancestors have gone so he gave this example in different contexts for different purposes in our context what it means is that we need to go where the Ganga is flowing if we want to share Krishna's message we need to go in the area where people are interested and present Krishna's message over there so like last time also talked about Niyamagraha sticking to the letter of the law without understanding the purpose of the law the letter of the law is okay go there and bathe but there's no water over there no Ganga over there what is the point of going there so Bhaktivedanta Thakur's mood was that these theistic exhibitions where yes people are attracted by science and technology let them come to see science and technology and then while it is there the devotees over there you know here there's a devotional exhibition also and he would also have attractive dioramas and they were impressive to see artistically at that time and people people who would never come directly to just see a religious exhibition or a religious festival they came for that what we could call secular exhibition and next to that was a religious or a devotional exhibition and they came for that also so this was something which is not done but Bhaktivedanta Thakur sensed the mood of the times and he said okay this is what you are attracted to material progress okay we'll have material progress and spiritual progress avenues being displayed side by side similarly physically Prabhupada now he did many things one of the extraordinary things he did was he started a Bhaktivedanta Institute that was meant for scientific outreach and in general for academic outreach for outreach to scholarly kind of people now science as a genre of knowledge itself was not there before 200 years now we could say science and the way of looking at things that's fine a systematic way of looking at things we could call that science but the word Newton never called himself a scientist he called himself a natural philosopher so it was in the late 18th early 19th century the word science was first used for those who are doing the work of natural philosophers so because that was not so relevant we don't see Jiv Goswami or Vishwanath Thakur directly talking about science per se now we could say that that they even Vedic spiritual knowledge is also science that's true but the specific terminology and the specific methodology of rational empirical based approach we don't see that so much because that's a particular way of looking at things so Prabhupada noticed that and Prabhupada said we'll have a special institute and Prabhupada actually wanted to spend a he he's invested a lot of money to have the first international conference on science and spirituality and there it was like scientists from all over the world were invited and they came and all that happened none of the scientists became devotees they just discussed whether the whether consciousness comes from matter or the consciousness comes from something else and Prabhupada said that if they just appreciate is Bhaktivan Institute is meant to increase the prestige of ISKCON so Prabhupada now Prabhupada did many other things also which which were new ways in which he ensured that that message of the tradition reached the contemporary world so now if we consider we are in 2020 now 20 21st century 2020 2010 2020 now what is required for today's world that is what you know the current teachers of the tradition think deeply and they so when I talked about being faithful to the tradition there are two aspects there is fidelity but the tradition itself has an aspect of flexibility so if somebody is only faithful to the fidelity aspect of the tradition I'll stay connected with the past that's good but a part of the tradition is staying connected with the present and that staying connected with the present requires flexibility so flexibility being flexible is not a compromise feeling flexible is an integral part of the tradition so it's very important when being flexible is not a compromise feeling flexible is an integral and essential part of the tradition and far from saying that being if somebody's flex well they are compromising we would say or they are deviating somebody who is not being flexible you know we could say that maybe they are not faithful to the complete whole of the tradition because the tradition includes flexibility so now what is happening in 2020 now this may seem a little bit long theoretical background but it is important to understand many of the things that are being done by Zolans Radhanath Maharaj for outreach in today's world so every epoch every age has its own ethos ethos is its prominent way of thinking so if you consider pre-modern times people's primary authority was scripture in India it was the Vedas in the west it was the Bible maybe in the middle east was the Quran people had faith in scripture then the modern times came and scripture was replaced by science and science became the authority of people now today what we live in is called a post-modern times although everyone uses the product of science technology but people don't necessarily think that science is the source of undiluted good for the world unadulterated good for the world so so in the post-modern times there is no no real people don't really accept scriptures authority people use science but they don't accept science as necessarily authority for knowing what is the ultimate good for us so then what what is the authority it is experience experience means if something works for you i'm interested in it tell me i would like to learn about it if something works for me i will do it so experience is what is considered a source of authority authenticity in today's world and this also leads to different ways of outreach now we could say broadly there are three different ways it's prescriptive do this don't do this like a doctor giving prescription eat this don't eat this normative is a more moral level this is right this is wrong now in the post-modern world neither prescriptive nor normative work very well why because people don't really accept authorities and there are there are huge books are written on say on reaching out to post-modern audience so for example a simple example to illustrate these three points say if if there is a church and they are doing counseling for marriage counseling for young couples or training them for a living married life and say a seasoned couple comes there and says they start giving a talk and they say that anybody who divorces will go to hell the immediate response of the post-modern audience is you go to hell don't care about you so getting divorced is wrong who says it is wrong but on the other hand the same couple says you know we have been married together happily for the last 30 years and we would like to share how we did it yes we want to know that's descriptive approach so descriptive approach connects with people very easily if we want to tell if somebody asks us why don't you eat meat now if you tell them you shouldn't eat meat is who are you tell me that if you say meat eating is brutal it is all killing of animals it is only a heartless person will do that what you are judging me they just turn off but instead you say i don't know actually when i came to know uh how much violence happens in the in the production of meat i felt that i don't want to be a part of it that's why i don't eat meat so we are not threatening them we are not compromising our truth we're just presenting it differently so journey home is that kind of descriptive way of outreach so the way people think has changed substantially in the last even from the time insular Prabhupada was there so to understand how people think and then to see how to present accordingly that is the expertise of contemporary teachers and it's not only ranath maharaj is doing this there are many other of our leaders also who are trying in different ways devamath maharaj has been quite successful in his own ways in new zealand shivaram maharaj is doing in in europe and then there are devotees south america who are quite successful there are different devotees who are trying different things and they're being resourceful in their own ways to do things in russia there are devotees who in who many devotees use ayurveda and other things like that to attract people and then they bring people further closer to krishna and they do it in america also but basically take people who are interested in material health and bring them to spiritual health so the idea is flexibility that's integral for what is required for our tradition so now okay sorry so as i said few things convince people as much as personal testimony in today's world in the post-modern ethos and this is not non-conventional this is now narada muni himself tells his autobiography we could say to ask them how i came to krishna consciousness he teaches the teaches the principles of bhakti and then he teaches his own example that's chapters four five and six of the first canto so and i'm one of the editors for back to godhead and back to god one of the most popular columns is how i came how i can hic we call it how i came to krishna consciousness because people are interested in people people are much more interested in people than they are in concepts so if those concepts are demonstrated through people's lives people can connect with them very easily and that is a part of the tradition that's why the puranas and are far more widely read than the upanishads because the upanishads are about concepts the puranas and the itihasas are about people people living and embodying those concepts to that journey home now we'll talk about a couple of things more so now one thing i talked about is the post-modern ethos so appreciate their points of view this is i'm the whole talk is building on that point proposes appreciate their points of view so what does it mean understand where people are at why they think like that and then present accordingly we learn the art of how to present to them so the autobiographical experiential way of presenting is appreciating their point of view and then presenting apart from that we may say that the world is becoming more materialistic kaliyuga is becoming worse that is true but the same time there are some areas in which consciousness is rising so you could say some indicators indications of the rise of sattva in the western world and there are broadly four so yoga mindfulness veganism and environmentalism and each of them is making people explore something more than immediate gratification something beyond say environmentalism means we are not just meant to dominate the planet enjoy it veganism means people are conscious that we are killing animals you don't want to a lot of people are having mental problems but rather than simply popping pills to deal with mental problems is there something understanding oneself better can we do that now yoga is of course very big now all of these are broadly opportunities for us to present krishna krishna krishna wisdom through it so veganism you know we have cooking classes environmentalism the many devotees are doing in hungary we have a farm now here go go over the ecology has something mindfulness there are devotees we're not really done much in it buddhism has taken that up but there's a lot of scope to tap mindfulness and yoga is very big so when i was talking with radhanath maharaj in chicago once so he mentioned to me that yoga today is exactly like counter culture was during prabhupada's times so prabhupada sometimes would use negative words in a positive context so for example prabhupada would say that a devotee is an opportunist now opportunist means i'm not even say opportunist means it's a negative thing just grabbing an opportunity but probably would say that wherever there's an opportunity for serving krishna devotee grabs that so prabhupada when he went to america now he was staying with the like a respectable middle class people uh initially in butler and then he came to this upstate uh he came to new york in the heart of new york where yoga mishra yoga studio was there but their people were not really spiritually interested they were more interested in health at that time but then prabhupada saw that the hippies in the counter culture they are more spiritually interested so prabhupada went there in fact if somebody made a movie of prabhupada's life of a person who had never even drunk tea or coffee in his life a person who had never broken a single regulatory principle that person going and living among people whose only regulatory principle was to break all the regulatory principles you couldn't imagine a movie like that but prabhupada did that so now if you consider what did prabhupada see in the counter culture he said that they had appreciation they were interested in spirituality and especially they were appreciative of indian spirituality eastern spirituality many of the hippies they had fascination with india some of some some proposal disciples they were hippies but they had already been to india now yoga also people are appreciating eastern spirituality they experience some health benefits because of yoga and then they say what is this some of them at least become open to what is this all about what is this a higher tradition about now both in the counter culture they were seeking something beyond the ordinary now in that case they were considering oh the ordinary way of life living is not so you know the education culture the politics it all is hypocritical now in yoga people may not be that against the mainstream but still they are in one sense looking for something beyond the mainstream something alternative they just don't want to again put pills in their body to become healthier they want a more holistic more natural way to become healthier now there is a flip side of it that in the counter culture people were deeply into drugs now in the yoga you can see people are deep in bodily consciousness but at the very least even in bodily consciousness people are ready to be a part of part of follow some disciplines regulate themselves for some time and we could say counter culture and taking drugs it is not really it's very difficult to conceive of it in any way as a part of vedic culture somebody could make a stretch and say that yes in indian culture also naga the some of shiva worshippers they take charas and that's something similar to taking lsd or the other drugs so we it is like at the fringes or borders of vedic culture or vedic wisdom but yoga is much more central to vedic wisdom so just as prabhupada used the counter culture today we can use yoga and yogis are receptive to spirituality you may say they are in bodily consciousness well yes but who isn't in bodily consciousness in today's world if you want people who are not in consciousness you know we will hardly find anyone like that but what is the opportunity that we on yoga use people's bodily consciousness to take them beyond bodily consciousness that if devotees teach yoga and through that they teach them yoga wisdom and they teach them now patanjali yoga sutra is often been interpreted as impersonalistic but if you look at the actual sutras and we look at the traditional commentaries there is a there is a reasonable ground for saying that it is theistic it is devotional and bhagavad-gita is quite devotional bhagavad-gita is also considered a standard yoga book so it's a opportunity right there for us and now if we don't tap it somebody else will tap it now we could take some statements of prabhupada but say that you know we are we have no interest in yoga now that is not the only thing that prabhupada said in south america the devotees said people are interested in yoga over here and we said that's good you know let them tell them what is ultimate yoga one of prabhupada's books name was perfection of yoga so this prabhupada did speak negatively about yoga at times if yoga was only about bodily consciousness but if from bodily consciousness one can come to spiritual consciousness then why not it's an opportunity very much there and if as i said if you don't tap it somebody else will and unfortunately that has already happened in many ways prabhupada was the first person to really introduce kirtan big time in the west now many other spiritual teachers went from india and they sometimes compose some songs sang some songs but they never they were not bhakti teachers and they didn't do kirtan the way prabhupada did and now if you see in the western world kirtan has become quite big and although within our movement we have many good kirtaniers some very well-known kirtaniers but if you look at the mainstream kirtan circle you know is gone which started it is nowhere there because we somehow we various reasons i won't go into that but we just didn't explore that opportunity sufficiently there has to be certain amount of flexibility broadness maybe do certain things to reach out to a broader number of people if you don't do that then where there's a portion somebody else will take it so they may use what is a part of our culture to to spread something just different from our culture so the opportunity when it is there it has to be tapped and so now along with the bhakti center and there are other places where yoga outreach that super soul farm where the yoga outreach is happening through different devotees and they come to go over the neko village and here they get exposed to the yoga but they also get exposed to bhakti yoga and so many people who would otherwise never turn toward bhakti are actually very very receptive to bhakti and they are coming closer and closer so through yoga to bhakti is probably the biggest channel we have for reaching out to western people and then that brings me to the last part of what i'll talk about is that when we started our movement there were some some definitions of success that Prabhupada used he talked about three things how many books are distributed how many temples were built and how many devotees were made and these are very important definitions of success and if we consider the Radha Gopinath temple you know they and the books distributed are significant then the large number of devotees are being made we see thousands and thousands of devotees coming to the yatras which is when Sadhana Maharaj takes to Mayapur and Vrindavan and the holy places as far as temples being built from Mumbai devotees are preached in all parts of Maharashtra and now devotees are going across the world but that so according to the conventional definitions of success also there has been a significant amount of success however at the same time Prabhupada also till 1970 almost in the early 1970s he said that now it is time to boil the milk now what does boiling the milk mean if we are boiling the milk what would be the definition of success at that time would we have the same definition of success that how many books distributed how many temples built how many devotees made no if you want to take people closer to Krishna deeper in their spiritual lives then we need different definitions of success so as a movement itself we have diversified for example now we have bhakti shastri courses educational institutes and now if devotees get bhakti shastri degrees is that not a step forward in their spiritual life it is but where would it fall in these three definitions of success well it's not just after books are distributed books are to be read and understood so we need to expand our definitions of success based on what is required so for example now let's take Prabhupada's starting the Bhakti Vyasa Institute now Prabhupada has said he's put a lot of effort in the last years he was spent time with Bhakti Sarodana Maharaj who was his prime scientist disciple and now if you see it would not fall any of this Bhakti Vyasa Institute may not make devotees it may not distribute books directly it may not build temples and the point was Prabhupada emphasized certain definitions but Prabhupada also was open to and also emphasize other aspects of bhakti also other definitions of success also so now Prabhupada said that the Bhakti Vyasa Institute is like is meant to increase the prestige of ISKCON so if scientists come and appreciate then that can open the doors for a lot more people to at least start thinking about okay maybe this devotees, Hare Krishna stuff is not just religious hocus-pocus it is not just sentimental and maybe there's some substance here so in some ways Govardhanikovillage is doing what the Bhakti Vyasa Institute is doing it is enhanced even if it is doing even if we're doing nothing else it is enhancing the prestige of ISKCON now we the Govardhanikovillage has done dozens and dozens of awards and international awards in fact at one time the award that we won was so rare that the Govardhanikovillage that that's the time when the Indian government took notice of us the Maharashtra government in government what is the Govardhanikovillage you know we don't know about it but the world knows about it and they are they are awarding this village so the kind of achievements in terms of good PR that has been done that is remarkable now these are actually you could say in some ways three things about this this is my concluding point that it is attracts people who won't come to a temple I mentioned this point yesterday last time also but it's a whole demographic of people who would not who not be religiously inclined but still they are open to something like this so do we not want to if we are compassionate should we not try to reach out to those people also or is our car just like Lord Jagannath comes out of the temple to give his darshan to people who don't come to the temple so similarly that means Lord Jagannath is also wanting to give his compassion to those who are not ready to come to the traditional channels of receiving compassion so people who don't come to temples people who may not take books when you distribute them on the streets but if they come to eco village they meet devotees they see the temple they have a cultural experience we are reaching a whole group of people who would not be reached otherwise it's a futuristic project we know that when Shila Prabhupada started the temple it was in a remote part of Mumbai today that is the prime estate of Mumbai but the devotees thought this is so far away and who is going to come here there's no point in having a temple and the devotees actually cancelled the land deal with Mr. N. Prabhupada was furious and Prabhupada actually had to exert himself to try to get the land back so the devotees now they were very dedicated but this didn't have the vision that Prabhupada had same way with Mayapur when Prabhupada got the land Prabhupada came and he put his walking stick the ground he said this will be our international headquarters and the devotees with him looked around and they said as far as they could see they couldn't see a single human being they just overgrown sugarcane fields this international headquarters couldn't make sense of it but Prabhupada had the vision so now we may feel that actually speaking you know so much money is being spent on the go to the Nico village so much effort is going in what is the result well if we had asked the amount of money which was spent on Mayapur maybe I'm with 30 40 years ago and what are the result well at that time in any venture the initial any big project the results don't come immediately they take time so it's a futuristic project which will attract people and then they have their abundant opportunity for spiritual experiences and what may not be known is that from the over the Nico village there are hundreds and hundreds of program that are happening and hundreds of and even thousands of people are becoming devotees in the nearby villages there are very active social development have initiatives happening there are very active spiritual outreach happening in fact the the rural devotees from here go to their own yatras and sometimes they have several thousand people going for yatras that yatra is different from an armada yatra so there is direct spiritual outreach also is happening which may not be visible for us but the overall point is it's an expanded definition of success and in this way so the whole theme of today's talk was that we appreciate others points of view that means we appreciate what the mood what the conceptions what the ethos of people in today's world is and then we present Krishna bhakti accordingly so that is what his own son of Maharaj is doing and that is what as a faithful follower of Shila Prabhupada he is taking the mantle of doing that so that special purpose mission remains not only vibrant but spreads further and further to domains where it would otherwise not reach so I'll summarize and then we can take a few questions so I talked about three main points today but one one theme with three applications our theme one theme was we talked about the Prabhupada quote three things within that if people are puffed up they deserve it if they're successful in their lives then we need to learn how to present how to present Krishna conscious to them and we should appreciate their point of view and tolerate them so now so what does that mean in terms of today's application so we talked about every tradition has flexibility and fidelity fidelity keeps it connected with the past flexibility with the current so Bhaktivinoda Thakur was flexible in terms of he was the first person to write a novel in our tradition. Bhaktivinoda Thakur was flexible, he started this theistic exhibition. Prabhupada was flexible, he started the Bhaktivinoda Thakur Institute.

So Radhanath Maharaj is flexible and what is this flexibility I talked about the postmodern ethos where people don't really consider scripture or science as authority but they consider personal experience as authority so normative or prescriptive outreach doesn't work descriptive works so journey home is exactly like that reaching out to those people then what are people's interests people want to improve their health in holistic without the medically intrusive ways so yoga is their approach so tap that opportunity of yoga use people's bodily consciousness raise them about bodily consciousness I talked about sattva arising in four ways yoga mindfulness veganism environmentalism and all of them can be tapped up and then lastly I talked about you know so the Govardhanika village is like the Bhaktivinoda Thakur Institute if we expand the definitions of success what does that mean that means not just books distributed temples built devotees made it that's important but Bhaktivinoda Thakur Institute was meant to increase the prestige of ISKCON so that people mind will open and they will appreciate more and more so similarly Govardhanika village simply by winning so many awards has brought so much prestige for our movement and then beyond that also we talked about how it's a futuristic project and like Mayapur and Juhu were for the devotees they couldn't appreciate it and lastly I talked about how if we understand the long-term vision then we can appreciate how whatever is being done is actually meant to carry forward Prabhupada's mission and carry it to people who would not normally be reached by that mission thank you very much Hare Krishna thank you very much for bringing this beautiful point so now you have some questions or did you send to Prabhu some questions you can Prabhu would you like to read or should I read it for you Prabhu I can read them out yes I'll do that yes okay thank you so there are some questions which came earlier on the earlier to us and I'll answer also and the questions are here also so now when we see differences among seven we see differences among senior disciples of Srila Prabhupada who are who are also Maharaj Maharaj is a dedicated follower of Srila Prabhupada exalted devotee then that some of the devotees criticizing him are also exalted so can we see this as transcendental differences say in the spiritual world there is a differences between their differences Radharani and Chandravali and both of their differences are for pleasing Krishna so this they just have a different vision of how to serve Krishna can you see it this way yes that's a very healthy way of looking at it and it's a very devotional is sweet way of looking at it also both are concerned about pleasing Krishna they just have a different mood of how to please Krishna having said that we have to be careful about how things are actually manifesting in real life that means if somebody speaking something which is damaging our faith disturbing our mind and maybe even destroying our devotion then it is our responsibility to protect it so yes we can keep a distance and keep a respectful distance if it's we are already disturbed then ask some senior devotees to clarify to get some clarification so we don't have to we don't have to make it a campaign to to get into conflicts where we don't need to so it's best to see that yes there are differences at a higher level and those differences will be resolved at that level and if we keep practicing bhakti and we can move ahead in our spiritual life this has been there these differences are not new if we see after Chaitanya Mahaprabhu departed there was there was like a almost like a seismic quake like an earthquake at the heart of Gaudiya Vaishnavism because Gaudiya Vaishnavism almost fractured into two groups the group of Nithyananda Prabhu and the group of Advaita Acharya. Now Nithyananda Prabhu and Advaita Acharya had a had a unusual relationship they would seem to quarrel with each other and it was sweet and transcendental but somehow some of their followers thought that actually they have real differences and because of that what happened was that Nithyananda Prabhu's followers some of them said that Nithyananda Prabhu is the real successor and some of the followers said that actually Advaita Acharya is a real successor. In fact, Advaita Acharya's own son became a campaigner for heresy that because it was Advaita Acharya's call that God Chaitanya Mahaprabhu descend so therefore Advaita Acharya is more faithful than Chaitanya Mahaprabhu and therefore he should be the successor of Chaitanya Mahaprabhu.

Advaita Acharya and Nithyananda Prabhu had their own relationship but the unnecessary things started becoming very tense and very somewhat bitter. That's why we have in Chaitanya Bhagwat strong statements if two devotees are having conflicts don't take sides just pursue your especially two senior devotees are having conflicts don't take side just pursue your bhakti. Now of course if somebody is directly damaging our faith then we need to do what it takes to protect our faith but don't make it into issue for campaigning and escalating the conflict.

So I think now so Maharaj accepts disciples however they're practicing Krishna consciousness and but we may sometimes need strong doses for growing spiritually and that's why some of Maharaj's earlier classes which were somewhat stronger now he's a little softer so how do we avoid becoming lazy and complacent and stay enthusiastic. If Maharaj is happy with the level we are practicing well that's an interesting question. There are two different things over here.

One is accepting and the other is expecting. Prabhupada was asked do you love all your disciples equally and Prabhupada said yes and then he added but if you come forward but if somebody comes forward to take responsibility I reciprocate. That means that yes Prabhupada loves all his disciples equally but he has carrying the whole mission of Lord Chaitanya, mission of Lord Krishna.

It's like a huge burden if somebody comes forward in assisting then Prabhupada is very pleased. Prabhupada at one time said that if anybody is a member of ISKCON I'm never displeased with any member of ISKCON. I'm happy that you are at least being a part of the Krishna conscious movement but then Prabhupada would be happier if somebody's active member is serving and assisting in the mission.

So same way there so Maharaj is very accepting of everyone whatever level we are he's happy with that but he has a deep desire to carry on Prabhupada's mission and spread far and wide. So naturally he would be delighted if we become more dedicated, we become more pure-hearted, we become more vigorous in our outreach. So he may or may not articulate his expectation to us but naturally it's the expectation is that we all grow in our spiritual life.

So we need to rather than simply focus on the tone of the lectures we can look at Maharaj's own example. Like I said last time, why does Maharaj in his in his 60s, 70s now have to start doing western outreach or work on western outreach. He could just happily be in India, give classes, be appreciated and have many more hundreds and thousands of disciples more.

He's not doing that because he's taking that, he's doing that sacrifice for carrying forward the Prabhupada's mission. So if we want inspiration, we needn't just look at Maharaj's classes. Yes, they are soft but there is, if you look at it, his example, he is doing a lot of outreach and if you look, if we talk with some of his dedicated disciples, we'll find that he expects a lot from them.

So if somebody wants to come close to him and be like, become a trustworthy assistant, the prize is high. The prize is high. Gaurang Prabhupada always speaks that normally if people get associated with the spiritual master, for a few minutes also they are happy.

But he says, if Maharaj gives me a call, sometimes my anxiety increases. What does Maharaj want from me? At one time I was, as I mentioned, I was editing the journey within book and then, so Maharaj had emailed me the book and I had gone through it and then I came to Mumbai for a weekend class from Pune and then, so I had written back an email and I had suggested certain things, some certain things which could be, could be changed in some ways. So I met Maharaj after his Sunday class.

Maharaj says, are you staying here for some time? I said, if you want, I'll be happy to stay Maharaj. Yes, you know, yes, we can work on that book. So then we worked for a few days on the book and then it was, I think, Wednesday or something like that.

I'd come on Sunday. So I worked for quite several hours and several days and Wednesday evening Maharaj told me at around seven o'clock that, okay, so tomorrow morning I'm sending the book to the publisher. Can you do one, one last proofreading of the whole book? Now it was like 300 page book and it was already seven o'clock at night.

So I said, okay Maharaj, I'll do it. That whole night I was awake and I was doing proofreading and then, you know, previous days also had been quite tight. So I just, I, I fell asleep while I was proofreading and I smashed my head on the computer and my computer screen cracked and then, and then I finally completed and Maharaj was quite happy with it.

Then I told Gaurang Prabhu about this and what had happened. Gaurang Prabhu said, for me, last 10 years have been like this. So if we really want to, sir, and it's not, Gaurang Prabhu is working very closely with Maharaj.

But if you look at many other disciples of Maharaj, Adheshyam Prabhu is working very hard. They may not be directly working with Maharaj, but he has a tremendous preaching spirit. You see other senior disciples, they may not be involved in projects, but the way they extend themselves to spend time with people, to counsel them, to guide them, to encourage them.

So everybody is extending themselves according to their capacity, those who want to be dedicated to Maharaj. So we, rather than focusing only on the, on the tone in the classes, we can look at the living examples and take inspiration from there. So, okay, there's one.

So in New Vrindavan, Maharaj surrendered to authority beyond limitations of health and ego. Now Maharaj expects us to cooperate with authority but not to surrender. Please explain.

Well, I don't know whether Maharaj specifically said that devotees should not surrender. But what I would say is, yeah, it was not that not surrender, but that level of surrender is not necessarily required at present. When Maharaj has asked at one time, is he planning to write a book about his experiences in the Krishna consciousness movement? So Maharaj said that, if I write a book like that, people who came after reading the first book will go away after reading the second book.

It is an extraordinary phase and in many ways, the demands on the body and the mind were extreme. So, in some ways, that was a time of great explosion of the movement, as I have written a book called the Hare Krishna Explosion. So, Prabhupada in many ways, channeled the Rajoguna of his young disciples and he triggered the adventurer within them.

Prabhupada would sometimes have a globe in his room and he would tell his disciples, all of you pick one one country and go and deliver that country. Jiddu Rani Vajpati was one of the young disciples of Sri Prabhupada at that time. He said, Prabhupada, what about us girls? And Prabhupada said, we are all souls.

We are not boys or girls. You also pick one country and go and deliver it. So, Prabhupada, he fired the imagination of his disciples with the spirit of adventure for serving Krishna.

And so, we could say the Rajas was used in Krishna's service. So, now as a movement, we are trying to come more towards Sattva Guna so that we can be more sustainable. So, the beginning of a movement is in, beginning of anything is in the mode of passion.

That's creation. But sustenance requires goodness. So, we want to practice in a way that is sustainable.

Many of Srila Prabhupada's disciples often have severe health problems now. And I have talked with many of them and they said that if we had taken a little more care of our health when we were young, we would have been able to do so much more for Krishna now. So, yes, we also need to surrender.

In fact, just chanting Hare Krishna every day requires surrender. Practicing the principles of Bhakti requires surrender. But we could say there are degrees of surrender and we may not be expected to surrender at that level of degree, at that level as it was at that time.

That's because we want to do it in the long run. We want to continue. We know that Srila Prabhupada's times, the movement spread very rapidly.

But it also was not sustainable. After Prabhupada departed, we never had very extensive statistics of everything. But according to some statistics, 90% of Prabhupada's disciples couldn't continue their Bhakti after Prabhupada left.

In the next decade or so they left. Many of them, of course, continued practicing something and many of them have came back to varying degrees to Krishna lotus feet. But it was not sustainable.

So, you want to practice Bhakti in a way that is intense but that is also sustainable. So, that's what is being recommended when it says don't be that, we don't have, we have to surrender but not to that degree which is not sustainable. So, sometimes in Western outreach, we don't get much success.

If we had been in India and if we do outreach program and lots of people come in the West, not many people come. So, how to avoid becoming discouraged and if you have to do alone everything, it also becomes a disheartening. So, yes, it's a challenge.

That's why it's good to have some kind of virtual networking at least with other devotees who are doing Western outreach. Otherwise, it can be like a solitary toil. It can become exhausting, as you rightly said.

So, try to find out other devotees who are involved in similar outreach. Try to learn from their experiences, share your experiences and try to get strength from that. So, sometimes we may have to re-conceptualize our definitions of success.

So, we see that Bhakti Sansthaka, at one time Prabhupada was asked that Bhakti Sansthaka preached in Bengal, Bhakti Sansthaka preached in India and you preached all over the world. Therefore, you are greater than all of them. Prabhupada said, don't never think like this.

It is by their blessings that I've been able to do what I've been able to do. So, that was Prabhupada's humility. But also the reality is that when Prabhupada came to America, there was a certain amount of receptivity.

It was not like a ready-made audience. Prabhupada had to break through various levels of resistance, but at least they were interested. During Bhakti Sansthaka's time, India was in constant political turmoil because of the struggle for independence and Bhakti Sansthaka convinced Prabhupada to rise above the independent struggle and focus on Bhakti.

But so many other people were just caught in that struggle at that time. They were completely captivated by that and within that environment what Bhakti Sansthaka's Gaudiya Mata was able to achieve is remarkable. It might not have been as extensive as what Prabhupada achieved.

So, in that context, it's remarkable. So, that means that we have to see, we have to, we cannot apply the standard of definition of success from one age to another age because each age has its own challenges. So, just as we cannot compare in a literal sense the level of success of Bhakti Nathakur and Bhakti Nathakur and Shri Prabhupada, they were in different ages with different challenges.

Similarly, we cannot compare the level of, we literally can't compare success in India with success in America or success in Europe, anywhere else. To give an example, suppose two people are dancing. So, suppose one person is dancing on a dance floor which is very smooth and very conducive for dancing.

Another person is dancing on a dance floor which is littered with oil and glass, broken glass. They're slipping and bleeding and if they continue to dance, even dancing here for five minutes actually might be a more laudable achievement than dancing on that smooth, that comfortable floor for 15 minutes, half an hour. So, or if you want to take a sports metaphor like cricket, some pitches are made for batting.

So, somebody might score a double century on a batsman's paradise and some pitches are like batsman's graveyards. Somebody even scores a half century over there, that might actually be a greater batting achievement than double century on a batsman's paradise. So, even to make one person connected with Krishna in the western world is actually far more laudable or it requires far more effort and I won't say it's more laudable, but it is a significant achievement because the pitch on which you are batting is much, much tougher.

In India, actually when we are preaching, we don't have to really create faith in people. All that we have to do is people have their innate piety and we just need to remove the intellectual doubts that stop them from acting on their piety. But in the western world, if people have that innate piety, they will go toward the religion of their birth, whether Christianity or Judaism or whatever it is.

Actually, for them, if we want to reach out to western people, we have to create faith in them. So, it's a much tougher challenge and that's why we need to know that if we are doing that, we are pleasing our tradition, we are pleasing Srila Prabhupada, we are pleasing our spiritual master. Maharaj told me several times that where there is a need, there is greater mercy available.

So, he gives the example, somebody is in a war field and they are wounded and they need one glass of water. You give them a glass of water and somebody is at home and they simply, can you please give me a glass of water, give me a glass of water. It's the same act, but it's a very different act.

So, we need to see beyond the comparative definitions of success to the overall context in which we are reaching out and appreciate the value of what we have the opportunity to do. So, both network with others and also understand it's a different field. So, we appreciate accordingly the challenges and even if the progress is slow, it is laudable whatever progress is made over there.

Good question. So, how can we be sure that if yoga and others that are introduced are not diluting the teachings of Srila Prabhupada? Yes, that's an important question. Well, how would yoga per se dilute the teachings of Srila Prabhupada? Is it that at the time of initiation, the initiation vows are being changed? Instead of chanting 16 rounds, all of you do two hours yogasanas.

Well, nobody is doing that and nobody will even think of doing that. So, where exactly is the dilution? Okay, for some people who are interested in yoga, there are devotees who are teaching them yoga. Where is the dilution? Is it that in the Bhagavatam classes we are not talking about Krishna, we are only talking about yoga? Is it that no longer Prabhupada's books are being distributed, no longer Bhakti Shastri courses are being conducted, no longer Bhagavatam is being studied? Well, just because one new area of outreach is being started, how does that dilute the dilute the overall practice of bhakti? Yes, if from tomorrow onwards all the devotees who are doing teaching Bhagavad Gita, teaching Bhagavatam, they are all told, stop it all that, all of you become yoga teachers and you teach yoga.

Then we could say there is dilution. So, dilution, sometimes there is, whenever there is a fear which is very amorphous, then it's like we stay constantly fearful. So, if we come to a house and we fear that the house is haunted, we are constantly fearful.

We live in paranoia. But we reduce the fear. There might be some holes over here from which some rats might come out.

Maybe some snakes are also in the neighborhood. So, I have to watch out for snakes. I have to watch out for rats.

Look at it and then take care of that. So, similarly, okay, dilution, dilution, dilution, that's like a vague fear. How is dilution going to happen? I said one possibility, one major possibility is that we stop speaking about Krishna.

Well, that's not happening. Now, we have devotees having so many courses directly about Krishna. We have the Bhagavad Vidya Peetha over here in the Govardhaniko village.

And there are so many things like that happening. Direct Shastra is being taught. Now, while reaching out to yoga audience, yes, we are speaking in a particular way.

But is that what we are doing to everybody in the movement? There are people who are directly interested in Krishna. It is Krishna that is being spoken to them. It is not yoga that is being spoken to them.

So, the danger is there. But rather than like doing fear mongering by talking about the concept of dilution, look at specific areas where it may happen and then make sure it doesn't happen. So, I don't see it happening anyway as such.

But yes, the concern is valid. I need to keep an eye on, keep careful. Well, can you mention a few avenues in India where, areas in India where devotees can tap and introduce Krishna consciousness, especially in metro cities? That's a big subject.

I would say that each city is different. But broadly, if we can try to make spirituality as relevant as possible for people, then there's a lot of opportunity for that. In the software industry, there's a lot of stress.

So, if we can present spirituality as a way, Bhakti, Bhakti spirituality is a way for helping people deal with their stress. Mindfulness has been presented in a big way in the Western world. I was in Silicon Valley, one of the biggest companies, Salesforce.

And there they have actually mindfulness cabins, the areas where if the employees feel stressed, because something, they can go and just do some mindfulness meditation over there. So, especially in the stressful environment of the cities, we can actually reach out to people like that. And then, also, we can, basically, every city is different.

But if there are certain things which are important in that city, if we can tap into that, and then help Krishna consciousness. At one level, the city is a resource for us to share Krishna consciousness. But if the city sees us as a resource for them, then there will be a synergistic partnership.

So, we have to find out what may work for people. So, nowadays, virtual online courses are a big thing. If you can customize courses and present.

So, there's a lot that could be done. I think that it will be very specific based on time, place, circumstance. Well, how to avoid deviations while trying to be inclusive and broad-minded? Example, deviations in the name of being all-inclusive, Santa Claus dress for Radha Krishna, Jesus deity in temple.

Yes, now, we all want to avoid deviations. But we need to clearly understand that it is not only the contemporary world that is the source of deviation. The tradition itself can be a source of deviation also.

What do I mean? Not just the Bhakti tradition, but the broader Vedic tradition. No Mughal invasion, no Christian colonialism has damaged Vedic culture as much as the discriminatory caste system in India. And where did the discriminatory caste system come from? It came from within the tradition.

So, it is not only broad-mindedness that will lead to deviation. Narrow-mindedness can also lead to deviation. So, and the danger of deviation is everywhere.

By being flexible, we can become deviant. Even by fidelity, we can become deviant. So, fidelity is no guarantee of not becoming deviant.

So, those who were followers, now we may say that those who are following the caste system, they were not faithful to the Vedic teachings. Yes, but they were faithful to what they thought were the Vedic teachings at that time. So, what to do? So, the caste, as I said, deviations can come from everywhere and that's why we have to see what is the purpose.

What is the purpose that is being served? Are actually people coming closer to Krishna or in the name of we getting people closer to Krishna, we are going away from Krishna. So, yes, now some of the examples which you are giving are quite provocative. Say, having Santa Claus dress for Radha Krishna.

It's difficult to decide and in my understanding, we also need to recognize that each temple is in a different part of the world. So, rather than say sitting in India and judging what somebody in America is doing or what something South America is doing, there are devotees who are sincerely trying to share Krishna Bhakti wherever they are. And yes, there are their authorities.

They are guiding them also. So, it's best not to be like a self-appointed critic for the whole movement or a self-appointed watchdog. We focus on our practice of Bhakti.

If something disturbs our mind, then ask someone who is responsible. And we have Hare Krishna mantra being sung in with rock music, with western music. Some people might have considered that as a deviation.

But is that a deviation? Well, because in the past, in the tradition, it has never been done with that kind of music. But we are doing that. We are reaching out to people.

So, what is going on over here? Is the Hare Krishna mantra not pure enough to sanctify western music? Western forms of music it is. Sometimes the Hare Krishna mantra might be sung in a tune which might be a Bollywood song tune. Now, actually, it may not even be Bollywood song tune.

It might be some tune which has been there for a long time, but it became popular because of the Bollywood song. So, now what happens is, if we hear the Hare Krishna mantra in that tune, we might be reminded of the Bollywood song. But for somebody who has never heard of the Bollywood song, they are hearing the Hare Krishna mantra and they're appreciating that.

So, it's difficult to, so we should see rather than judging everyone else, you know, this person is deviating here, that person is deviating there. We focus on what enables us to remember Krishna. And for somebody else, if something helps them remember Krishna, they may do that.

And if that's wrong, they have their authorities to guide them. So, yes, deviation is a danger which everybody has to be vigilant about. But it is better to be vigilant about ourselves and not become like a self-appointed critic for the whole scorn world.

I think I answered this question about flexibility for, is flexibility for new people and chastity for devotees, for serious devotees? Not necessarily. Does it mean flexibility, say, speaking in English is flexibility and studying in Sanskrit is fidelity? So, is it that every devotee as they advance, they have to learn Sanskrit? Not necessarily. I don't think there are some simplistic formulas like this.

So, yes, each of us has to remember Krishna in the best possible way we can. And we have to see how best we can remember and take things forward. So, the food distribution, the lockdown seems to be more like philanthropic activity.

How is it in line with Prabhupada's teachings? Especially going outside and doing food for life? Well, I think I mentioned that quote by Prabhupada that we say that we will win the hearts of people by food distribution during this famine. So, Prabhupada talked about many things. Somehow we have taken one quote of Prabhupada and Prabhupada himself started food for life.

And now different devotees may have different ideas of what are the boundaries for which food for life should be done. But we have to be, we can't live in isolated bubbles disconnected from the rest of the world. So, if we are doing, if we can do scientific outreach for where there is not much tangible people becoming devotees, but we're getting getting some goodwill by that, then why can't we do philanthropic activity and get goodwill by that? You know, is it philanthropic activity like a sinful activity? No, Prabhupada didn't want us to equate Mano Seva with Madhav Seva.

That is the whole issue. You know, somehow it's, we, this philanthropic activity, as I mentioned in 12.11, Bhagavata Krishna says that if you can't be devoted to me, do some good work, sacrifice the fruits of your work. So, it's a noble activity.

Maharaj Rantideva has been compassionate, Maharaj Shibi has been compassionate. And there's a whole, if you read Bhakti Siddhanta Vaibhava itself, there, Bhakti Vikas Maharaj, who is no liberal, and even he cannot edit out the incidents from Bhakti Siddhanta Thakur's life, just because they are not in line with his vision of how the tradition should be. Because there are so powerful incidents that he can't edit them out.

So, he is admitted, he's written that when devotees were going to the temples and the devotees would not give charity to the beggars over there. So, Bhakti Siddhanta Thakur would say that, oh, I'll give my money to Hari and that way my heart stays hard. He says, give charity to the beggars.

So, philanthropy activity is not a sinful activity. The only thing is philanthropic activity should not replace devotional activity. So, have we stopped doing our aarti and puja in the temple? Have we stopped doing abhishek for the deities in the temple? In a time of great, the pandemic is a great humanitarian crisis.

And at that time, if we can do something for people, there's nothing wrong in it. So, we have to very carefully understand Prabhupada's context for Prabhupada's critique. And Prabhupada himself, now where was the, Prabhupada saw in Mayapur a child going through the garbage heap and looking for some food over there.

He says, nobody should go hungry near our temples for 10 miles. Now, did Prabhupada in that context say that, oh, this boy, first we can chant Hare Krishna, then you give him food. Prabhupada didn't do that.

He saw Prabhupada's heart was compassionate. Sometimes we divorce Prabhupada's instructions from Prabhupada as a person. Prabhupada was a living, loving person.

Prabhupada was compassionate and his compassion was not just only for the soul and he didn't care for the body. Prabhupada cared for the whole person. We have incidents of Prabhupada, some devotee came to disciples offering Vyasa Puja and Prabhupada's offering a flower and he was limping and Prabhupada called him and asked him what happened and then Prabhupada told him you can apply this particular politics, make it like this and apply it.

So, Prabhupada says, you are not the body or the soul, don't bother. Prabhupada didn't do like that. With respect to this boy who was poor, this was poverty stricken boy, Prabhupada made no spiritual conditions, make him chant, only then give him food.

No, nobody around 10 miles around our temple should go hungry. So, now there is a concern that we as devotees shouldn't just get into humanitarian work and stop doing devotional activities. That is a concern.

But Prabhupada's compassionate mood is very much embodied in different ways and in times of emergency, if we can reach out to people and assist at that level, that's a part of compassion. So, I don't see any way why it is out of line with Prabhupada's teachings. If we think it is out of line with Prabhupada's teachings, then maybe we have a very narrow vision of what Prabhupada's teachings are.

So, here a quote is being shared by Tosin Limaya Prabhupada. Very good. Thank you.

Okay. Now, this is a big question and I won't say that I have a definitive answer to this. So, in India, nationalism is rising.

Hindus are becoming more nationalistic due to riots and vandalizing of temples in Bandra. People want to preserve Sanatana Dharma and it can be very fruitful if we cooperate with the RSS and BJP. Will that label us like hardline Hindus? If we join organizations like VHP, RSS? There is how much a spiritual organization should get involved in the local and the political scene is an open question.

And if you look at American history, there are some very important lessons which we can learn. Many of the evangelical churches there, they aligned very strongly with the Republicans. And initially, okay, it was for some contextual purpose, it was fine.

But then eventually what happened? There are some Republican presidents who were quite incompetent. They got into unnecessary wars. And so, once a political, once a religious group like openly endorsed a particular political candidate, then all the mistakes that the political candidate did, that religious group got blamed for it.

And if that person did something questionable, then the religious group lost its moral credibility because of that. So, how much to get involved? It's not easy to decide. Now, there is a SCON as an institution and there are devotees as individuals who form a movement.

Now, this is an important concept. I'll quickly, this was a part of my PowerPoint which I didn't speak today. I'll show this to you quickly.

When I was talking about the expanded definitions of success. So, when we talk about what is a living tradition, a living tradition is not just the number of people who come to a temple. It's a network.

It's a culture. It's a complex web of communities and institutions. A network means, it's people known to, connected with and appreciative of the tradition, even if they are not its members.

So, that's networking. We may have, not many people may be devotees, but they may be very appreciative. Like life members were not devotees, but they supported Prabhupada.

And a culture is a set of values, beliefs and behaviors that is considered good and respectable even by those who don't follow it. So, in much of India, people may not be devotees, but people appreciate devotion to some extent. Then beyond that, there are communities and institutions.

So, communities are more informal, institutions are more formal. So, as an institution, now communities and institutions can have a complex relationship. Say, there can be overlapping like Venn diagrams.

Sometimes the institution may be big, within that there may be a community. Sometimes the institution may be within a community. Sometimes around a community, many institutions might come up.

Sometimes around an institution, many communities might come up. Now, this is all complicated. Some of you might find complicated, but the point I'm making is that around an institution, there can be a community which can reach out much bigger than the institution.

So, the institution cannot affiliate with any political group, but the communities can. If there are devotees who are interested in politics and if a devotee at an individual level wants to campaign for a particular cause, there's no one going to stop them from that. They can take some guidance from the spiritual guides and they can take it forward from there.

So, the institution's boundaries may be relatively constrained, but beyond the institution is a broad movement. So, the movement includes the communities. The movement is much bigger than the communities.

The movement is much bigger than the institution. So, it could be like a sister concern. So, technically speaking, Food for Life is not a scorn, it's a sister concern.

So, Bhakti and Hospital is not technically a scorn, it's a sister concern. So, devotees could start some organizations or like some initiatives. If some devotees feel very strongly about a particular cause, then they can work on that cause.

Just like devotees who feel strongly about environmental environment, they can work on environmental Krishna consciousness. Devotees who feel strongly about, say, social justice, they can work on social justice in Krishna conscious. They can take their Krishna conscious wisdom and use it in social justice.

Prabhupada says all isms can be spiritualized. So, nationalism can be spiritualized, communism can be spiritualized, capitalism can be spiritualized. So, yes.

So, if devotees are inspired, then they can form communities, they can be part of the movement, and they can align with certain groups and they can work accordingly. So, as an institution, we are unlikely to align with any specifically political cause. Now, as far as protecting Sanatana Dharma is concerned, yes, there are various degrees of protection of Sanatana Dharma.

As Prabhupada just didn't give us Sanatana Dharma, because Prabhupada gave us the summit, the zenith of Sanatana Dharma, that is pure devotional service to Krishna. So, now for teaching pure devotional service, do we need a conducive culture around us and do we need to protect that? Yes, we need to. And in some ways, in Govardhanika village, Maharaj has talked about the Ganga-Jamuna-Saraswati project.

So, Jamuna is for taking care of, for providing, for helping people to grow devotionally. Saraswati is for providing people education and Ganga is for providing people nutrition, basic needs. So, the idea is that and together there can be a Triveni.

So, there are devotees who focus on the Jamuna side. There are some devotees who may focus more on the Ganga side. Some devotees may focus on the Saraswati side.

So, if devotees are individually inspired to do some things, then nobody is going to stop them from doing that. It's there, they can take guidance and they can definitely do that. So, Pranavanand Prabhu, till what time should we go? There are a couple of questions here.

I don't want to go too much over time. Let me know. Prabhu, maybe we can take, we can make two more questions we can take.

Okay, thank you. So, how can we, so, would you like to clarify about Pushpa Abhishek? Well, I'm not sure what is there to clarify about Pushpa Abhishek, but two, three things I can say that there is a devotional culture that has been a very much part of the tradition and that devotional culture, Bhakti culture has had many things and using and flowers, Krishna says, patram, pushpam, phalam, tovam. So, we use flowers and do Abhishek of the Lord.

So, is there anything objectionable in that? If we use the flowers, afterward we take the Prasad and share it with each other, are we gratifying our senses by that? Well, we could say after we offer bhoga to the Lord and we take the Prasad, are we not gratifying our senses by that? Does everybody who takes Prasad, take it in pure consciousness? Well, everybody, we want everybody to, but no, everybody doesn't necessarily. So, is it that Krishna consciousness should not have any fun at all? Is it that Krishna is such a selfish enjoyer, that he wants only him to enjoy and for all of us to suffer? This is antithetical to the idea of God. Krishna doesn't want us to enjoy in a way that is harmful for ourselves, but Krishna wants us to be happy in a way that we can also be eternally happy.

So, now when there are kirtans, is it that we should not enjoy the music at all? Should we always have, if we have sweet tunes, then we will enjoy music. So, should we have very somber tunes sung by very poor singers so that we focus only on the holy name and we get only spiritual satisfaction and no musical satisfaction at all? Such a conception is the destruction of culture. So, because we may enjoy food, which is, so all the tasty food we should cook for Krishna and then for us, let us cook food separately, which is completely tasteless.

I need only that food. Well, that doesn't make any sense at all. So, yes, we shower flowers on each other, but even if we do that, that is done in a devotional way.

So, when we eat the food, now there are different offerings which come from Krishna, which are reciprocated in different ways. So, when if we say prasad is non-different from Krishna, then what are we doing with prasad? We are taking it in our mouth and we are biting it and cutting it and crushing it. And then after that, after that same prasad goes into our body, that prasad, which is non-different from Krishna, because it comes in our body, it comes out as foul smelling substance from our body.

We are doing that to prasad. So, in order to not do something like that to prasad, should we stop eating? Krishna manifests in different ways and we reciprocate with him in appropriate way. So, if the food is offered to Krishna, the way we reciprocate with that food is by chewing it, by eating it.

And that is not dishonoring Krishna. That is the way we honor Krishna. So, the flowers that are offered to Krishna, if devotees shower them on each other, that is not in any way dishonor.

The flowers are a natural, beautiful way of, they are the nature's bounty. And the prayers of Queen Kunti, it is said that nature's bounty is the smile of Krishna. I am paraphrasing Prabhupada.

So, what nature, mother nature, mother earth is giving, we are offering to Krishna in a way that is that is captivating. There are many different ways in which offerings can be made to Krishna. So, a flower abhishek is visually very attractive, it is completely natural, it is aesthetically pleasing.

And it is a way in which the heart is charmed, the heart is uplifted, people are attracted. So, it is completely Krishna centered. And if there is some aesthetic attraction, if there is some aesthetic pleasure associated with that, that's uplifting pleasure.

So, to find any fault with a festival as uplifting as Pushpa Abhishek, is very unfortunate. It's like Prabhupada would talk about how a fly travels around looking for a stool. So, it's almost like that.

So, one last question. Okay, now there is a second part to this question, that because of the internet, people may keep shopping, nectar shopping, and they may not commit. It will lead to too much freedom in the beginning.

Well, that's just a fact of life. We cannot take away people's freedom. What can we do? I had asked this question to Gopal Krishna Maharaj.

Nowadays on the internet, so much is there and so Maharaj says, if people want internet to be their guru, they don't need to be them. Let the internet be their guru. So, I was amazed by that statement.

So, ultimately people have to make a choice. Is it that they want to teach Google, treat Google as their guru and on Google you can find dirt about anyone. If that's what we want to find, well, that's what we will find.

Krishna at one level is aethamam prapadyante as he says. He is, he reciprocates with our desires. So, if somebody wants to shop for controversy, Krishna will give them controversy even in the name of his movement.

If somebody wants just to keep nectar shopping, well, that's what they can do. Yes, we want to become spiritual seekers, not just a spiritual shoppers. But some people may want to shop for some time, maybe for a long time.

We can't really legislate commitment. We can only inspire it. So, internet has definitely provided people a lot of options and if we present Krishna consciousness in an attractive way, over a period of time people get satiated.

They understand that, there's no substance in this and they will turn toward Krishna. So, has the internet made things more flexible? Well, yes, but internet can also provide a facility for us to stay connected. If the internet had not been there and if we had lockdown, we would all have been spiritually starved.

It is through Zoom and other things that we are staying connected. So, I would say there are opportunities everywhere for connecting with Krishna and there are excuses everywhere for not connecting with Krishna. Some people will take the opportunity, some people will take the excuses.

Certainly, in today's world, we can say the excuses are available much more easily. The excuses are much more numerous and therefore, yes, it is a challenge you take to Krishna consciousness. But it is a challenge for everyone and you could say in everything.

For people to be committed to anything, it's not easy in today's world. For people to be committed to career, committed to a job, committed to a family, it's not easy. So, that's just the nature of the age and we can't stay immune to the effect of the age.

Now, can we gain some immunity by emphasizing fidelity and not flexibility? Well, maybe if we really wanted to have fidelity, then if we really wanted fidelity, then those who are pure traditionalists, they should stop using the internet. They should stop using Zoom. They should all stop using all technology.

If you are going to only follow what Prabhupada followed, Prabhupada never used the internet. He said the internet was not there at time. Yes, that's true, but Prabhupada didn't use it.

So, why don't we in the name of fidelity stick to only do what Prabhupada did and no more changes? Well, why make the change of using the internet then? This is Yukta Vairagya. Yes, Yukta Vairagya, that's true. So, then now what are the specific things that can be used in Krishna's service? That is a judgment call which our devotee guides can give us some guidance for it.

But ultimately, each devotee has to take that judgment call themselves with guidance. But I don't think in today's world legislating commitment is possible. And if you say there is greater fidelity for serious devotees and not flexibility, in that context, it may be true.

But as I said, we need flexibility even to have fidelity. If somebody says that I will not hear classes unless I'm going to a temple. Zoom is not work for me.

Well, then they would not have heard any classes. So, we had to have flexibility. That's how we can.

So, it is only because of flexibility that we could maintain fidelity. So, the fidelity means, say we should hear Bhagavatam. We should associate with devotees.

That's the principle we should be faithful to. But if somebody is not ready to be flexible, you know, I don't believe in virtual association. Okay, then what are you going to do? Physical association is not possible.

Then either have virtual association or no association. Certainly, virtual association may not be equivalent to physical association. But virtual is definitely better than no association at all.

So, sometimes if we don't have flexibility, we can't have fidelity at all. And this lockdown should be the greatest example of that. That flexibility is vital for maintaining fidelity.

So, rather than thinking of these two as opposite, to do something traditional, we have to do something non-traditional. To continue hearing about Krishna, we have to adopt a new means for hearing about Krishna. That is, we have to hear through technology virtually.

So, these are not very straightforward things. And we need a prayerful heart. We need to consult devotees.

And then, ultimately, every devotee has to become responsible. So, the locus of responsibility lies with every individual. It doesn't lie with the spiritual master.

It doesn't lie with the institution. It lies with the individual. And if we can inspire and empower individuals to become responsible for their own spiritual lives, then they will be able to honestly take the decision when to be flexible, when to focus on flexibility, when to focus on fidelity.

Thank you very much. His Holiness Radhanath Swami Maharaj, Ki Jai. Shrila Prabhupada, Ki Jai.

Thank you very, very much. Thank you, Chaitanya Chandra Guru. Very, very much.

Very, very grateful to you for really putting it in a very, very analytical, very intellectual, very devotional way, what the mood of Maharaj is and how he is taking forward his different projects and different misconceptions which we may have of certain things which Maharaj is doing, which may appear to us, and how you very, very, in a very systematic way, clarified our confusions and doubts and helping us increase our faith and commitment, as you mentioned in your previous class, also shouldering the responsibility. And we see how wonderfully you are assisting and taking that, as you mentioned, where there is greater need, there is greater mercy. So, thank you very, very much, Guru.

It is truly, at least I can say for me personally, very inspirational, your message and your presentation. Thank you very much, Guru. Very grateful to you.

Thank you very much for the opportunity to serve. Thank you. Shrila Prabhupada, Ki Jai.

Thank you very much, Prabhuji. Thank you very much. Thank you.