Karma is for encouragement not punishment– Karma Philosophy for a Brighter Future part 1 of 5

Transcript

This is an AI-generated transcript and may contain some errors.
I’m grateful to be here with all of you. And let us begin with reciting this monosyllabic Om.
We’ll recite this mantra. Om Namo Bhagavate. How many of you have heard this mantra before? Om Namo Bhagavate.
What is the last part? Vasudevaya. So what this refers to is Vasudevaya refers to the divinity that is within everyone and the divinity within which everyone is. So we try to invoke that divinity as we move toward exploring and learning wisdom.
So Om is of course invoking the divinity. Namo is offering our respects. Bhagavate is acknowledging the relational dimension of that divinity.
And then Vasudevaya is acknowledging the accessibility. The divinity is not far away. So we’ll recite the Om and we’ll draw it as long as we can.
And then we’ll recite Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya. So take three deep breaths. You can close your eyes if you want and relax as much as you want.
So together let’s draw the Om as long as we can. Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya Once more three deep breaths and then a long Om together. Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya One last time.
Once more three deep breaths and then a long Om. Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya Thank you. So today I’ll be talking on the topic of destiny.
What happened? Sorry. So we’ll talk on the topic of destiny and this is going to be a part of a series. We’ll be building up from the first session and moving on to the second and then finally we are having a one-day retreat.
We’ll be exploring each subject in further depth. So before I begin discussing about destiny, I would like to know when you hear the word destiny, our topic will be what is destiny? What is something like destiny really existing? Is everything destined? Or how much is destined in our life? So when you hear the word destiny, what does it imply to you? How many of you have heard of the word destiny? I think that is in everyone’s destiny to hear the word destiny. So what do you think destiny means? Okay, before I start, I’ll just, my name is a bit long.
So probably whatever the name you mentioned, it might be difficult. So my name, you can call me Chaitanya. So if you find that also difficult, you think of chai, the Indian drink.
You think of the female name Tanya. So Chaitanya. If you can, if you find that difficult, you can just call me monk or you can call me his majesty.
I will like that or your majesty. But Chaitanya is my name. So before we go into the discussion, so what does the word destiny mean to you? Yes, please.
Yeah, everything has to be like it is. So everything in my life happens for a reason and it has to be like that. So you can say things are meant to be.
So when we say they’re meant to be means they have to, we said there are two things, they are meant to happen and there is some reason why they happen. So the way you are using the word destiny, it is with a positive connotation. There is a certain level of acceptance, but there’s also some acknowledgement or appreciation that there is some reason why this is happening.
Yes, thank you. That’s one aspect of destiny. Destiny is something which is the consequence of our actions.
It’s not something which is fixed, but it is like when we apply two plus two, the four is predefined, but it cannot change, but applying two plus two is in our hand. So something which is not in our hand, but indirectly it is in our hand, not directly, but indirectly when we can do action, but a consequence of that action is destiny. Okay, so that’s a good intricate kind of analysis over here.
So what we are saying is that actions are in our hands, but the link between from action to the result is fixed and that link is what is called as destiny. Yes, so now this is related with the word karma and we will look at the relationship between karma and destiny as we move forward. So broadly speaking, in this understanding of destiny, that there is something in our control, but there is something which is beyond our control.
If I go on the Himalayan mountaintop and then if I go to a cliff and peer down from the cliff, that is up to me, but while peering down if I slip, then after that what happens is not in my hands. So once the action is set off, then a particular result is going to come. If I fall on a soft surface, I am fortunate, but otherwise it may be something different.
Yeah, thank you. Yes, please. Yes, for me it is a choice from our soul.
Choice from… Incarnation, destiny. Before the incarnation, the soul shows destiny. Okay, so it is choice from the past.
From the soul. From the soul. Can you explain what you mean by from the soul? The soul has got a target, the soul has got a place to go.
It has got a destiny. Oh, so you are using the word destiny in the sense of destination. Is that right? It is a plan before the incarnation.
It is a choice. Okay, now plan and choice are almost two opposite things, isn’t it? Okay, so when you are saying it is a choice from the soul, and so let me rephrase, before we are born, there is a particular plan that is arranged for our life, and that plan has come from our soul. So in that sense, it is a choice, but in our experience right now, it may not be a choice.
Is that what you are saying? It is a choice, that is why I immediately connected to the past. Choice from the soul means before this life, I am just trying to understand what you are saying. Before the start of this life, there was a plan that was set in motion.
And so in that sense, it is a choice, but now at present for us, it is something which is going on. It may not be a choice right now for us. Is that what you are implying? Or just the first part, there is a plan set in motion before the start of our life, and that is destiny.
So by soul you are using before the start of our incarnation. The soul is already here. Yes, true.
Okay, let us explore this further. We will come back to it. Anyone else? Destiny is like God’s plan for us.
Okay, destiny is God’s plan for us. So when it is God’s plan for us, does that leave any room for free will? Yeah. So yes, so there is plan, but within that plan, there is some room for free will also.
We will discuss how the two work together later. Yes, thank you. Yes, please.
So for me, it is the combination of the two. The karma does define a lot of things that happen in our life. And there is a God plan which cannot be changed.
I believe that. Okay. I don’t know.
So destiny is a combination of karma and God’s plan. So the way you are saying is karma, that is changeable. We can change.
Plus there is some divine plan that is there in our life that we can’t change. And destiny is a combination of both of them. In one sense, there is a whole set of concepts associated over here.
And destiny is one word that we are trying to use to refer to that set of concepts. Yes. Thank you.
Anyone last answer before we move on? Yes, please. Maybe determination will be connected with destiny. And how I can see this from the above, like there are two conceptions of relative destiny and absolute destiny.
In a sense, always like a father who brings his daughter or son and he says behind the corner there is a man who is selling ice cream. And that has the favourite ice cream of that child, his child. So he would actually know in advance that child would be very joyful when she sees ice cream man.
And she will know actually, he will know which ice cream child will take. But the child doesn’t know anything about it. He doesn’t see ice cream man at that time nor knows that she will choose or he will choose some particular ice cream.
So when you are saying relative destiny means from our perspective, it is relative because we are making the choice. It looks like we have, but determinism is a place for me. Okay, so destiny has the reference of determinism.
Yes, there is certainly a certain level of determinism to all our lives. We are born in a particular country, in a particular family, with a particular complexion, with a particular IQ level. Now these we can change to some extent, but we can’t really change it that much.
So yes, there is some aspect which is predefined in our life. Thank you. These are all very valid pointers toward the concept of destiny.
So I will start with, I will talk about three broad concepts during this session. At any time during the session, feel free to ask questions and I will feel free to not answer them. What I mean by that is, if the question is going to be answered a little later in this talk, or the question is tangential completely, then we will answer at the end.
But otherwise, I will answer immediately. So let us, in general, when we talk about philosophy, one aspect of philosophy has many different meanings to it. But the way I became interested in philosophy is that we try, we use philosophy to make sense of things that do not make sense.
That normally, in the routine course of life, most people do not really turn toward philosophy. That okay, I have this particular goal. I want to get this job.
I want to be in this relationship. I want to become fit. I want to become financially secure.
If our plans are working, then we do not really turn toward philosophy. Okay, I did this, I got this. But when things do not work out the way we expect them to, when basically things do not make sense, that is the time you start figuring out, okay, maybe I am missing something.
Maybe there is some other bigger picture that can help me to make sense of things. So at a basic level, philosophy is an attempt to make sense of things. And in that sense, I am using the word sense a lot here.
So in the sense of trying to make sense of things when they do not make sense, I will use the word sense till you lose all sense of what sense means. But in this particular connotation, in this particular aspect, philosophy is something which we all consider at some time or the other. We may not necessarily delve into philosophy systematically.
We may not necessarily explore the concept of destiny specifically, but the idea that I want to make sense of things. So one of the basic tools that we use for making sense is the concept of karma. Now, karma at a very fundamental level is nothing but the cause effect principle.
And this principle is universal. It is the basis of science. There would be no scientific advancement at all if there were not an implicit acceptance of the idea that things are related through a cause effect mechanism.
When Newton saw the apple falling, or some people say felt the apple falling, fell on his head. In fact, when I had gone to UK, he passed by the place where the tree is supposed to be there. It is not that tree, but the descendant of that tree.
It is re-Christian, renamed as a Newton tree. And many universities across the world import that tree. Say, okay, maybe if our students are sitting under that tree, and if the apple falls on them also, or without apple falling, they would also get some insights.
So the idea is there was an event, an apple fell. Now, Newton asked the question, what made it fall? So that is the idea where, okay, there is an event, I see an effect, there must be some cause for it. So that is the way we all function in science.
It is not just a function in science, that is also, there is human training. If we have a child, if the child does something right or good, we reward the child. The child makes a mess of things, we may withdraw some privileges, withhold some privileges.
Say, you have a teenager and the teenager drives without a licence, we say that, okay. Then you may not have internet access, you may take away your phone. So whatever is in this action and result, that is something to the universal principle.
So we observe it in nature, and we accept it in humanity, in our human training, the way we interact with people. So karma at a basic level is this itself. Now, it is a little more specific, there is action and result.
Often when we use the word cause and effect, it could be impersonal, depersonalised. This is okay, the object fell, and then it cracked apart. So there is action and result.
So we all understand that things do have consequences. So in that sense, we all accept karma. But the problem comes when this principle does not seem to work.
So normally, I would expect that if I do an action, I will expect a proportionate result. Say, if I do an action worth 10, I will expect a result worth 10. Say, if I am polite to you, I would expect that you will be polite to me.
And normally, it works like that. If we are travelling, we speak politely with the person sitting next to us, that person does the same. So we do see this correlation.
But the problem comes that if this were all that were true, then there would be no mystery, there would be no complexity. But sometimes it happens that we put in an input of 100 and we get an output of 10. There are some people in our lives, we do so much to please them, to try to serve them, to try to get on their good side, to enter into their good books.
And yet we do 100 things for them. And the only thing that they see is the 101st thing that we have not done. Or we do 100 things and they very grudgingly appreciate or acknowledge one of those things.
So how many of you have experienced this that we do a lot, but what we get is not proportionate? Anyone? Those of you who are not raising your hands, either you are extremely fortunate or extremely ignorant. So generally, it happens to everyone that we do things and we do not get the results. We may study for a particular exam, and we study very hard, but then we do not do well in the exams.
For whatever reason, we work very hard in a project and the project succeeds, but then the credit is given to someone else who has come later and who is more of a publicity hog. Now this can create questions. It can create resentment.
And it is perfectly understandable. This is what mainly makes us feel that life is unfair. Why are things like this? Now, if we are honest with ourselves, we may also acknowledge that there are times when we put in effort worth 10 and we got a result worth 100.
Sometimes, say in an exam, we study a little bit and that is the very thing that comes in the exam question paper and we get good marks. India is a cricket crazy country. So in cricket, there is one of the biggest tournament is the World Cup.
So the 50-year World Cup, in 2011, there was a World Cup which India won. Now in that particular World Cup, there was one player who was in the team, but he did not play a single match. He was not selected for any of the matches.
And yet in the final World Cup winning team picture, he was included. Now his only contribution was probably drinking drinks onto the field. So, in one sense, what he did was very little, but what he got was huge.
So there are some people in our lives, they are just so kind and sweet and helpful. And we all probably, if we look back at our lives, maybe a teacher in our school favoured us in some ways or just very helpful to us. Maybe if not in our immediate family, in our extended family or in our social circle, there are some people who are more kind to us than what would be in their natural reciprocation.
So we can say that here, this is also disproportionate. But this is disproportionate in a way that is favourable for us. And this we often tend to forget.
What we remember, somehow this is a quirk of human memory. That when life gives us something more than what we deserve, we often attribute it to either, oh, my luck or my hard work or whatever. And we memory hold it, we tend to forget it.
But when things do not work out according to our expectations, they fall below our expectations. That is what we tend to remember. So when, probably you noticed when I came, I needed crutches for walking.
So when I was one, I got polio. My parents, my mother, my father had a travelling job. So my mother took me to a clinic.
We were staying in a small town in the central of India, in a state called Maharashtra. So he took me to a clinic for giving the polio vaccine. And because that was a semi-rural place, the power supply there was quite inconsistent.
So somehow the fridge in which the vaccine had been kept had its power supply gone off, and the doctor had not noticed it. So the polio germs in the vaccine multiplied. And the polio vaccine, the injection, instead of preventing polio, it ended up giving me polio.
So when I was one, I do not remember any of this at that time. So I was just walking along one day and I fell down. After that, I could not walk normally.
Now my first memory of this is, probably I was two and a half, three, and some distant relative had come to our home. And she was consoling my mother, saying that it is so sad that your son got polio. And I remember my mother speaking in a very clear, confident voice.
Whatever he lacks physically, God will provide him intellectually. Now, I do not know what intellectual ability my mom had seen in me at that particular age, but somehow that statement stuck in my mind. And as I grew up, I could not play outdoor sports like most other kids could play.
But when I started studying, I noticed that I could understand things very quickly. I could remember things easily. I could articulate things effectively.
And I started thinking, yes, well, I did not do anything to deserve a disabled leg. But I did not do anything, as far as I remember, to deserve this intellectual ability, which was somewhat above average. So, in the big picture, in the long run, you can say, life is fairly unfair.
What do you mean by that? Yes, it is unfair. But sometimes we get less than what we deserve. Sometimes we get more than what we deserve.
Now, this does not mean that it is equal for everyone. We all may go through some bad phases where everything that we seem to do seems to not work. And there are phases when everything we do seems to work.
Like there is the Midas touch. If you touch something, it turns into gold. That is from the Roman mythology.
So, sometimes we feel we have a Midas touch. Every project that we started just flourishes. And sometimes we feel I got a reverse Midas touch.
I touch gold and it turns into copper. Whatever I touch, I seem to be destroyed. So, now, why does this seem to happen? So, that is where the concept of destiny comes in.
But before we go to a destiny, let us try to expand this picture. So, if I have done an effort worth 100 and I have got a result worth 10. One reason for this could be that maybe I have something negative coming from the past.
So, the result of this action is coming as a combination of my present action and my past action. We can see this in our day to day experience also. Say, if maybe while we are growing up, we were not very kind to someone, we are a bit mean to someone.
And then just a teenagerish phase or a childish phase which we went through. And now maybe 20 years down the line, 30 years down the line, we meet that person. Now, we may be very friendly, we have changed.
But we may be very friendly and that person may be very reserved, even cold. Now, they say, I am being so nice to you. Well, but you were not nice to me earlier.
So, past actions play a role in determining present results. So, this is where the principle of karma is valid. We said the philosophy and the philosophical concept of karma is meant to help us make sense of things that do not make sense.
So, what does not make sense is, if I am considering it from this perspective alone, it does not make sense. But if I expand the framework and consider that there might be something negative from the past, then that does make sense. So, if we expand our framework, not just to the past that we can remember, but even further, then what happens is, we may consider lives before this life.
I will talk about the soul shortly. But this expanding this framework is important. Now, we live in a world where unfortunately, there are biases and prejudices.
So, you know, people from this community are very stingy. People from this community are very violent. People from this group are very lazy.
There are these stereotypes that are formed. Now, the problem with the stereotype is not that necessarily it is wrong. The problem is that it is a invalid generalisation from a valid experience.
Yeah, I may have experienced that, you know, a person from this community cheated me financially. Maybe one person, two people, three people. But what has happened from there, I have generalised it.
And now, if I meet someone from that community, that person may actually be very trustworthy. But I am having that kind of psychological jet lag. When I see that person, I am actually not seeing that person.
I am seeing the community that that person belongs to. And I am imposing my perceptions. So, that means that person has to deal with me.
And that person may have to go through greater efforts than necessary, than normally required necessary for earning my trust. Now, of course, I from my side should try to avoid having such biases. We treat people as individuals, not just as members of a particular group.
But it is understandable. So, we all will encounter some biases, some prejudices. And if you understand it, oh, you know, okay, in this country, or in this region, we are treated like this.
We are seen in this particular way. And that is why we are treated in this way. So, we may have to work to correct that stereotype.
So, that is where the present action and the present result are not proportionate. So, sometimes, because there is a phase of negativity that has to be dealt with. So, this same thing could be extended to our previous lives.
So, one understanding is that if we begin at birth, and we end at death. And in between, we try to make sense of things as far as we can. And before this, there is a vast expanse of meaninglessness or non-existence.
And I did not exist. Or even if I existed, there is no meaning that exists. This was before and the same thing comes after also.
So, this is one way of looking at life. And this is quite arbitrary. So, if we consider that our life beginning, this is birth and death, death is not a termination as is thought over here, but it is a transition.
So, we are going through different lives. So, there is B1, D1, B2, D2 like that. We go through different lives.
And each of these is a transition point. So, in one life, we carry things over from the previous lives. And we all carry a baggage of unprocessed karmic reactions.
Now, the word karma is a bit complicated. Education has two different aspects to it. One is to what is complex, make it simple.
The other is what is simple, make it complex. Now, what do you mean by that? Why should we make things complex? Well, it is not make things complex. It is actually show that sometimes things are not as simple as you think.
So, like if we have a child and we are offering colour education. So, first step would be, the life around us can be very complicated. So, like when technology was being developed, initially, let me complete this point.
Initially, when we had television being developed. So, originally, there was just black and white. So, it was a replica of reality, but it is a very simplified replica of reality.
So, first, when we want to teach a child to identify colours, first we start with black and this is white. And the complexity of reality is reduced to simplicity. But then, while that is a good point to start the education, the education should not end at that point.
Eventually, we understand that there is black, there is white, but in between there is grey. There are many shades of grey, which lead to the richness of the many colours that we have. So, like that, at one level, karma is very simple.
That is, okay, actions, causes have effects, effects come from causes. Actions have results, if you are experiencing certain results, they must have some actions. So, that is making the complex simple.
But then, when things do not make sense, what do we do at that time? So, okay, what seems simple, maybe there is more complexity to it. So, education has both these aspects. So, especially when we are trying to understand the concept of destiny.
So, till now, I did the first part, I explained that how it is logical to consider that we might have something coming from the past, which is affecting the result that we are getting now. Sometimes it could be positive, sometimes it could be negative. So, now, I will move to the second part of how actions and results, the correlation between them could be quite complicated.
Yes, please. Sir, is it not escapism to say that what we cannot justify in this life, say that something in the last life or previous life has happened? Because if you convict a person, you have to tell him what he is wrong at and why you convicted him. So, in your case, sir, like you met so early with what you met.
How would God justify this? And would you put it back to the life that we all know may exist or may not exist? Yes, it is an important question. So, is it escapism? Certainly, it can be escapism. At the same time, it can also be acceptance of responsibility.
I will explain how it could be both. So, let me just, I will come to this point soon. So, the word karma can sometimes become a bit complicated.
I was saying that karma can refer to action, that we are all doing some karma. Right now, I am moving my hands, this is karma. Karma can also refer to the reaction to the action that we get.
So, we have a stockpile of karma from our past that we are going to get. Now, the karma can also refer to the principle of action-reaction correlation, that these two are related in a particular way. Now, karma can also refer to right action or duty that we should all do our karma.
This is often related with the word dharma. Now, I do not want to make things very complicated, but these two senses of the word karma primarily, our first three senses, that it can refer to the action that we are doing, it can refer to the reaction that we are getting, and it can refer to the system of action-reaction correlation. So, these are three broad meanings.
Now, specifically, when something has happened in our life, the principle of karma is often seen as a system of penalisation, of punishment, as you rightly said that if somebody is being punished, then they need to be told what is wrong. But to consider karma to be a system of penalisation is a very reductive vision of karma. It is one aspect of it, no doubt.
But we all need to start with reality as it is. No. So, we do experience in our lives that sometimes we do not get what we deserve.
Sometimes we get less than what we deserve. Sometimes we get more than what we deserve. That is something we all experience.
So, now, with this as a given, now, is it fair? Well, obviously, from this life’s perspective, it is not fair. But it is just the way things are. So, if this is the basis for how things are, now, how do I make sense of it and move ahead? So, the way I see it, karma, the implication of primarily of karma is hope.
It is not punishment. What do I mean by hope versus punishment? Hope means karma gives us the hope that our actions matter. The things that we are doing right now, they do have value.
Our actions matter even if they do not seem to matter. That when I am going through some difficult phase in my life, at that time, it may seem that whatever I am doing has no result. But what I am doing has result.
So, for example, say, two people are playing a musical instrument. Two people are playing a drum. And now both of them are playing a drum, but say one of them has spent 100 hours practising it.
And the other has just picked up a drum for the first time. And both of them are playing it. And what happens is, when the first person plays, or the person who has practised for 100 hours plays, he says, more.
And the person who has never practised that plays in a public forum. People say, no more. Isn’t it? That person says, oh, this is so hard.
And people think it is so hard to hear. So, what happens is, this person may say, okay, I am doing the same thing which this person is doing. And nobody is appreciating me, everybody is criticising me.
And initially, when that person seems to practise, there seems to be no result. You know, I am practising, still I am getting it wrong only. I tried it once, I tried it twice, I tried it thrice, I tried four times, I am still getting it wrong again and again and again.
So, what is going on over here? So, although there may be not much result coming, but the practise does have a result. Not everybody may become a musical genius, but everybody can rise to a certain musical level of functionality. And then we want to learn a language.
Some people are just polyglots, they just pick up languages the way other people pick up currencies. You know, it is very easy to collect currency, but you just learn this language and that language, that language. Some people find it difficult to even learn one language.
So, we all may have a different starting point, but our actions matter. So, the primary focus of karma is hope, that I am at a particular situation right now, and although why I have got here is difficult for me to understand. But if the focus is my actions matter, then okay, there is some negative karma that I am going through right now.
Once that negative karma phase ends, then the results will start manifesting. So, in that sense, it could be, see within the broad yoga tradition itself, there are two schools of thought, you could put as pendulum, that the action or how action works. So, if you want to understand this, these are called as karmavada and daivavada.
So, daiva is the Sanskrit word for destiny. So, karmavada is the idea that our actions determine everything. Our actions are all that matters.
You know, if you work, you will be succeeding. And daivavada holds that everything is destined, that destiny alone matters. Destiny is all that matters.
Our actions do not matter at all. People say that, oh, you know, your entire future is written in the palms of your hands. And we are all just puppets.
Nothing that we do will make any difference. So, these are considered two extremes. Sometimes acceptance of the philosophy of karma can actually take one towards daivavada.
That, oh, you know, everything is destined, what is the use of doing anything? No, the actual understanding is that there is karma, karma is action, plus daiva, plus kala. Now, kala is time. You could put it as duration.
So, these three things, they lead to phala. Phala is the result. So, when we get a result, it involves all these factors.
Karma, daiva, kala. So, consider a farmer. A farmer has to do the activity of farming, say, ploughing the field, sowing the seeds.
Then, but that alone will not guarantee the harvest. Then water has to come through rains. Now, we may have artificial irrigation systems, but still they also ultimately depend on the rains.
So, water has to come. And that is the daiva, that is the destiny. But after that also, kala.
It is not that even if water is abundantly available, the harvest is going to come tomorrow. It may take three months, it may take six months, depending on what crops you are cultivating. When the duration passes, then we get the phala, the result.
Say, a couple get married and decide to have a child. So, they unite, that is the karma. But then union alone does not necessarily lead to conception.
So, that conception is the daiva. And even after conception occurs, it is not that the next day they will have a child. That is the gestation period, that is the kala.
And after that, there is the phala, they will have a child. So, if we take out this complexity, that is what education means, sometimes to show how the simple is not so simple, there is complexity over there. So, the idea that yes, our past, my past has determined everything, so why should I do anything at all? If that is the attitude that is coming, that is escapism.
And that is unhealthy. So, that is where we are assuming that my past has complete control over my present and future. But the other extreme is to assume that my past has no influence at all.
So, the past does have some influence. Thank you. So, I will just make one more point here.
And then we will have some questions further. So, here, when we go through life, for all of us, this is actually a continuation of the same point. So, if we are, we are born.
Now, we have a karma baggage from the past. Now, this karma baggage is what is called as destiny in one sense. Now, where does this karma baggage come from? It has come from our past actions itself.
It is the past actions that have contributed to this baggage that we have right now. Now, this baggage is gradually discharged throughout our life. So, we get maybe one large instalment of this at our birth.
Like I mentioned, our genes, our social condition, many things are determined at birth. And after that, during the course of our life, there are times when this baggage unfolds in small or big ways. You could say in small ways, it is constantly unfolding.
You come into this room, and you wanted to sit on a chair, but you come a little late, all the chairs are occupied. Because that is also destiny. But that is like a minor instalment of destiny.
But sometimes there are major things that happen. So, destiny is fixed in the sense that the baggage of karma that we have created from the past and that is going to unfold in this life, that is fixed. At the same time, how it will unfold in our life is not necessarily fixed.
What do I mean by that? I will give two examples to illustrate this. Say, now, let us focus on the negative aspect of karma, because that is what often concerns us. Like I said, when things happen to us, good things happen, we do not really worry so much about it.
We forget it. But when bad things happen, then that is when we remember it. Say, suppose somebody is going to have four major problems in their life.
Maybe they are going to be betrayed in a relationship. Maybe they are going to have a health issue. Maybe they are going to have a financial loss.
Maybe they are going to be caught in a natural disaster. Maybe an earthquake, a famine, a tornado. So, suppose four major things are supposed to happen in somebody’s life.
Now, this we can say is going to happen. In that sense, destiny is determined. Now, again, I am simplifying things, life is quite complicated, but let us take this as an example.
Now, suppose in this life, the person who is going to be betrayed, it could be financially betrayed in a more heart to heart personal relationship, they are going to be betrayed. Suppose they in this life are polite and nice and helpful with others. Then still, some person may betray them.
But when they are betrayed by that particular person, because they have generally been friendly and polite and kind and helpful to others, others will help them at that time. On the other hand, if in this life, they have been mean and harsh and exploitative and arrogant, and then again, they are betrayed by someone, then what is going to happen? Nobody will come to help them. So, the betrayal itself may be unavoidable.
But what happens during that betrayal? Or what resources we have to face that betrayal, that could be determined by our present life and our present actions. Some people may say that, you know, I always was regulated in my eating, I did exercise, I did this, I did that. And still I got cancer.
How terrible, how unfair life is? What is the use of taking care of my health? What is the use of following all these rules if still, there is this whole category of diseases for which we just do not know any cause? It seems so arbitrary. And that is one way of looking at it. That, you know, I was so disciplined and still I got cancer.
Life is so unfair. Or we could look at from another way, that if I had been eating unhealthy, if I had no habit of exercise, then this cancer would be far more devastating. Because I have had healthy habits or because I have cultivated healthy habits.
So, I have a certain level of robustness in my body. I have a certain level of resilience. And the impact of that, the negative impact of that on my body will be lessened by it.
So, our present actions do matter. That is why I said the primary implication of karma is that our actions matter even when they do not seem to matter. But because of our past, the way the destiny has set up for us, we may go through a phase where our actions do not seem to matter to us.
But that is the call factor. That is the period when we have to go through difficulty. But if we push on, that no phase of time is permanent in this world.
Everything, in the worst of difficulties, they are time bound. They come with an expiry date. The only thing is we may not know what is the expiry date.
And that may make it very difficult to deal with it. But essentially, our actions do matter. So, is destiny fixed? Well, yes, in one sense, certain things are destined and it is not fixed by somebody else.
It has been fixed by our own actions from the past. At the same time, what is fixed is that what is fixed is the destiny. But what is not fixed is the unfolding of destiny.
Unfolding of destiny means how things work out. Or sometimes people say that we are the master of your destiny. Well, that is a bit of an overstatement.
We are not the masters of our destiny, but we are the makers of our destiny. So, are we masters? No. What do we mean by masters? Masters would mean that we control how destiny will unfold.
But we do not control that. But are we the makers of our destiny? In the sense that do our actions matter? Yes, they certainly matter. So, with respect to destiny, we are the makers of our destiny.
We are by our actions creating a future for ourselves. Our good actions right now may not seem to necessarily be contributing to a good future, but they will. And how exactly they will contribute? And how much our past will influence us in the present? How much room do we have in the present based on our destiny? That whole topic I will be discussing in tomorrow’s session.
And I will be talking further in the retreat, which we will be having about the psychological aspects of destiny. I talked about how destiny determines situations. But how much does destiny determine our actions itself? Are some people just destined to be short-tempered? Are some people destined to be in a particular way they cannot change it? So, those we will be discussing later, but I will let me summarise right now.
We were discussing the topic of destiny today. And I discussed three main points. First is that we are trying to make sense of things that do not make sense.
That is the essence of philosophy. And while we are talking about the essence of philosophy, we are also focussing specifically on the philosophical concept of karma. So, what is it that makes sense that I do an action and I get a result? But what happens when I do a large action, but I get a result? So, this is where things don’t make sense.
And the way we, one way we can try to make sense of this is that we expand the framework. That if I am being nice to someone and that person will be not nice to me, that may be because in the past I was not nice to me. So, that is where the idea of our past karma affecting our present karma comes in.
So, right now, my actions might be positive, but in the past they might have been negative and that is why the result I might get will be less. So, now this can work in a positive way, this can work in a negative way. So, we can say life is fairly unfair.
So, karma can help us to make sense of certain things. Now, when we are using philosophy, so philosophy is a tool to make sense of things, but that tool is only as good as the people using that tool. So, we discussed about the tool, the philosophical tool of karma.
It could be misapplied or misused. So, one is that only present actions matter, that if you work, you will succeed and nothing else matters. That is called karmavata, only past actions matter, that is daivavata.
So, we discussed the balances that there is karma in the sense of present actions, there is daiva in the sense of past actions, there is kaala, time in terms of the phase that we are going through and then that will all contribute to the falla. So, we discussed how is destiny fixed? Yes and no. Yes, in the sense of that the quantity or the baggage of karma that we have to deal with, that is fixed from our past lives, but it is no in the sense that how it is unfolding, how it will come in our life, that is not fixed.
So, we are not the masters of our destiny in the sense that we do not control its unfolding, but we are the makers. So, the affirming implication of karma is that karma implies that our actions always matter, our actions matter, even when they do not seem to matter. Thank you very much.
Pray Krishna. Yes, we have, do we have sounds, mic? Yes, please. Here.
Sir, I have a question that as you said our actions matter. Hello. Just before coming to this evening for wisdom talk, I was just thinking in my mind that I will ask a question how the destiny works and when I come here, this was the topic.
So, I am thinking if it is my action also influencing the collectively actions or results or collective actions also influencing me. So, if it only our actions matters, why the collective things also having the results or if collectively something happening around us, it also influence us. So, others’ karma can also affect us.
Yes, like I said education means you simplify the complexated and then you complexify the simple. So, yes, there is the social dimension of karma also. Like I gave the example that if somebody is born in a particular community against which there are prejudices, then what is going to happen is that that person will have to deal with that.
So, you can say that is the collective karma coming from that particular affiliation of that person that they belong to that particular community. So, from a positive perspective, say, so, I understand your question, but I am going to a little background, say, without getting into any mystical aspect to it. So, when we are trying to look at karma or the action-reaction correlation, there is a rational way of looking at it and I would not use the irrational, but there is a mystical way of looking at it.
So, right now, I am focussing on the rational aspect. There is a mystical aspect to it, but that we will discuss it when we go into the psychology of things. Right now, I am not going into the role of the mind and how psychology affects things.
But from a rational perspective, say, now you have this question and say, you are representative of not necessarily entire, but representative of a particular community, we are all of a particular age group, particular demographic, and of course, many of you are from different demographics, but this is a common question that people have. So, it is that you are a particular phase in your life, you are at a particular geographical place and you are spiritually inquisitive. So, it is quite likely that others would also have a similar question and that is why that question comes up.
So, there could be a rational explanation for that. That, okay, these are typical questions that people have and I went to a spiritual talk and there was a question like that. That is one rational way of looking at it.
Now, a more, again, I say not irrational, but you can say trans-rational. So, mystical is more like trans-rational. There is a different level of rationality to it.
So, it is that there are times when a person has a particular question in their mind. Now, we are all connected through the collective consciousness of the divine. So, speakers are inspired to speak certain things at certain places.
As I travel across the world and speak, now I may be asked to speak on the same topic and I may go into the session planning with a particular outline. But the same topic in two different parts of the world, I may speak substantially differently. Although I had planned to speak similarly because I see and respond to the audience.
Now, I could say the rational aspect is I have observed the audience. I see what their needs are, what their level is and I am speaking. But there is also a mystical aspect that when I am speaking a particular point, I suddenly get a particular example, I think this example fits better than that example or this particular way of explaining will be more relatable.
And those are just thoughts that pop into me. We all have this experience of inspiration. Inspiration is almost like some answer, some clarity, some strength comes inside us from some source that is separate from us.
It is almost like it is placed inside us at that time. So, it can also happen. So, it could be that your earnestness in seeking an answer brought you to a place by a divine arrangement where that answer was being delivered.
So, in our actions, there is influence of divine choices as we are saying. So, as we said, we are the product or we are the product or what we are in the present because of our past. So, if we look in the broader picture, who have given us the first karma, if somebody is having the first life, how he is having the life, if there is a… See, the question of first karma itself is a bit paradoxical because one of the common term that is used in the karma philosophy is anadi karma.
Anadi is that which is beginningless because we are spiritual beings. The soul is eternal. That is why there is no such thing as the first karma.
It is almost like trying to find the starting point of a circle. Now, as the circle is there, you could say while drawing, the circle started from a vertical point. But a circle itself is not like a line, where a line starts from here and ends over there.
A circle by definition is circular. So, in fact, we do not reach anywhere. We reach in the same point as we are saying, karma moves from here to here.
There are two different things over here. One is that tracing the beginning of karma. See, that way, like I was answering the earlier question that generally the focus of karma is forward, not backward.
The focus of karma is not that you did bad things and therefore you have to suffer now. It is not, that is why karma is based on some mystical revelations of what you have done in the past and because you did this in the past, that is why this happened to you. So, once we start looking at karma as an existential way of functioning, existential means existence is given.
This is the way existence is right now. What is the way by which I can accept this existence and function effectively within it? So, if you start from that perspective, that is the most sensible way. That way, otherwise leave alone the first karma that began things.
We could go into, okay, what karma led to I being taller than this person or shorter than this person or fairer than this person or darker than this person or smarter than this person or dumber than this person. We do not know that at all. So, karma is not meant for post-mortem.
Now that this has happened, now what happened here, what happened there? Karma is meant more for prognosis. It is not past centred, it is future centred. Okay, my actions matter, therefore let me choose my actions carefully.
But then where is the free will if we say we can choose and things are happening with divine will. So, what is the right way to say? That is what I am going to talk tomorrow elaborately, but I will quickly mention over here that see the Bhagavad Gita in 9.6 gives the example that if we have the sky, the sky is something like an upside down ball. And within that if there is some wind, now this looks like the eye.
Does it look like the wind? I do not know how you draw a wind over here. So, now the wind can move left, right, up, down, but the wind stays within the perimeter of the sky. Like that for all of us by a higher arrangement, we have free will, but that free will is within a boundary.
That boundary is called Kshetra. So, right now I can get angry, you can get angry. And if I get angry, I might yell at someone, you get angry, you might hit someone.
But if the President of America gets angry, they can nuke an entire country. President of Russia gets angry, they can do the same thing. So, at present, we all have different levels of Kshetra and that determines what we can do.
So, our free will is within the Kshetra, within the field of control that we have. And that field of control is determined by our past karma under the plan of God. So, there is a divine plan which determines the area over which we have control.
But within that area, what we do is up to us. So, free will operates within a particular set of parameters. Like a horse is tied by a pole to a pole by a rope.
So, if the rope is long, the horse has some freedom to go here and there, but it cannot go beyond the perimeter of the rope. So, like that destiny and free will work together. So, this free will is also distinct from our past? Free will is up to us.
That is what is going to, that is what the psychological aspects of karma and how much our past actions shape our present actions. So, it is not entirely distinct. We do have free will.
If there were no free will, then the whole idea of karma would become evil. The whole idea of God would become evil. Why? Because one aspect of karma is accountability.
If we do good, we will get good results. If we do bad, we will get bad results. But, say, imagine if there is some kangaroo republic or some kind of country where there is no rule of law and some crime has happened and the police catch some innocent person and bring that person, put a gun in the hand of that person and force the persons, put their fingers on the hand of the bullet, on that hand and the hand of the bullet, force the person to shoot someone and then arrest him.
You kill that person. But, that person has done nothing actually. So, if somebody is forced to do something and then they are punished for doing something, if you consider such police to be evil.
Now, if destiny were like that, that we are accountable for our actions, but our actions are not in our control, then this whole system would become barbaric. It would become utterly evil. So, we do have free will.
Now, the extent of our free will can vary, but our present choices are not determined by our past choices. They are affected by our past choices. So, they are influenced, but they are not controlled by our past choices.
So, that will, more we are going to discuss in tomorrow’s session. Well, I have, I did not get my answer fully, but… I do not think anybody has, he, in the introduction, he said, I have all answers. I do not think anybody has all answers.
Krishna himself says, Gahana Karmanu Gati. So, I will just make one quick point before answering, completing this answer, then we will move on to other questions at the end. See, suppose somebody is an alcoholic.
They say, I just cannot stop drinking. Okay, maybe it is true. But is it completely true? When some, that person is drinking, you know, every 3-4 hours I get the urge to drink.
So, when that urge comes, I have to drink. Okay, maybe that is true. But in between those 3-4 hours, they do not have to drink.
But if they say, okay, I have no free will, whenever I get the urge, I will drink. But that does not mean they keep bottles all around them all the time. So, maybe the urge comes after every 4 hours, and that time they cannot not drink.
But between those 4 hours, they can choose to not drink. Somebody else may say, I will drink once in 4 months. I will not say, I do not want to drink at all.
So, those people, their Kshetra might be more. So, yes, can our present choices be influenced by our past? Yes, in the sense that for some people, okay, after 4 hours, I have to drink. But that does not mean that I have to drink 24 hours.
No, there is always some room for free will. And gradually we can increase that room by positive choices. Well, you said this free will boundary.
I think let us move on to other subjects. You can later approach personally. Thank you.
Thank you so much. You had a question also? Yes. Thank you for what you are sharing today.
I understood from what you say that the karma unfolds in our life, and we just have to make sense of it, but we cannot change it. It is just the action that will make things different. Yes, we cannot change it in the sense that, say, somebody is born in a very hot country or a very cold country.
They cannot change the weather of that country. They cannot change the climate of that country. But they can do certain things.
Maybe you develop technology where, you know, one of my friends was just gone to Japan, and I may also go in the future, but he was telling me about how it is so prone to earthquakes. And you cannot change that. The seismic plates of the earth, you cannot control that.
But then they have developed technology by which, you know, the homes that are made, even they collapse. They are not made of such heavy material that people get crushed under it. So there is some level of change that can be done.
So our present actions of people who have lived over there over generations, have used their intelligence, have thought of what causes damage, and have tried to minimise it. And that is good. So our present actions do matter.
But they cannot change things completely. That is why I said destiny is fixed. But the unfolding of destiny is not fixed.
That Japan is an earthquake prone country, that is fixed. But the unfolding of it, that is just standing. The fact that Japan is earthquake prone, that is just standing, that is fixed.
But the unfolding of that, okay, when an earthquake occurs, how much damage will happen? So if we are resourceful, if we are intelligent, if we are doing our present actions properly, we can minimise the damage of that. Okay. From my experience, if for example, the karma unfolds when you are young, and all your life, like for many years, is just happening again, this karma, for me, I have at the same time believed and I have experienced that the origin of the karma unfolding in the past can be changed.
Yeah. See, there is, this is where the concept of samskaras is what we will be discussing elaborately in the retreat. See, there are certain behavioural patterns that arise.
Say, for example, somebody was abused in their childhood. And then it can go both ways. Either they end up becoming abusers or they attract abusers.
It can go, but it can go another way also that they learn from it. You know, I was abused. Now, I do not want, I will never abuse others and I will prevent others from being abused also.
So it could go different ways. But yes, there is our past, which triggers a certain set of reactions. And it will require conscious effort to address and change it.
Otherwise, those patterns can keep repeating. Like an alcoholic, they are drunk once, twice, thrice, ten times, nobody is born with a bottle of alcohol in their mouth. They chose to drink, but by choosing to drink, what happened, that became a compulsive pattern.
So with respect to alcoholism, it is relatively easy to understand. But with respect to say, some scars from the childhood, some impressions of abuse, it is a little more complicated to understand. But yes, we can go to the past and to the extent we can understand it, we can address the needs and address the underlying causes.
So basically, pain, we will all face in our life. Pain, we can either transmit pain or we can transform pain. Yes.
So that is the choice that each one of us has. And if we don’t process it, we can keep repeating it and keep transmitting pain. And they say hurt people, hurt people.
I was hurt, and so I hurt you. And then you hurt someone else. But we can try to change that.
That’s where transforming comes in. And how do you call the concept? Sorry? How do you call this concept of like changing what happened in the past to not repeat it again? So it’s kind of changing the karma? So that is basically what is purification. Purification of the samskaras.
Samskaras are basically like the bijas, the seeds from which our action, our behavioural pattern is emerging. So purification can change that. Okay.
Thank you very much. Yes, please. So where does that baggage reside? That is my question.
Where does the baggage reside? Where does it get stored? Okay. See, all this is subtle. So we ask where in terms of physical location, when we are using the question, the very word where conveys the idea of a physical location.
So is there a physical location? The whole concept is non-physical. Like say, you have one phone, and your phone breaks, or it becomes old, you buy a new phone. Now, once you enter your Gmail password, immediately your preferences, your access, your emails, your contacts, all that gets connected.
So now, where is it stored? You could say it’s stored in the cloud, it’s stored in Google servers. But then even if you go to the particular Google servers where they’re storing it, it’s like there’s a hardware over there. And if you look at even a hardware in a microscope, it’s just digital circuitry.
See, this is stored over here. We can conceptually say, okay, this is stored in C drive in this particular folder or whatever. But when you go to the physical drive, it’s very difficult to say that, okay, in this particular chip, this particular information is stored.
So, it’s a subtle thing. So, the Karmana, so there is a system where this whole karma is a principle that works. And there are divine overseers of that.
There are also psychological impressions within it. But it’s not that it’s one location which is stored. It’s more like a subtle reality, which accompanies us and manifests at particular times.
So, is there anyone who is keeping an account of it? Well, again, we are putting very literal or physical conceptions on something which is very subtle. So, is there, this is a system of accountability. But we can say that, is this system of accountability accountable to someone? Of course, it is.
But to say that it is a particular person who is keeping a record in a particular place and each action that is happening, this person is dealing with this person now, let that person react in that way. That, it is not that simple. It is a subtle system by which the action-reaction mechanism gets correlated.
Yes, there is definitely accountability of the system of accountability. So, there is oversight of that. But it’s not, we can’t apply or extrapolate physical conceptions to non-physical realities.
Thank you. One last question. Hare Krishna, Prabhuji.
Actually, I want to ask a question related to my personal life. Actually, I have not done bhakti in my entire life. So, I was searching for some answers in my past.
And suddenly, a magic happened and I got perfect answers to my solutions, which I was searching. And I got to bhakti suddenly. And so, I want to know the answer, why did the God gave me bhakti all of a sudden? That’s my question.
Okay. So, if we didn’t have a spiritual devotional background, but then we got to bhakti. So, there are broadly, when the spiritual search begins, there is a result, a complex combination of human and divine factors.
So, the human factor could be the personal or the social. That means, some people at a human level, they have a spiritual search within them. And they seek answers.
Social is that we may not eventually ourselves be seeking answers, but say, we are in a community where there are others seeking answers, not only seeking answers, but others are seeking to share answers with others and the social aspect of it. But beyond that, there is the divine aspect. So, for example, somebody may share some wisdom literature, not in today’s world, on social media, somebody has targeted Facebook advertising for some programmes.
Now, we may target it to, okay, this particular demographic. But within the demographic, the algorithm chooses some people. And why do they choose those particular people? Among those particular people, there are so many people they choose, they just by almost like a, almost by a whim, they click on a particular audience and say, okay, this programme, let me go and check out the programme.
So, there is much that rationality cannot explain. So, where the divine comes in, that is where the concept of mercy or grace, Krupa that comes in. So, if we ourselves are not seeking, then that indicates that God has been seeking us.
And it is God who has come in our lives. That is how we have got that grace. So, we may not, we may not be interested in God, but God is always interested in us.
We may not have a place for God in our heart, but God always has a place for us in his heart. So, that is how our spiritual journey begins, even when we have not much, against much interest in it. Thank you for that question.
So, thank you very much for your thoughtful participation. Hare Krishna.