How to say No Politely Hanuman – Mainaka || Toronto Scarborough || Chaitanya Charan || 4.5.24

Transcript

This is an AI-generated transcript and may contain some errors.
forward. So thank you very much. On a mission, to search for Sita.
Searching is an experience that we all have at some time or the other. We may search for some object that we may have lost, a key, a phone. A child may get lost.
A child may, just while playing, walk away. Then there is a fear, the child injured, the child abducted. And then everybody comes together to try to find something far more serious.
Sita has been abducted. And I have a friend in California who works in human trafficking. And it is one of the scariest, most horrendous things that can happen to people.
And first, finding out where a person has been taken after abduction is itself extremely difficult. And then, finding that person and getting them back is another huge challenge in itself. So Sita has been abducted and it’s been days and months that have passed.
Generally, whenever any grave event happens, the gravity, the intensity, the emotions associated with that event are there initially for some time. But after that, the humdrum, mundane, routine nature of life starts creeping back in. And no matter how grave a thing that has happened, everybody starts acting as if, well, it’s happened now.
What to do about it? Let’s move on with life. At one level, it’s understandable. The world will not stop because one bad thing has happened.
But for those who have been affected by it, it’s an unbearable thing. So, one of the greatest adventures in the Ramayana starts from this backdrop of great agony. When all these Vanaras are summoned by Sugriv to come from various parts of the world, they don’t know why they have been summoned.
They do know that something serious is up. Their previous king was Vali and Vali had been killed in his own kingdom. And Sugriv had now become the king.
They knew that there was this rivalry, there was some animosity between the two brothers. And when they came, whenever there is any new, in any setup, if there’s any change in the management, and then after that a meeting is called, there’s always some nervousness. What is this about? And so the government changes in a country or in a state after elections.
And then a meeting of all the staff is called. Well, who’s going to be let off? Who’s going to be demoted? Who’s going to be promoted? A lot of changes happen. So, all the Vanaras, they come promptly and they all want to, at one level, be in the good books of the new king Sugriva.
And yet Sugriva does not really know. He knows all of these Vanaras. He knows that he has himself travelled across the world primarily with the desire to hide from Vali.
And because most of the Vanaras were affiliated to Vali, at least officially because he was the king, so Vali had tried to use them to kill Sugriv. And the tensions were huge at that time that would Sugriv treat them with suspicion? Would Sugriv try to get back at them now? That even if they had not assisted him, even if they had not tried to attack him, but they had not assisted him either. So, Sugriv called all of them.
He didn’t mention anything about anything from the past. He focused simply on one thing. He introduced all of them to Lord Ram and he told them that we need to find Sita.
And in one sense, most of the Vanaras felt relieved that none of the politics of the past was going to affect in any way. They were all here for a particular mission, a particular service. And then Lord Ram spoke to them.
And when Ram spoke, they could clearly see that he was in great grief. In fact, unbearable grief. Yet, there was this elegance, this refinement, this sublimity to his personality, to his speech, to his conduct.
He expressed his gratitude to all of these Vanaras. None of them he knew also, but they had now come and he urged them to go in search of Sita. And yet, when they were all going, Sugriv, while he was ready to let the past stay in the past, he still needed people whom he could count on.
And while he had been in the forest, Jambavan and Hanuman had been with him. So, he deputed to them the southern direction for going. That was the direction in which Sita was most likely to be because they had seen Ravan fly in the southern direction.
And while the demon could have been deceiving them by flying initially in one direction and then another direction, but they also had heard from the sages and others that the demon’s kingdom was in the southern direction. And moreover, when the Vanaras had seen him going in the southern direction, they had been no threat to him. He had probably not even noticed them.
So, he had no reason to deceive them. So, Ram and Sugriv conferred. And then, for Lord Ram, the first person among the Vanaras that he had met was Hanuman.
So, Hanuman was, of course, from the spiritual perspective, Hanuman is among the topmost devotees of Lord Ram. Shri Ramadhootam Sharanam Prapadya, as we say. But from the immediate perspective within the Leela, Ram is the first person whom Hanuman has, sorry, the first person that Ram has met is Hanuman.
And the first meeting had itself been very sweet and memorable. Hanuman’s sweet words, his elegant speech, it had pacified Lord Ram’s mind as he was tormented by both separation from Sita and by apprehension about Sita’s fate as well as exasperation that they had not been able to find Sita for so long. And then, Hanuman was the person who had introduced them to Sugriv.
So, Lord Ram said, Hanuman, you are most likely to find Sita. And if you find her, give her this signet. The Chudamani Darshan Rama.
So, the name Rama is described that Hanuman was entrusted with this special signet which he was to give to Sita. And the leaders of this group, Jambavan and Hanuman were both people whom Sugriv trusted and Hanuman also had a special relationship with Ram. And yet, Sugriv did not appoint either of them as the leader of the group.
He appointed Angad as the leader. Angad was the son of the previous king Vali. And though Vali before his death had told Angad, don’t hold Sugriv or Ram responsible for my death.
It is because of my own misdeeds that I have been killed and they have just been instruments. So, Angad had no bad feelings towards Ram. But he still had some reservation about Sugriv.
Of course, he didn’t voice it. And Sugriv was aware. Somebody who has had a threat on his life for a long time and who has somehow survived has to be both fast on the feet and fast in the thinking.
He could sense Angad’s tension. And therefore, he entrusted Angad with the responsibility of being a leader. It was in one way Sugriv’s gesture of telling Angad, I trust you.
They all knew that among all the groups going in various directions, the southern group was most likely to find Sita. So, to make that group’s leader as Angad was Sugriv showing his trust. At the same time, Angad was very young, inexperienced.
He was heroic. Yet, it was a huge, huge responsibility. And the Vanaras searched urgently, fervently, desperately.
Sugriv had told them to come back within one month. But more than one month had passed and the Vanaras had kept searching, kept searching. And they were torn in two parts.
Sometimes if you have to search something and there is a clear cut deadline, say we have to catch a flight and we have forgotten something, we can go home and search for it. But we know that by this time I have to reach the airport. And if there is a clear cut deadline, then it is non-negotiable.
But say if we are going by car somewhere, we have to find this. It will be delayed by half an hour, one hour, two hours, three hours. It is our own car, we will go later.
So, the Vanaras were torn. The deadline that Sugriv had given, was it a negotiable deadline or a non-negotiable deadline? They wanted to find Sita desperately. So, they kept searching, kept searching.
And finally, through a series of extraordinary events, they came to the post of the Southern Ocean, on the southern tip of India. When Sampati told them that I can see Sita in the island of Lanka, because although my age has afflicted my wings and limbs, it has not affected my eyes. I still have piercing vision.
The monkeys jumped in joy and they, roaring, they charged towards the ocean, delighted that they now knew Sita’s location. But when they came there, suddenly the celebration just became completely silenced. Because as they beheld the vastness of the ocean, suddenly joy was replaced by dismay.
In a cricket match, when a batsman gets out, all the players on the fielding team celebrate. Now they may celebrate, but if they see at that moment, when one batsman has got out, another batsman is coming and that batsman is a champion batsman. And, okay, one problem is solved, but a far bigger problem has come up now.
The celebration has become very muted. So, like that, it just becomes sombre. And Angad tried to boost the spirits of everybody.
He said, O Vanaras, all of you are heroic. I am sure many of you can leap across this ocean and go to Lanka. Sometimes it is stated that the Vanaras, or later on Hanuman basically, specifically, flew to Lanka.
It was not flying actually. It was a leaping. It was like a long jump.
Hanuman went on top of a, later on, he went on top of a mountain and from there he sprang up. So, it was a long leap that he had taken. But they were discussing who among them could leap for how long.
And they discussed various distances, all the Vanaras said. But none of them was capable of going the entire distance. Jambavan said that, when I was young, I could have leapt across the entire earth and gone around it and come back.
Nowadays, there is this idea called the Flat Earth Theory. There are so many people, even some devotees, say that Bhagavatam talks about the Flat Earth Theory. But there are many references about going around the earth.
So, this was one such reference. Jambavan said, I could have gone around the entire earth. But now, with my age, I don’t think I can go even to Lanka.
Angad said that, I think if I leap with my full strength, I should be able to go to Lanka. But after that leap, I am not sure whether I will be able to come back. Leap all the way back again.
It’s one thing for the subordinates to admit their inadequacy in front of their leader. But it’s another thing for a leader to admit their inadequacy in front of the subordinates. And especially, somebody who has just become a new leader, who is still trying to establish their credentials in the team.
Jambavan was wise and expert, he said. He helped Angad save face. He said, O Prince, you are our leader and you are the prince of our dynasty.
It does not behove you to go as a messenger. Someone else among us should go. They all turned, looking at each other.
And they noticed that there is one person who had not spoken till now. He had been sitting silent in a reflective mood. Hanuman, as we know, had been blessed soon after his birth with extraordinary powers.
But in his childhood, because of his mischievousness, he had been cursed. Normally the word curse has a certain sense of harshness to it. And with that harshness, comes the idea of punishment.
Hanuman was punished. Not really, he was not punished. He was cursed.
He was cursed for his protection, not for his punishment. He had ability, extraordinary abilities he had been blessed with. But along with ability, we all need maturity.
Maturity is the ability to use our ability wisely. So because he was still a child, he didn’t have that maturity. And as the sages said, you will lose your power.
Actually, you won’t lose your power, you will lose your remembrance of your powers. Now, it’s interesting how memory works. We all know about amnesia, by which somebody is hit on the head and they lose their memory of things.
Now, which part of the brain when hit will lead to which kind of memory loss is very difficult to predict. The brain, first of all, is very complex and on top of that, the memory itself is even more complex. Based on the computer metaphor, there was the idea that just like in the computer memory, different data is stored in different parts.
In this area, in this particular drive, this is stored, in this particular folder, this is stored. The idea was that in the brain, things are stored like that. But as scientists are studying the brain more and more, they are understanding that the more we understand about the brain, the more we understand, how much more there is to understand.
And now some scientists are suggesting that memory is actually stored not inside the brain cells but somewhere in the magnetic field in the connection between the brain cells. There are many different theories. The point I am making over here is that how memory appears and how memory disappears is still a mystery.
So, the sages, when they curse Hanuman, it is a very curious kind of curse that Hanuman did not forget anything about his daily activities. Hanuman did not even forget about his fighting skills. But the special abilities that he had, he just forgot all about them.
Now, there are later retellings of the Ramayana which describe what was Hanuman thinking at this time when he was silent. He was weighed down by the thought of the responsibility that Ram had given to him. He wanted to fulfil that responsibility and still he just felt that he didn’t have that ability.
Hanuman, till now in the Ramayana, has been attractive but he has not been, as I said, he has very refined speech, very sweet voice, very pleasing demeanour but he does not seem to have extraordinary power and that’s why when Sugriva was fleeing in fear of Vali, Hanuman didn’t intervene. Hanuman didn’t think that he had the power by which he could take on Vali. So, for him, in one sense, there is no question that he could go over to Lanka.
It’s not possible. And yet something deep within him seemed to be calling him. There was something he could do.
Sometimes when we lose something, sometimes we lose something because we carelessly kept it somewhere or something important, we carelessly just left it somewhere. And sometimes we lose something because we have kept it so carefully, maybe we have hidden it so carefully that even now we don’t remember where we had hidden it. So, it’s lost not because of carelessness but because of excessive carefulness.
If I just remember something, I will be able to remember. So, that’s why he was silent. There must be something I can do.
There is something I am missing. It was at that time that Jambavan started speaking. Now, later commentators asked that why is it that Jambavan was there throughout in the forest with Sugriva and Hanuman? Why did Jambavan not remind Hanuman before this of his prowess? So, Jambavan is also a part of the Lord’s entourage.
He appears in Krishna Leela also. He is among the few characters. Divita is another from Ram Leela who comes in Krishna Leela.
Hanuman comes but Hanuman is not such an active presence in the Bhagavatam at least, in the 10th Canto. So, Jambavan knew by his devotional connection with the Lord that Hanuman’s powers were meant specifically for Ram’s service. Hanuman was a faithful servant of Sugriva but Hanuman’s powers, special powers which he had got by the blessings of the Devatas, they were not meant for Sugriva’s service.
They were meant for Ram’s service. So, those powers came to him at that time. I was talking recently with one Srila Prabhupada disciple, Srila Jyoti, he said that when he was distributing books, he was able to distribute books in such a phenomenal way.
He thought, you know, I have some special power. And then as things changed in our movement, he decided to, he was living full time in the temple, he decided to become a Grahastha, he had his own job and his business. He said, oh, I distribute books very well.
I guess I am good at marketing. And he started doing marketing. And he said, it just didn’t work.
I tried again and again and then it struck me that actually Krishna had blessed me with this ability for his service. So, he lives in Florida, he said that. I decided I am not going to market anything else.
So, he actually, even as a Grahastha he travels to various places, he distributes books. And that’s how he has taken care of his entire family also. So, we have abilities that may come to us from our past karma and those abilities we can use for Krishna’s service or for our own mundane purposes.
But there are abilities we get by Krishna’s mercy specifically, by higher intervention. And those are meant primarily for the Lord’s service. We can use them for other things if we want.
But they may just slip away. So, Jambavan started speaking to Hanuman. And he started speaking to Hanuman reminding him of the incidents from his childhood whose memory had become obscured.
And as Jambavan spoke and he started speaking, he was looking straight ahead at Hanuman. As he was speaking, Hanuman’s spirits were rising. But along with that, his bodily form was also expanding.
His spirits were expanding, his body was expanding. So, Jambavan started talking with Hanuman looking straight ahead. But by the time he finished speaking, he was looking way up.
Hanuman had taken on a giant form. And this is actually the power of words that words can expand our spirits. They can energise us.
And we all need reminders that there is more to us than what we normally think, what the world ascribes to us. The spiritual master is like, in this case, Jambavan. And that we all have hidden spiritual potentials that we spend most of our life unaware of.
That is what the spiritual master tells us. There are different kinds of friends. Some people want friends just so that they can brag about their abilities.
Krishna talks about this in the 16th chapter. The demoniac people also want friends. But they don’t want really friends.
They want a fan club. Where, Ishwaro aham aham bhogi, siddho aham balwan sukhi. Where they want others to be just people who listen to their glories.
So, people who simply want to brag about their abilities. They may be friendly, but they are not actually friends. The real friends are those who remind us of vital truths that we have forgotten.
Who remind us and encourage us. And thus by this reminder and encouragement, they empower us. So, Hanuman said, yes, I will jump across to Lanka.
I will not only find Sita, I will find Sita, fight off the demons and get her back. I will uproot Lanka and bring it back. I will destroy Raava and the terrible demon who had the audacity to abduct mother Sita.
So, Jambavan had till now been enthusing Hanuman and when enthusiasm can go towards over enthusiasm, it is always an elusive thing. So, Jambavan said, okay, Hanuman, we have been told, we have been given one mission. Find Sita.
Just do that and come back and inform Ram. So, Hanuman nodded. Hanuman felt a surge of power envelop his entire being as he remembered the exhilarating adventures of his childhood.
And he leapt up from the mountain on which he had climbed. And he said, streaking across the sky, the force of his jump was such that it appeared as if a meteor had suddenly appeared in the sky and was streaking across. And Hanuman was fixed.
He now had the opportunity to be the single person to fulfil the mission for his Lord. While he had travelled across the earth with Sugriva, he had never been alone like this. Long, long ago in his childhood, he had leapt up high into the sky to go towards the sun, thinking it was inedible.
But that was just a childish play, a child seeking a toy. Here was a serious mission and he was all alone in this mission. He was determined to not let any obstacle come in its way.
And at that very moment, suddenly a mountain started appearing through the ocean, rising upward, upward, upward and blocking his way. So, while he felt that the mountain was probably some kind of a demon or some kind of an obstacle, he had to hit it. Hare Krishna.
It was what I had spoken in the auditorium. So, when Hanuman saw this obstacle, he was about to hit it. And suddenly, he was thinking, how much force do I have to hit it? He was thinking of going apart, but he was just rising upward and blocking his way completely.
So, when he was moving forward, suddenly a face appeared on that. Now, what was this obstacle? Does anyone know? What is the name of the mountain? Mainak. Mainak, yes.
So, Mainak said, actually, I am a friend of Dashrath, who is the father of Ram. And I am here to assist you. I am here to assist you.
You are going on a formidable mission. It will be exhausting. You already left.
You have covered quite a distance. Just, I have risen up so that you can rest. Take some rest.
Rejuvenate yourself and then you can move forward. Now, this was unexpected. Hanuman realised that this was no enemy.
He was just gearing himself up to fight. That was his whole mood. He knew it was going to be an adventure, a fight.
And then suddenly, so what did he do? He very politely said to Mainak that, I am on a mission to find Sita for Lord Ram. As you know, we are already late. I cannot wait any more.
I am grateful to you for the service that you offered me. I accepted the mood of your service. And Hanuman is going to the sky, just bent down slightly, touched the mountain.
That was his way of accepting that offering. And then he moved on. And Mainak looked up with a smile and blessed him.
He says, may you be successful in your service to Lord Ram. Now, this incident just seems to go by in a moment in the Ramayana. But it has a very great significance.
Because what it illustrates is that, how to say no. We all face times in our lives when we have to say no. And how do we go about saying that? So, I will talk about, from Hanuman’s actions, three principles.
So, generally speaking, when we have to say no, there could be various reasons. So, basically, if I am here, and the other person is here, and they are offering us something, saying, OK, come on, come for this, do this, do that. So, say, if we are going to a relative’s place, we are working in a company, and a colleague says, you know, come for a party.
And maybe they have a meet over there. They have something which we don’t take. Now, from their perspective, it’s just a courtesy they are offering.
So, there could be various reasons. So, from the other person’s side, they are inviting, they are offering something. And from our side, we have to be responding.
Now, how do we say no? To understand this, let’s start by the other extreme of how to not say no. Generally speaking, when somebody is making an offering, there is the content and there is the intent. There is what somebody is offering and why somebody is offering.
Content is more about what and intent is why. So, Krishna goes to Duryodhana with a peace proposal. When he goes with a peace proposal, what is Duryodhana’s response? Do you remember? He didn’t accept.
Well, that’s an extremely polite way of stating what he did. What did he say? Do you remember? He wanted Krishna’s signing. No, this is later.
This is not when Duryodhana came to Krishna. It was just before the war when Krishna came as a peace messenger. Yes, I will not give enough land to even put the tip of a needle through.
Now, if that had been the age of social media, it would have been a viral Insta ring, kya dialogue hai. But what does it mean actually? It is like you say we invite somebody to our home for some programme. And they don’t want to come.
So, they make an excuse. They are making an excuse. We know that they are making an excuse.
And they know that we know that they are making an excuse. But still, out of politeness, they are at least making some excuse. I have to go here, I have to do that.
But suppose they reply, even if I die, even my dead body will never complete the programme. That is not just a rejection of the invitation of the offer. It is a rejection of the person itself.
It is a kick in the face of the person. So, Duryodhana’s response to Krishna’s peace proposal, that is a classic example of how not to say no. How never say no.
That is, why? Because that is the way we are not only rejecting the person, rejecting the invitation, but we are ruining the relationship with the person. Now, even if we feel, in this case Krishna’s intention was actually to avoid the war, but still he didn’t accept it. Now, sometimes the specific offering that a person may give may not be suitable.
Early in the Ramayana, there is an example that when Lord Rama is in the forest, a fisherman comes and he offers fish to Rama. And now, Lord Rama, he isn’t just tying the fisherman. What kind of, who do you think I am? I am a noble Kshatriya, I don’t eat such food.
Why are you offering this to me? He didn’t become disgusted. He said, I accept the spirit of your offering. So, the Lord is Bhavakrahi.
And we also need to be Bhavakrahi in this case. That when somebody is offering something, if somebody is polite, somebody is politely offering something, we also need to be polite. We can’t just be disrespectful or dismissive over there.
So, I talk about three things, how to say no. When somebody is going to offer, act is the acronym we use. So, A is appreciate the gesture.
Even if the person is inviting us for something, which we, which we have no intention in going to. But if that person is inviting, appreciate the gesture. So, when we start, when we start, say, practising spiritual life, we want to live according to the principles, we have some purposes in our life.
And many of the things that we might have been doing earlier may no longer fit with our present purposes or principles. So, at that point, we may not want to do those things. But if we don’t appreciate the gesture, then all that happens is, we just come off as arrogant or rude or fanatical.
And when that happens, we alienate people. Krishna in the Bhagavad Gita 12.15 says, one of the characteristics of his, of a devotee that endears him to others is, यस्मान नोध्विजते लोको लोकान नोध्विजते जिया. That one who is not agitated by others and one who does not agitate others.
So, some people may offer us inappropriate proposals, but that does not mean that we have to just reject those proposals. We cannot be disrespectful. This is one of the lessons which I learnt when I started coming to America, North America basically, to America and started doing Western outreach.
Once I had been to a college programme, and this is a Western college programme, so there was one American girl, she asked a question about, why do religions fight among each other? And I explained elaborately based on the three modes, how Tamoguna is the characteristic of every group of people. Anyway, I elaborately answered the question. And then, I could see she was quite relieved by that.
After the class, she came and talked with me. This question has been burning me for so long. This was a big obstacle for me in my spiritual journey.
Now, whichever, I have gone to various groups, the answers they were giving is, you know, yeah, you know, our group is not fanatical. Other religions are fanatical. But you gave me an objective criteria.
You know, Sattvaraja’s Tamas has got nothing to do with Hinduism, Christianity, Islam. That is, Tamasic people can be in any religious group. And Sattvic people can also be in any religious group.
Anyway, she says, such a non-sectarian answer, but at the same time, you gave me an objective criteria. I am so grateful. And he says, I am so grateful, can I give you a hug? So, now, as a brahmachari, I couldn’t accept that.
So, then I just turned to the devotee who was next to me. I said, please help me. And then he helped me.
He was a youth preacher organising the programme over there. He helped me in a completely unexpected way. He said, he is a monk, on his behalf you can hug me.
His wife was there next to him. And she said, I am his wife, on his behalf you can hug me. So, and the two of them hugged each other.
This is protection to parampara. The point I was making is that, in Indian culture, the gender interactions are in a particular way. And of course, that is also changing in India to some extent.
But those particular gender interactions are not the same in the western world. And from her perspective, she was just expressing her appreciation. So, we need to appreciate the gesture.
Although we may not be able to reciprocate with that gesture. Maybe it’s not appropriate for us to. But the point is, appreciate the gesture.
So, Hanuman did not say, why are you coming in my way? Just get out of my way, I have to go now. Then after appreciating the gesture, the next part is, communicate our purpose. Or in this case, principles.
We need to, ok, if you are not going to say yes, if you have to say no, how do we say no? Here, it’s best that we do it non-judgemental. So, if somebody, say, invites us to go for a movie. And we say, ok, I am not interested in watching movies.
Somebody invites us to a place where, say, meat is being eaten. And we say, I don’t want to go there. Now, so there are two ways when we have to communicate our purpose, our principles.
So, when we communicate our principles, we could do it in a prescriptive way or we could do it in a descriptive way. So, prescriptive means, you do it. So, for example, in even outreach, the kind of outreach that works, and the kind of outreach that does not work.
Say, especially now, the time we are living in is the post-modern times. And people value experience a lot. Suppose, I was at an interfaith conference and there was one Christian priest who was telling me how they have to be, they have to change the way they communicate with the younger generation.
They say, one or two generations ago, say, if a couple wanted to separate, the first thing you tell them is that divorce is a sin against God. You will go to hell. He said that today, if you tell that to a young couple, they will say, divorce is a sin against God, you will go to hell.
He says, you go to hell right now. I don’t care for you. So, the way we communicate that is, you know, that, ok.
Everybody has some difficulties. You know, we have been, this was a Protestant tradition. In Protestant, they don’t have any monks.
So, they have mostly married priests. He said that, then we communicate, you know, I have been married for 25 years. And this is how I have made it work.
And I would like to share something with you, some difficulties we had and how we work. So, what happens is, what descriptive means, basically two things, what we do and why we do. So, instead of, descriptive means, you should do this.
So, once we go in this direction of you should do this, people start asking, who are you to tell me what I should do and what I should not do. So, this is our purpose. You say, this is not my purpose, this is not my principle, this is the scriptural principle, the universal principle.
Ok, they may be universal, but people have not taken those leaps of faith by which they have accepted the authority of scripture right now. So, we need to think of ways in which we can communicate our purpose in a way that makes sense to others. So, that’s why, whenever we are talking about our purpose, our principles, there are two ways to explain it.
One is scriptural and the other is logical. That now, as I said, scripture is something whose authority they may not have accepted. So, why don’t you, suppose somebody offers you meat, why don’t you eat meat? Oh, meat eating is sinful, it is one of the four pillars of our dharma.
You will get caught by Kali and you will be entrapped and you will suffer. That all may be true, but that explanation doesn’t make any sense. So, the logical explanation would be that what do I do, why do I do it? You know, when I came to know how much violence is involved in the meat packing industry, how much pain the animals go through, I decided I really don’t want to be a part of all this.
I don’t need to have this food that is going to cause so much pain to so many life forms. Or you could talk about, when I came to know about the health benefits of vegetarian food or whatever. Speak in a way that they can understand it.
So, we need to communicate our purpose. If we don’t do that and all that happens is we alienate the person. So, generally speaking, whenever there is any kind of interaction with anyone else, we need to see that that interaction is an opportunity to help that person grow in some way spiritually.
It could be, need not be directly a spiritual interaction also, but just if they start feeling, ok, this seems to be, this person is intelligent, this person what they say makes sense, then that itself will help them grow in their spiritual journey. So, communicate our purpose. Communicate it in a way that the other person can understand.
So, when we do that, the focus is not getting them to do what we are trying to do. When there is communication, there are various levels of communication. This itself is a various different subject.
At the very least, what we do, we make it intelligible to the other person. Intelligible means, yeah, I may not agree with it, but ok, I understand where you are coming from. Above intelligible at the top level could be adoptable.
Oh, I also want to do this. Now, if they do that, that’s wonderful. But we cannot expect that to happen automatically.
What would be undesirable is that we come off as irrational, fanatical, judgemental. That is what we don’t want. So, all of this is good.
So, communicate our purpose in a way that the other person can understand. So, I gave a whole background to the story of this particular incident. Now, for Hanuman, the weight of responsibility, the joy of opportunity that was there, was all there for him.
For Maina, Hanuman cannot wait. I am grateful for the service that you are offering, but I cannot wait. It is extremely urgent.
I have to go right now. So, that is communication. What is the acronym we were discussing? Ideas.
So, D is this tank in an appropriate way. So, appreciate the gesture also means that we don’t have to ascribe ulterior motives to the other person. Like say somebody may offer us something which will be against our principles.
But that does not necessarily mean that they are trying to tempt us or deviate us. That they are offering it with good intention. So, now how can we tank in an appropriate way? Shri Prabhupada himself was extremely aware and grateful for everyone who had done any service.
During Prabhupada’s time there was a famous musician George Harrison. He chanted Hare Krishna and he inspired thousands and thousands of people to chant Hare Krishna. In fact, in that generation, most people who were introduced to chanting of the Holy Names, they were introduced through George Harrison’s songs like My Sweet Lord and others.
Now, what had happened was, he had heard the Hare Krishna Mahamantra before he met the devotees also. And he had thought it is some mystical chant from the East. And he just started liking it, he started singing it.
But he had no idea what it was. There was no internet, there was no Google, no chat GPT at that time. So, there is no one he could ask also.
So, this was the 1960s and now a lot of Indian immigrants all over the world. By 1960s there were very few Indians in UK. He was in UK at that time.
And even those Indians who were there in UK, they were not interested in the Indian religion. They only used to hide it. So, there was no one he could ask.
So, when he met Prabhupada’s disciples for the first time, Shamsundar Prabhupada, he was delighted. And then he met Prabhupada. And at that time the idea of practising Bhakti was, if you want to practise Bhakti, you just move into the temple.
You start living full time in the temple, that is practising Bhakti. Now, Prabhupada told him that you are a musician, there is, Krishna has gifted you with musical ability, you make songs about Krishna. And he started doing that.
So, Prabhupada didn’t tell him to move to the temple. Prabhupada didn’t tell him to get initiated. Prabhupada said, what ability you have, use it in Krishna’s service.
But then, something happened and everything seemed to be falling apart. Here in New York, in Madison Square, he did a performance. And thousands and thousands of fans had assembled.
And he asked them, chant Hare Krishna. And all that happened was, the fans, they started booing at him, throwing bottles at him. People started saying that, oh, George Harrison was such a great talent.
And he got mixed with the Hare Krishnas and the world has lost a great talent because of this cult. And then he met Prabhupada again. And he said to Prabhupada that, you told me to write songs about Krishna and that will attract people.
But I feel as if for every one person that I am attracting, there are ten people. I am trying to innovate from Krishna. I have to understand what is happening.
Say, suppose there is a World Cup, Cricket Cup, World Cup finals. In the last World Cup, India came to the finals, but India lost in the finals. It was very disappointing for everyone in India.
All Indians everywhere. But anyway, say, suppose some top player like Virat Kohli or Rohit Sharma or somebody, that person was a devotee. And in the post-match conference, he asked, you know, what happened? Why did India lose? At that time, say, the cricketer replies, Virat Kohli replies, actually, winning and losing, it’s all temporary.
You should just chant Hare Krishna and be happy. Now, the philosophy is perfectly right. But the timing of telling it is perfectly terrible.
Why? Because if you are a cricketer, you are paid to be a cricketer, then people expect you to perform as a cricketer. People are not coming to be a cricketer and expecting to get a preacher. Say, suppose a loved one in our family has got a heart attack.
And we take him to a devotee doctor. And somehow something goes wrong and they pass away. And you say, what happened? You know, whatever happened, life is temporary.
Just chant Hare Krishna. No. If I had to chant Hare Krishna, I would have been admitted in the hospital.
See, if we are in a particular role, we have to do that role properly. Our spirituality can be in addition to that role. If you have a heart surgeon, we may want that heart surgeon to, if the devotee is well and good.
But you know, if I have got a heart surgeon to be done, I want to know whether you are a good heart surgeon. If you are a good devotee, that’s wonderful. But in a particular role, the particular responsibility, expectation that is there, that is primary.
And then our devotion, our spirituality can be secondary. So, what happened was, George Harrison, people would come to him for his musical concerts. And the people who would come, they had a particular set of expectations from him.
And when he would just tell them to chant Hare Krishna, people were enraged by it. So, Prabhupada told him, use your intelligence. Use your intelligence about how you can attract Krishna.
Attract people towards Krishna. And then, after that again, he started writing novels kind of songs which he was writing before. And he started concealing or at least downplaying his connection with the Hare Krishnas.
And the newspaper said, oh, George Harrison is back. He has been freed from the grips of this terrible cult. And he is composing.
But then, discreetly, he would bring in Hare Krishnas. And people would still appreciate him because he was giving music in that time. So, now Prabhupada, many people thought that oh, George Harrison has become a devotee and then he gave up practise of bhakti.
And he went away. But Prabhupada did not see it that way. What Prabhupada saw was, when he was in his final days in 1977, now Prabhupada, one devotee had given him a necklace.
Prabhupada took out that necklace and said, give this to George Harrison. He is a very good boy. And so, Prabhupada in his final days, he remembered the service that he had done.
So, now would Prabhupada have appreciated the, many of the songs that he made were mundane songs. Would Prabhupada have appreciated the mundane songs? Well, Prabhupada would not want those mundane songs to be sung in our temples. Obviously not.
But that does not mean that’s your profession. You do that. So, Prabhupada found the right way to thank him.
Prabhupada is the guru. He is giving Krishna to everyone. But this George Harrison, in his position, he had taken a risk.
He had got pushback for it. But then he had found the right way to continue service. So, we need to, whenever somebody makes an offering, you thank in an appropriate way.
You may not accept the entire offering, but whatever it is, thank in an appropriate way. So, for Mainak, how did he thank? Manohar thanked by just bending down, touching Mainak. Mainak said that this was a test for you and you have passed the test in flying colours.
May you be blessed. So, generally, if you see, this is the last part I will conclude with, that in chapter 12 of the Bhagavad Gita, verses 13 to 20, Krishna talks about devotional qualities. But he talks about it in a very specific way.
He is not talking about qualities, he is more talking about qualities that endear a devotee to him. So, it’s interesting, the qualities that he talks about are not that my devotee fasts on Ekadashi. My devotee chants 16 rounds.
My devotee does puja every day. My devotee worships Shaligram. There is not a single devotional quality mentioned over there.
What do you mean devotional? In the sense of quality associated with a direct devotional activity. Krishna has mentioned that earlier. The 9th chapter has mentioned manmana, bhaumat, bhakto, satatam, kirtayanto, mam.
All those qualities are there. But here, Krishna is talking about behavioural qualities. Behavioural qualities means how does a devotee behave with others.
So, Krishna is talking about a devotee’s forgiving, a devotee’s kind, a devotee’s compassionate, a devotee’s non-agitating. So, these are basically human qualities. Human qualities, sattvic qualities.
So, any person who becomes a devotee is glorious. But if devotees are in Vrajoguna or Tamoguna, then what happens is, they may be connected with Krishna. They may be going toward Krishna, but in their going toward Krishna, by their behaviour, they are kicking people away from Krishna.
So, when somebody is in Tamoguna, most of us, we have heard this term, fanatics, religious fanatics. So, basically, this is, fanaticism is a result of Vrajoguna and Tamoguna. The fanaticism can be in words or it can be in deeds, in actions.
Those who are fanatics in words are called exclusivists. That means we have exclusive right to God. So, with respect to theology, this comes in the Abrahamic religions.
Jesus is the only way or say Mohammed is the only way. Their idea is, we alone have right to God. Anybody who is not following our way, that person is going to go to hell.
They are exclusivists. But there are also extremists. Now, extremists are actually much kinder than exclusivists.
They say, anyway you are going to go to hell, so why delay it? We will help you get there right away. So, these are extremists. But both are fanatics.
And it is easy to laugh at others. Now, these people are so intolerant, they are fanatical. In the Vedic tradition, there was very little theological exclusivism.
But there was a lot of ritual exclusivism. Ritual exclusivism means, you know, if you eat food with not this hand but that hand, if you do this with like this, if you touch it with like this, if you do this, if you don’t do this, then you are a fallen person. You are a sinful person.
You are a dirty person. And that was used to look down at others. And it’s how the caste system which was Varanashram originally as a system of socio-occupational engagement, this division of labour according to nature, that became a very judgemental and discriminatory system.
So, for us also, it is important that we don’t, in the name of our devotion, ever start looking down at others. We don’t become judgemental. So, anybody who is offering anything, anybody who is trying to do something, we thank in an appropriate way.
We may have certain principles. But we don’t have to look down at others because they may not be following their principles. I was just, a few months ago, in IIT Raukela, Raukela is in Odisha, not very far from Jagannath Puri.
I had a college seminar over there, confluence incident. So, I was there. And there they said, it was almost 7 lakhs, 7 lakhs, more than 7 thousand, few thousand students were there for the programme.
And after that, they had a one-night programme in the college. And then behind there was a guest room. And then the students were coming and meeting.
And many students came and met and talked. And there was one boy who was standing outside. He said, you have some questions? Please come in, he says.
Can I come in? I said, what do you mean? He was looking a little embarrassed. And he didn’t want to say. Then one of the boys who was there with me, he said that, you know, he is from an untouchable family.
So, I was a little taken aback. I immediately got up and pulled him over into a hug. And I told him, you take a selfie with us.
And now, you know, this is something from a very previous era. But then after that he was talking with me. He said that, and then some other boys were talking with me at that time.
They said that, you know, when we go to the Puri temple, or when we go to any temple, the priests are always just asking us for money. They are just, they are just asking us for money, asking us for this, asking us for that. And he says, when we go to a church, the priests there are so warm and welcoming and polite.
And they don’t discriminate against us at all. So, say that. So, I told him, this is unfortunate, but this is not actually, whoever you encounter, they are not really representative of Sanatana Dharma.
This is not the teaching of the Bhagavad Gita. Pandita Samadarshi is a really spiritual person. They will not be discriminating like this.
They will not be judging and looking down at people. So, the point is that, different people may come from different backgrounds. And, say for example, the temple, we may have our standards.
Say somebody comes and offers food to the deities. We may say, okay, we may not offer food directly to the altar, to the deities, if it is not cooked by people with particular standards. But by saying no, we don’t have to look down at those people.
We need to be polite. We need to thank them in an appropriate way. So, we may not take the food.
We may not offer the food to deities. But we can accept the food. We can distribute it to others respectfully, appropriately.
So, if we are not courteous, if we are not grateful, then we will end up humiliating people. Like I said, we may be going towards Krishna, but we will be kicking others away from Krishna. But what we should be doing is, we are going towards Krishna and along with us, if we are at least sattvic in our behaviour, we will inspire others also to come towards Krishna.
Maybe not at the same pace as we are going, but even with a slower pace, they will keep moving forward. So, that is the way to say a respectful no. We may say no to the specific offering, but we don’t say no to the person’s heart.
We don’t say no to the person’s intent. And that’s how we can, following the footsteps of our Lord, we can also be bhagrahi. So, I will summarise what we discussed.
I talked about how to say no. That was our topic. I went into elaborate background to illustrate, first of all, the gravity of Hanuman’s mission.
That Hanuman could have had every reason to just cursorily say no. Why was the gravity of Hanuman’s mission was there? First of all, because there was urgency to the search itself. Sita had been lost for a long time.
Then, there was the dynamics among the vanaras. How they had been entrusted, how they had been entrusted that particular mission. And among all the vanaras, Ram had specifically selected Hanuman and given him the signet.
And then, he had just remembered and regained his powers. So, the child Hanuman had been very indiscriminate in using his powers. He had been, we discussed how many people may have ability, but maturity is, does anyone remember what I mentioned about maturity? Maturity and ability, what is the relationship? Maturity is the ability to use ability wisely.
Hanuman had ability in his childhood also. But the childhood energy, childishness was there. So, the test that the curse had worked was that here Hanuman could have smashed the mountain out of the way.
The child Hanuman would have done that. His childhood exuberance. But he did not do that over there.
So, curse can be for punishment. But curse can also be for protection. Protection and transformation.
So, that was the reason Hanuman was cursed. And we discussed how through all this Hanuman’s grave mission was there. But when he came to Mainak, he said, no, there is a respectful refusal.
And discussed three parts of respectful refusal. What are three parts, anyone remember? A, C, D. A was? Appreciate the gesture. That even if that person is offering something, that is inappropriate for us.
But still we need to appreciate that person is offering something. And C was? Communicate what? Communicate our purpose or principles. And how do we communicate them? Politely, non-judgementally.
Especially politely I meant here descriptively, not prescriptively. Just tell what are we doing and why are we doing it. And last T was? Thank.
Thank in an appropriate way. So, now, in one sense appreciate and thank might seem redundant. They are same thing.
But no. Appreciate is internally, what is the attitude of the individual. This is just an interruption.
Why is this person interrupting? Why is this person deviating? Now, first we have an internal attitude of appreciation. So, this is more of our thoughts. Appreciate, communicate is words.
And a thank is in an appropriate way, this is more in terms of actions. So, when we do in this way, then although the person, although we may say no to the specific thing, we will not be saying no to the person’s offering. So, we are going towards Krishna.
But we want to ensure that we are not kicking people away from Krishna by our no. So, pushing people away, that is not the way we should be saying no. Rather, what we should be doing is drawing them towards Krishna, slowly, even drawing at their pace.
At least, what we are saying, at least becomes intelligible to them. It may not be adoptable, but at least intelligible. Ok, I understand why you are saying this.
So, that way what happens, I talk about three, intelligible, adoptable and then irrational. So, if we just keep explaining only based on scripture, then it may just seem irrational to them. So, we try to, whatever we are communicating, we try to communicate in a way that at least intelligible or even adoptable.
Thank you very much. Are there any questions or comments? Yes, please. So, how do you differentiate between appreciation and actfulness? I said appreciation is more of in terms of our own attitude.
We don’t have to go to that person’s suspicion. Thinking that, oh, this person is trying to deviate me. I am following principles, this person is trying to deviate me.
Say, if you are fasting on Ekadashi. Suppose, we are fasting on Nirjala and somebody offers us food. Now, we may not want to take the food, but we shouldn’t be thinking that, oh, this person is trying to break my fast.
Well, maybe it is like that, but we don’t have to start with that assumption. Generally, whenever any person is doing an action, which it may be inappropriate and we try to ascribe some motive to that person. So, let’s start with the least negative motive or the most positive motive.
This person is just out of service attitude, offering me food. Or this person doesn’t like it. This person can’t perform austerity, so he doesn’t want me to perform austerity.
And that’s why he is tricking me into breaking my fast. We don’t have to go in that direction. So, in our hearts, in one sense, gratitude means to see that anyone who is doing anything for us, that person is actually being kind to us.
When Prabhupada was in, you can sit down, please be comfortable. So, when Prabhupada was in Jaladuta, going to America, at that time, he wrote his diary, and then he says, I thank Lord Krishna from within my heart. I thank Lord Krishna for enlightening Sumati Moraji.
She was the person who had sponsored his trip. So, she had a cargo ship and that she had a cabin and Prabhupada was living in that cabin. He says, I thank Lord Krishna for enlightening Sumati Moraji from within her heart to make all these arrangements for me.
So, she had arranged vegetarian food for him. Now, most of the crew, they used to eat meat, but she had told Captain Pandey that, take abundant vegetarian supply for Swamiji. So, Prabhupada was appreciating that.
Now, did he specifically thank her for that? You know, later on, when he came to America, he was writing letters to her telling how his mission is going. So, in that sense, he was telling her that, what you have done, it’s work, we are trying to make it work. So, the appreciation is, this particular thing which he wrote in the journal, he did not tell it to her.
So, have an appreciative attitude when people are offering anything. Okay. Thank you.
Any last question before we stop? So, thank you very much. Ramachandra Bhagwan ki, Srila Prabhupada ki, Gaur Bhakta Vrinda ki, Gaur Prabhupada ki.