Are Krishna bhaktas outside ISKCON at the neophyte stage?

From Ranjith A U Nair Prabhu

During our course of ISO, we discussed about 3 levels of devotees. In NOI also we are re-visting the same topic in more depth. Can we consider Krishna devotees outside ISKCON, who does’nt yet have knowledge about our paramapra and teachings (say they are chanting some mantra of Krishna and maybe reading other versions of BG/SB) as neophyte devotees? As per the discussion in ISO the qualities of those devotees match that of a neophyte.

Answer Podcast:

Thank you Hare Krishna Question Are Krishna devotees outside the Outside ISKCON At the neophyte Kanishka stage In the Isha Upanishad as well as the Upadesha Amrit We see the characteristics of Devotees at different levels Now there may be devotees People who have some devotion to Krishna And they may be reading some Version of the Bhagavad Gita The Bhagavatam But they are not connected with the proper Sampradaya So can we say that they are at the neophyte level Answer Yes If we are talking not just about ISKCON But if we are talking about broadly The proper The four Sampradayas Then those who are not connected with the four Sampradayas Generally speaking They have practice in bhakti But they are not connected with Devotees So the defining characteristic The characteristic of The Of the Kanishka stages There is some appreciation for Krishna But there is not much appreciation for devotees So They can be People who practice Who study scripture out of some curiosity Or out of some cultural upbringing Or because of Hoping for some material gain All these people can be said to be at the Kanishka stage Artho Jigyansura Artharthi Krishna Artharthi talks about people who approach him For different Motives, material motives Relief from distress, curiosity Or Artharthi for gaining some wealth So these kind of people Usually are at the neophyte stage And Over Bhaunam Janmanamalite Ganaman Mam Pratamriti It may take many lifetimes for them to come to the level of Understanding Vasudeva Sarvamiti To understand that Krishna is everything And this understanding that Krishna is everything Comes primarily Through the association of devotees So Rather than saying that Those outside this corner Are Kanishka bhaktas We can say that those who Do not appreciate the value of devotees Appreciate the value Of the living community of bhaktas Those people Are Neophyte devotees They appreciate The value of The living community of devotees And such communities are not Restricted to ISKCON alone There are different sampradayas And the bhakti tradition Is very broad So Yes, if people do not appreciate The association of devotees Then definitely Their devotion is not very advanced And broadly speaking The important point Is not that we This sort of classification We should not use it to judge others or demean others Sometimes some people May have practiced bhakti To a very advanced level To quite a substantial level Not very advanced but substantial level in the previous life And in this life They may not have connection with any parampara But still they may manifest Very strong and serious Devotion So if they manifest like that we need to understand that We need to respect bhakti Wherever Bhakti Devi chooses to manifest Her mercy So the sampradaya Is primarily for Sampradaya That which gives us a systematic way Sampradaya is the way By which systematically Knowledge of scripture is given And there are great devotees Who may not be connected to sampradaya but usually They do not take the role of teachers Of others So if you want systematic knowledge We need to go to the University And get knowledge from there Sometimes in a house a grandmother knows Some traditional medicines But then a grandmother won’t Be a doctor if somebody has got a severe heart disease Or a cancer or something like that So similarly There can be bhakti And there can be even genuine deep bhakti In people Who may not be connected with the sampradaya But if one wants to get Systematic knowledge of bhakti Especially if someone is a teacher of bhakti That person needs to be connected with the sampradayas And If one does not appreciate the value of devotees Then definitely that is a characteristic So sometimes devotees Sometimes the people may be away from the sampradayas In the sense of Not having connection with them But they may have had connection in the previous life And they may have Great devotion also So we can’t make blanket statement but generally We can definitely say that if a person does not Appreciate the value of devotees Then that indicates a neophyte stage Of devotion Thank you