Glorious Journey of HH Radhanath Swami Maharaj Special Talk – Chaitanya Charan

Disclaimer: This transcript was generated using AI and may contain occasional errors or inaccuracies.

Hare Krishna. Thank you very much for coming here today evening. And I am humbled and honored to have this opportunity to speak about His Holiness Radhanath Swami Maharaj.

Can the windows be kept open? See if we close it, the noise will be lesser. Will it be too stuffy? Okay. So recently we celebrated the festival of gratitude where the 75th Appearance Day of Radhanath Maharaj was celebrated.

So when I had met Satsvarupa Maharaj in New York. Satsvarupa Maharaj is the disciple of Srila Prabhupada, very senior disciple who ruled the Leela Amrit. And he mentioned to me that, seeing the conversations with him and about him it came up, he had a lot of association of Srila Prabhupada personally.

And yet he said that when I wrote the Leela Amrit, I felt much closer to Prabhupada. And he told me that, many devotees have said after reading Prabhupada's Leela Amrit, although even those second generation devotees who never had association of Prabhupada, they also get a deeper understanding of Prabhupada. In fact, when the Palace of Gold was built, the Palace of Gold is a mansion that was built in New Vrindavan to glorify, it is called Prabhupada's Palace of Gold, to glorify Prabhupada.

So the leader who built that project, so that project got completed first and then the, is there any problem, I think? Reesam. So the leader who built the Prabhupada Palace of Gold, he read Leela Amrit and he said to Satsvarupa Maharaj that, that the Leela Amrit will do more to attract people to Prabhupada than the Palace of Gold. So Satsvarupa Maharaj told me that this is a very, this is very very heart touching for me.

So this was meant, this was nearly a decade ago. But since that time I had a desire to write about Srila Prabhupada and write about my spiritual master. They are two primary inspirations for me, Prabhupada and Radhanath Maharaj.

So I wrote one book about Prabhupada, Prabhupada Prayers, which was the marketing of Bhagavad Dharma. So this year, by Krishna's mercy, those two spiritual desires of mine were fulfilled. So I wrote this book, but when we wrote this book, we were not sure how Maharaj would take it because Maharaj doesn't like to be glorified too much.

You see the entire Govardhaneko village, if you go there, it's a project which is entirely Maharaj's vision, but you won't see Maharaj's photos anywhere. So we published the book, we got it out by the 75th Vyasa Puja, but then I didn't have the courage to give it to Maharaj personally. So I asked the senior devotee to give it to Maharaj.

And then afterwards I met Maharaj. Maharaj said the book came to me, but the author didn't come to me. So while writing the book, so basically the last 10 years I have been traveling across the world, and while we in India, we often feel we don't get much association of Maharaj, but we can at least go to Mumbai, we can go to Yatras.

There are, for example, Australia and New Zealand is the places where Maharaj has never gone. He's not planned to go also. So I found that I knew something about Maharaj as I started talking about it.

The more I talked about it, the more I understood, then I, that's how I decided to write this book. So I'll talk about one main or two main parts of the book today. Basically the book is called Radhanath Maharaj, Life, Lessons and Legacy.

So the book is not technically a biography. I'm not covering his life systematically. But in the life, I have given an overview of his life.

In the lessons, I focused on my interactions with him and what I learned. And in legacy, I've talked about the various projects. So I won't go into the legacy part today.

I'll focus on the life and the lessons. And the life also, I'll go over briefly. And the lessons is where I had interactions with him, I'll focus on that.

So, any problem? Can everybody come and sit and listen? We sound the bag. You all can come. You can come to here.

As we said, others also can come and sit. They can understand what is being said, all of you. You can sit closer here.

Now we go in that way. You have to care for it. So basically, in the book, I have, based on whatever I have understood about Maharaj, I try to divide his life into different stages and focused on one distinctive virtue that he demonstrated during that stage.

So I use the acronym Radhanath. So, R was basically his very search for God that was driven by his realizations. If we read the Journey Home book, what we'll find is that it's not that somebody taught him truths.

It's that he observed and he learned. So that observational learning which is leveled into enlightenment by natural path, we have the Avanti Brahmana. So Maharaj, he grew up in a culture where meat-eating was normal.

But just by his observation, he realized how violent it is and that this is not something I want to be a part of. Like that, observing and learning. So I won't go into that part too much.

But when Maharaj had written the Journey Home book, around 2005-2006-2007 he had completed it. So I had written a few books by that time and I had given some of the copies of my books to Maharaj. So basically, Maharaj gave his book to me saying that you read it and tell me what you think about it.

So then I read it and I met Maharaj. I said the stories were extraordinary but what struck me the most was the tone of the book. You are not writing this as a Guru telling his disciples but you are like a friend sharing experiences with friends.

So Maharaj said, he became thoughtful and he said, I appreciate your appreciation. And then he said that this is the tone you need to reach out to western audiences. India is also becoming westernized.

If you understand this tone, then you will also be able to reach out to larger audiences. So I will talk about what that tone means a little later. But broadly speaking, it is not so much that I learnt this truth from this source, and therefore I will teach this truth.

This is what I learnt from my experience. And that realization, that is something which is almost universally attractive. See, somebody doesn't accept Bhagavad Gita, somebody doesn't accept a particular authority.

Then that book teaches this, why should I accept it? But experience, so that was the search of Maharaj. See, most of us, we didn't go out in search for God. You know, the devotees of God came out in search for us.

And they found us at different places. So, Maharaj was driven by that realization that something is missing in life and I want something more and whatever is required for it, I will do that. So, that itself is quite extraordinary.

Then after that, this was 1950-71. Then the second phase is absorption. Where he was in New Vrindavan from 1972 to around 79.

And here, he is completely disconnected from the world, focused single-handedly on, not single-handedly, single-mindedly. Ok, single-mindedly and single-handedly actually. So, single-mindedly focused on Deity worship and the main Deities of Radha Vrindavan, Chandra Vrindavan.

But Maharaj had worship of the Deities of Radha Vrindavan Nath. And they were high up on the hill and practically nobody would come. So, normally when we do some service that we expect some appreciation, some kind of approval, some kind of recognition that I am doing this service.

Otherwise, it becomes very difficult. See, if everyday we are coming and cooking, we are doing garlands, we are doing Deity worship and nobody even notices what we are doing. Then it becomes very discouraging to continue on.

So, we need reciprocation in the world. But Maharaj alone doing Deity worship and at that time, nowadays Deity worship means we have a whole practically army of devotees. But there at that time Maharaj had to single-handedly do all the cooking, all the offerings and all the backup services alone.

There was nobody else. And on top of that, he was also told for some time that you come down from the top of the hill to below so that you can do night kirtans. So, practically he had very very little sleep for many years.

The only sleep was some nap he would get after making offering to the Deities before the offering comes out. Like that 4-5 times he would sleep for 15-20 minutes. So, other devotees have asked, I have also asked Maharaj about this.

We asked Maharaj that are you planning to write a book about your New Vrindavan days? Maharaj said that those who come by reading the first book will go away by reading the second book. So, it was immense austerity. So, he was getting practically no reciprocation.

How is that possible to continue? No reciprocation from anybody, no appreciation, no recognition. That is because he was connected. Because he was connected with Krishna, he was absorbed in Krishna.

There was no need for anything else. And the leader of the community had told him, this will be your service for the rest of your life. And Maharaj was ready for that.

Now normally when we set our mind for doing one service and then suddenly we are told to do another service, it becomes very difficult. So, from 1980 to around 85-86, Maharaj was told to do college outreach. And that is where he demonstrated great dedication.

Now when I am saying these qualities, in each of these faiths Maharaj has demonstrated different qualities. But I am focusing on one particular quality. See, if you are doing one service and you are suddenly told to do a different service, that itself is disturbing.

But if you are told to do a completely opposite service, it becomes very difficult. So, his deity worship means he was alone, close to nature, close to the deities, close to the cows, completely away from the material world. And when he had to go and do college preaching, that meant he had to go into the places of materialism and sensuality and talk with people.

And there is very little, there might be some Christian religiosity over there, but Krishna religiosity, Krishna spirituality was not there at all in the colleges. So, it is a completely different service that suddenly came upon him. And that too also if a service is changed, like one service you get a higher service, it's a different thing.

You are promoted from one service to another service. But this was something different. Maharaj, just by his focus and absorption, he had earned a lot of respect in the New Vrindavan community.

And the New Vrindavan leader wanted to get another sannyasi to come to that particular project and that project wanted to be the second in charge over there. And he felt that Radhanath Swami, if he is there, people will never accept me as the second in charge. So, he made a condition that if you want me to come here, you have to send him out of New Vrindavan.

So, it was not because of any fault of his. He just told to leave. And it was very difficult.

But Maharaj, he was given nothing except a vehicle and it was also not a very well functional vehicle, RV. So, that was what Maharaj would live, he would cook, he would do his morning sadhana, he would offer to the deities and would travel from city to city to city. And over 3, 4, 5 years, he built an enormous circuit where several colleges he would go to and that's where he started doing cooking and preaching through cooking.

Because the atmosphere in New Vrindavan is quite Christian conservative. So, he could not really go directly and do outreach over there. So, even now in Dallas, one devotee has the van, the RV in which Maharaj used to drive.

So, he preserved that as a memory or memento. But through this preaching, putting in huge effort, going alone, Maharaj started building a network of devotees. And then in America, there are several university towns.

Like in UK, Oxford and Cambridge are primary university towns. America, Princeton is a university town. And so, Columbus, Ohio is also like a university town primarily.

Now it's quite big but at that time it was primarily a university town. So, Maharaj by his consistent preaching year after year after, he actually helped build a centre over there. So, when I had gone in 2015, 2016, one of those years I had gone to America, I met Maharaj and gave a record of where I had gone.

So, when I mentioned I had gone to Columbus. So, Maharaj said that, I started the temple over there. I bought the place, I got the Deities.

And then now the devotees are moving to a bigger temple. So, Maharaj has promised that just as he drove the Deities to this temple, he will be personally driving the Deities to their new temple. So, he will be acting.

In America, Maharaj drives his own car or drives the car himself. So, that is the Sarthi of Krishna in that sense. So, Maharaj, year after year after year, working single-handedly, never had any reliable assistant.

Just from the preaching he created people who were subservient to him. But then the problem with college outreach is that people just leave. And unless they can get jobs nearby, they are not there directly to assist in the college outreach.

Just as things were building up. Like even in our college outreach, people graduate after 3-4 years and if they get a job, then they can start helping in outreach. Just when his college outreach was about to expand, he was told to go to India.

And the leader who also had his own temple in India, Mumbai, for legal reasons he was not allowed to come to India. So, he wanted somebody to take care of the temple. So, this was again a service which he had put his life in, suddenly taken away from him.

And his college outreach had just started becoming successful. But Maharaj was accepted that he was surrendered. And this is where, when he came to India, he started, this is largely from 1986 to 2004.

This is where Maharaj did probably what is his biggest service to the Krishna Consciousness, to Prabhupada and to the world at large. That Maharaj is a community builder. So, basically what happened? He focused on making a home for devotees.

Previously what would happen that many people would come to Bhakti but it was like a rotating door. People would come and people would leave. And the general devotee attitude was, most people would live in the temple or sometimes near the temple.

And if any devotee would leave, the attitude was that that person fell into maya. It is that person's responsibility. So, often the whole community would come together and there would be a collective fault finding session.

It is to see, that person was sleeping in japa. That person, I saw him stealing Mahaprasad. That person was talking with that Mataji for a long time.

That person was always gossiping, committing Vaishnav Prat. And that way the whole, it was, actually everything is wrong with that person and nothing is wrong with us. That was the idea.

And from 1977 to 1987, almost 90% of Prabhupada's disciples left his court. So, 90%, that was huge. So, then Maharaj saw all this while he was travelling to various colleges, going to various centres.

So, when Maharaj came to India, he decided to work. Later on, Prabhupada's letter comes out. Prabhupada says in one conversation that if somebody leaves, it is 50% their responsibility and 50% our responsibility.

So, Maharaj's focus was what are we not doing right because of which so many people are leaving. So, those who are residing in the temple, they were often treated like free labour. So, one of the senior devotees from that time jokes and he says when people come new, we feed them fried pakodas.

But when they become devotees, we fry them like kodas. So, people are just treated like free labour. So, it's basically like an office but without any payment.

Of course, he has spiritual nourishment. But it is too much, too much service. So, that's when Maharaj focused on creating a counsellor system.

Maharaj did two main things. He said that for the grahasthas, I will talk about the counsellor system. But for the temple residents, Maharaj said that we will focus on for everyone what support systems can we provide by which they can continue practicing bhakti and keep practicing it lifelong.

So, what is it that we need to provide? So, Maharaj's focus is on devotees coming together in association, hearing about Krishna, singing about Krishna and doing service in the mood of servant of servant. So, from what I have talked with different devotees, Maharaj always himself, I will talk about humility later. But from this time, he started emphasizing this Drona Dapi Sunil Chhena.

Before also he was talking about it but it became much more important. See, previously in ISKCON, the focus was much more on renunciation, detachment, giving up sense gratification. But what happens? Detachment can often make us cold hearted.

It is service attitude that makes us soft hearted. It makes us about caring for others. So, that Maharaj's focus was build a home by creating various devotee care initiatives.

The counselor system was one of them. And the second was, in this way, he exhibited adaptability. Adaptability means what? See, Prabhupada, Prabhupada started the International Society for Krishna Consciousness.

So, Prabhupada had this giant umbrella and within that Prabhupada had many definitions of success. So, for example, one definition of success is, we want to open new temples. Conventionally, ISKCON operated by three definitions of success.

Number of temples opened, number of devotees made and number of books distributed. These are important definitions but there are other definitions also that are important. So, Prabhupada himself actually said in the early 1970s itself that it's time to boil the milk.

Now, different devotees have different opinions of what boiling the milk means. So, now that is also understandable because different devotees are inspired by different aspects of Krishna Consciousness. So, somebody may say boiling the milk means strict morning, deep into the Bhagavatam.

Somebody else says boiling the milk means we have to go for yatras and immerse ourselves in the dham. Somebody else may say boiling the milk means that we become very austere and we give up all sense gratification. So, boiling the milk, there can be different definitions.

But what Maharaj observed, there are many different aspects of boiling the milk, but he said that Prabhupada said one of the purpose of ISKCON is to bring people closer to each other and closer to Krishna. Prabhupada started an international society for Krishna Consciousness. Not an international university for Krishna Consciousness.

Not an international office for Krishna Consciousness. Society means people have to come together. So, as I said there are three definitions of success.

How many temples built, how many devotees made, how many books distributed. So, when Maharaj became the leader of Radha Gopinath temple, the first thing he said is we will not worry about building a temple. We will not even focus on book distribution.

We will focus on education and training. That time Maharaj would every day practically give Bhagavatam classes. Every afternoon he would start doing Chaitanya Chaitanya Tamas classes for the devotees who were in the temple.

And slowly he started attracting quality devotees, well educated devotees. And as they started coming, so the first batch was Radha Gopinath Prabhu, Shyamananda Prabhu, then Gaurang Prabhu, Radhe Shyam Prabhu came, then Gaurgopal Prabhu, then Rajvihari Prabhu. Then a couple of batches later, then there are various batches of devotees came.

I was introduced in 1996. So, Maharaj started this in 87, 88, 89. From that time, so now if we see that we have attracted a lot of well educated devotees, not just in the Brahmachari ashram, but in general the ethos of the movement has become much higher.

This adaptability means, like one is strategy with respect to okay, you cannot do direct preaching in colleges, so let us do cooking and preaching. That's what he did in America. If you can't go this way, we go this way.

But this was a question of where to go. So, where to go? We will focus on studying Shastra and living Shastra. So, Maharaj said that the Brahmacharis, we don't want them to focus on fundraising.

We want them to focus on becoming Brahmanas and studying and sharing wisdom. And not just studying and sharing wisdom, but also embodying the wisdom as much as possible. So, now that has led to lots of now vibrant Brahmachari ashrams all over India and increasingly outside also hopefully in the future.

The second was, I talked about adaptability over here. I can talk many more things about adaptability, but the idea is changing, not changing, but focusing on a different definition of success. Then another thing that it exhibited was a non-judgmental attitude or more precisely you could say a non-disruptive attitude.

I will come to this again later, but let me quickly complete this at this point. So, when Maharaj was preaching to the Grahasthas, so what happened previously, the idea was to become a devotee means to move into temple. Or if you are not moving into temple, if you are not becoming a Brahmachari, a Grahastha should also be like a Brahmachari.

So, like for a Grahastha at that time the greatest glorification was, oh you are as detached as a Sanyasi. No, Grahastha and Sanyasi are different models and just as we won't glorify a Sanyasi just like a Grahastha. That would be an insult.

So, to say for a Grahastha, you are as good as a Sanyasi. That's not a healthy model. That is a Grahastha should be an ideal Grahastha.

A Grahastha should not be a concealed Sanyasi. So, what does it mean? That means in Grahastha life there are a different set of responsibilities. And how do we do that in a Krishna conscious way? So, Maharaj focused a lot on including the whole community in Bhakti.

So, what does that mean? Lots of things but I will give a couple of examples. So, basically what happened during Prabhupada's times, there were the full time devotees who were western mostly. They were western full time devotees and when Prabhupada came to India, many people were very impressed by Prabhupada.

How he has gone to America and how he has inspired Americans to take up Bhakti. But what happened? They were inspired by Prabhupada out of feelings of cultural nationalism or cultural national pride. They saw Prabhupada as a symbol of how great Indian culture is.

That western people are adopting Indian culture. So, they were not so much inspired by Prabhupada as their spiritual teacher. So, it was more of what Prabhupada represented than who Prabhupada was.

So, what happened by this? We got a lot of life members. That means life members means that they were focused on… they wanted to support ISKCON but they were not committed to ISKCON. So, one Prabhupada disciple was telling me that at that time we had this many life members but none of them were really becoming dedicated.

They would give some fund, they would come to the temple. See he was giving the example, this is like in modern dating. If a boy and a girl have relationships, I am interested in you but I don't want to commit to you.

It is like that. So, it was that kind of situation. And now Prabhupada created a facility for them.

But what happened was that now if you see most of our devotees are in between. They are the congregation. The life members were mostly what? They were supporting ISKCON financially, they have facilitated ISKCON in some ways but they are not dedicated devotees.

So, now they were full time devotees but for the congregation devotees what would be an ideal for them? How are they to live and practice bhakti? So, that was what Maharaj set an example in the community. He actually provided the guidance for how to go about doing that. So, it's not that those who are grahasthas have to live constantly in guilt that we are not like brahmacharis.

Grahastha ashram is also an ashram where we get ashram of Krishna fully. So, what does that mean? That means, see Maharaj focused on two three different things. One is that devotees who came from particular backgrounds, he told them that you don't have to cut yourself off those backgrounds.

So, there is one devotee, he is now senior leader of Radha Gopinath temple. His whole family was associated previously with a guru in India, in Maharashtra basically, quite a well-known guru. And he came to the temple, he started exploring.

Many family used to go to the other guru, means his brothers, sisters, his mother, parents and all of them, like a kulguru. And then at one time it happened, so he is thinking where to go here, there, he is exploring. And one day it happened that there was some accusation levelled against that particular guru.

And then when that happened, it came in the news because he was a well-known figure. It became a big controversy. When Maharaj came to know about it, Maharaj called the senior leaders in the temple.

He told them, none of you should even mention this to him. Since when he comes to the temple, he is already tense. Don't talk about this at all.

Just help him feel comfortable. See, the typical most devotee's approach would be, see Prabhupada is only true guru, everybody else is bogus. Give that up and come to Prabhupada.

But, so he came tense and he told me also that, nobody talked about, everybody was just normal and friendly with me. They knew, but they didn't really care. They just accepted me.

That's when his heart started getting drawn towards Krishna Consciousness, towards Maharaj. Then when he desired to take initiation from Maharaj, at that time he came to Maharaj and Maharaj said that, you should go to your family guru and take his blessings. So, he had guided you in your spiritual journey till now.

So, then Maharaj, he went to that family guru and he said, I had heard that you are going to this particular organization. And I have heard some good things, I have heard some bad things, I am not so sure. But the fact that your guru asked you to come to me and take blessings, that reassures me that you are in safe hands.

Go with my blessings. So, when I say non-judgmental or non-disruptive, what it means is that, we all have our pre-KC past, pre-Krishna conscious past. And that can be seen in two ways.

Negatively we can say it is all Maya. Or positively we can say it was preparation for KC by Krishna. We might not have had a relationship with Krishna, but Krishna always has a relationship with us.

So, Maharaj always sees things very positively. That where a person is, don't disrupt that. Take them forward from there.

So, sometimes some devotees, so when the Journey Home book was published, after that, I will come to that stage a little later, but this is related to non-disruptiveness, so I will mention that. So, after that it became very widely read, widely appreciated. Lots of people started coming towards Krishna, but also raised some concerns.

Some concerns were, for example, that there are pictures of Mayavadi Gurus in that book. So, why should an ISKCON leader put pictures of Mayavadi Gurus? So, when at that time I had the service of, in Pune when I was there, I had a service of responding to misconceptions and responding to questions. So, when I came to Joppati also, I had that service.

So, I was asked those questions, Gauram Kruth sent me a list of various criticisms that had come and I prepared some answers, I sent it to Maharaj. Then Maharaj went through it, then Maharaj called me, we had a discussion. Maharaj explained several points.

So, the point is, Maharaj says that, he basically, his vision of Krishna consciousness is that, he said that this is my story. And I met those Gurus and I learnt something from them. So, Maharaj is not in any way glorifying their Mayavad.

He is saying, what he learnt from them is, principles compatible with Bhakti. So, for the importance of sadhana or importance of satsang or importance of seva. So, it is that, Charakya Pandit says, we can take gold even from a filthy place.

So, we can learn from various sources. Now, another thing he said is that, his focus was on glorifying Srila Prabhupada in an inclusive way. What is inclusive means? He says, many of my Godbrothers have written wonderful book glorifying Srila Prabhupada.

But most of them can be appreciated by people who have already accepted Prabhupada. But people who are still exploring, for them, what happens is, it seems too much glorification. It almost seems like a personality cult for people sometimes.

So, he said that, from the material perspective, many of these other spiritual Mayavadi teachers, they may actually be more well known than Prabhupada in the outside world. The fact that Maharaj met all of them and still kept exploring till he found Prabhupada. That is very indirectly but clearly stating that, actually Maharaj found in Bhupada something that he did not find in anyone else.

So, it is not so by instructing but by demonstrating through his own life journey. And a third thing he said is that, we are sometimes very quick to label people as Mayavadis. So, he told me that when Prabhupada was in Mumbai, two life members helped him enormously.

One life member actually came with a gun when the devotees were being threatened. He said, I will protect you. And the devotees would attack.

He stood all night with a gun guarding the devotees. He was a very well to do businessman, very well respected in society but he did that. So, now Maharaj told me and other Prabhupada disciples also confirmed that, this person was actually a prominent initiated disciple of a Mayavadi guru.

And whenever devotees went to his home, he had prominent pictures of that Mayavadi guru at his home. And I asked several Prabhupada disciples including Maharaj, did Prabhupada ever point that out to him? Talk anything about this? I don't remember any time Prabhupada mentioning that. So, Prabhupada saw that he has some influence and he wants to use in Krishna's service.

And now he is already committed to that path but still he is open to doing some service here. So, instead of trying to pull that person over here and then pushing him away, he said that let's engage him in service. So, Maharaj gave me a very fascinating conception of outreach.

He says outreach means at one level we open the doors for people to come to Krishna. That's what we normally think of as outreach. But outreach can also happen when we connect with people.

Who open doors for us to take Krishna to others. Now those people are ready to open doors for us. But if we try to pull them towards Krishna, they will not come and they will close the door also.

So, many influential people, they are like that, you are doing good work and I will help you in that. But if we start talking about chant, chant, chant, they will just say forget it. I don't want to do anything to you.

So, that level of outreach. So, this particular life member, he helped Prabhupada build the Juhu temple in a very big way. And Maharaj told me when he was in his final days, I went to see him because he was going to leave the world soon.

And he said he is completely emaciated. But at that time as soon as he saw me, immediately his face bloomed and he started glorifying Prabhupada. He said how extraordinary Prabhupada was and what all service he did.

He started talking about his memories with Prabhupada. And Maharaj said as I was talking with him, I was thinking that when he departs from the world, what is Krishna going to see? Is Krishna going to see that he was initiated by Mayavadi Guru? Or is Krishna going to see that he has so much devotion for my pure devotional Prabhupada? And that he has done so much service with Prabhupada. Then Maharaj paused and said, in my humble opinion, Krishna is Bhavagrahi.

So, the thing is that Maharaj's mood is be non-disruptive. Wherever somebody is coming from, see how it can facilitate them in moving closer to Krishna. In helping them, if they become appreciative of Krishna consciousness, they may not become committed.

But they become appreciative and they open doors for us. So that we can help others to come closer to Krishna. So, in the early days, 1987, 1988, 1989, Maharaj would conduct almost a program everyday in the evenings.

And then a small group of 15-20-30 people would come for the program. So, Maharaj would meet everyone after the program. And then all the devotees would stand in line where they would meet and Prabhu Maharaj would give a nice tight hug to the Prabhus.

So, one time one new devotee couple came there and they came and saw everyone standing in line, they also stood in line. So, the Prabhu came forward, Maharaj hugged him. Mataji was new, she did not know, she also came forward.

And Maharaj very sweetly folded his hands and said, Mataji, I am not so advanced. So, what could have been a very embarrassing moment. Somebody could have been judgmental.

Don't you know any highly cultured? Don't you know how to behave with a sanyasi? But Maharaj, his mood is be non-disruptive. So, these three things, create a home-like atmosphere, be adaptable, be non-disruptive. Through this, Maharaj created a community.

We have thousands of devotees who are very well connected to each other. There are many places where there are devotees, large number of devotees. But how much are the devotees there for each other? How much the devotees feel a sense of community and belonging and ownership? That was one of his biggest contributions.

Then after that, in 2005, another major event happened in his life. That is when Bhakti Teerth Maharaj was diagnosed with melanoma cancer. And he requested that, we requested Adhan Maharaj, please stay with me in my final days.

Now, how long would that be? It could be 15 days, it could be 1 month, it could be 6 months. Maharaj cancelled all his programs. This is my God brother needs me, I will be there.

And they answered. You may have heard the lecture of Maharaj, 4-5 hours lecture he gave in Radha Gopinath temple, 6 hours probably. Described the entire life story of Bhakti Teerth Maharaj after he departed.

But this was the time when Maharaj sees everything from Prabhupada's perspective. I can go and do programs for new people, but these are people who have served Prabhupada so much. What will please Prabhupada the most? That is always his consciousness.

And with that consciousness, when he functions, then even when I go to America to many places, Maharaj has disciples, generally Indians in America are quite well-to-do. So, Maharaj has many disciples who may have big homes. But then if in that city some senior Prabhupada disciple is there and Maharaj has a relationship with them, Maharaj will stay at their house.

And I know 2-3 cities where the room Maharaj stays is a very very small room. But every year when Maharaj comes, he will stay there. Then his disciples can come and serve him there, serve the God brothers also.

So, his idea is that he is always very appreciative of anyone who has done service to Prabhupada. Now, in one sense, he sacrifices preaching programs for a few months. But through that Krishna opened a huge new door for him.

So, when Bhakti Teerth Maharaj and he were discussing many of their experiences in ISKCON, they were sharing their realizations. So, Bhakti Teerth Maharaj told Radhanath Maharaj that please write your story. So, why? Many reasons.

One of the things is our western outreach. Now, western outreach means westerners coming to our temples. That has decreased drastically in the western world.

In fact, in many ways, instead of having an international society for Krishna Consciousness, we are moving towards having an Indian society for Krishna Consciousness with international branches. So, many places if you go, practically only Indians come into the temples. And it's wonderful.

The Indians who go outside, they are very talented, they are very dedicated, they can do phenomenal amount of work. And it's very good that they are coming. But the thing is, Prabhupada wanted an international society.

So, what happened? Maharaj's book became the pathway for him by which he could reach out to western people also. Because that tone of, see, in India, I started travelling to the west from 2014 onwards. And one thing that struck me is that in India, even now, I would say changing, but India is quite hierarchical.

This is the authority and this is the subordinate. But the west is much more horizontal. It's much more hierarchical, non-hierarchical.

Authority is higher, but subordinate is not that much lower. So, what people especially in spiritual circles, they look for is not so much authority as authenticity. Like in India, if you quote a lot of shlokas in a class, people say, oh, what a scholarly person.

In the west, if you go and quote a lot of shlokas, they will say, are you just a dummy? Do you ever think for yourself? Are you just a puppet for somebody else to speak their thoughts through you? So, the more you quote, the more you will be discredited. So, the idea is that we can take concepts and explain concepts. So, what happens is, there is a lot of suspicion of authority.

That authorities are power hungry, authorities are exploitative. So, that's why what people look for is authenticity. In how much do you live this? How much has this transformed your life? So, that tone which Maharaj has in his book, it has opened so many doors.

Thousands and thousands of people have opened their minds to Krishna Consciousness and taken tangible steps towards it. So, for him, that door opened through his sacrifice of his preaching for a few months for Bhakti Tirth Maharaj. And that brings me to this final part basically, 2006 to 2024-25, you can say.

Not 26. Maharaj is tirelessness. Tirelessness means, now he had, earlier we talked about just as a service was getting built, he was told to go somewhere else.

Now Maharaj had focused in India for two decades, built a wonderful community from Mumbai. His disciples had started going to different places and they were doing lots of programs. And Maharaj could have focused on India.

But he started going to America. He started going to America and focusing on America for, because that's where he felt that, that's where Prabhupada wanted to be. So, when I was travelling to different places in America, I asked Maharaj, where all should I travel? I'll come to that a little bit later again.

But at this point, two things. That he said that, you know, if I spend the same amount of time in Mumbai, devotees can organize huge programs for me. If I spend the same amount of time in London, devotees can organize good programs for me.

If I spend the same amount of time in New York, devotees can organize much smaller programs for me. But he said, Prabhupada said New York is the most important city in the world. Prabhupada wanted something to happen.

That's why I am focusing in New York. So, he always had this very Prabhupada centered vision of how we can spread Krishna Consciousness and where it is needed the most. And in the West and the Western outreach, that's a whole different subject.

I won't go into that. But the point I wanted to make is that this last phase, last 20 years, what Maharaj, when he has created the Govardhaniko village, that many purposes, but one thing is Prabhupada wanted new Vrindavan, which could be a soft landing for Americans, before they can come to Vrindavan. Govardhaniko is also like that.

Maharaj said it should be natural, it should be natural, spiritual and comfortable. So, often when you go to Vrindavan, it is not natural, sometimes it is commercial too much. The spiritualities are quite hidden and it is not very comfortable.

So, that soft landing he created. So, the idea is he opened a whole universe for outreach. And he could have continued on in India and he would have probably become one of the top spiritual leaders in India.

He is now already one of them. But he would have been much much more influential in India. But he saw what is needed for Prabhupada's service.

And the last thing is, Humility. Humility has been a defining characteristic of Maharaj throughout. And I will focus on some of my interactions with him, where he talks about it in many different ways.

So, I will talk for about 20-25 minutes more and then we can have a few question answers. So, in the second part of the book, I talked about four things, like this was Radhanath, his life. In his teachings, I talked about what I learnt from Maharaj based on acronym NORM.

NORM is how to serve according to your nature, how to work within an organization, how to have your relationships with others and then finally how to have a sense of mission. How to be a missionary, how to have a sense of mission. So, in each of these, that combination of is humility, but there is also a very clear sense of purpose.

So, when I started travelling, then slowly, when I was doing, in India I was mostly doing college outreach. I started travelling abroad, abroad I started with more congregation outreach. And then in 2019 roundabouts, sometime before the pandemic, I met Maharaj.

Every year when I go to America and come back, at that time not so many devotees were going. So, I would meet and give a report to Maharaj. I told Maharaj, Maharaj, some devotees tell me that my classes are too intellectual.

And they can't understand it very easily. So, I said Maharaj, you know, it's difficult for me to change. It's not that I am intentionally intellectual.

It's just the way I think. It's just the way I articulate. So, Maharaj said, you don't have to change.

Then Maharaj said that if Gaur Gopal Prabhu tries to be intellectual like you, it won't work. If you try to be humorous like Gaur Gopal Prabhu, it won't work. Maharaj said, as far as I am concerned, I am neither intellectual like you nor humorous like Gaur Gopal Prabhu.

So, Maharaj, your abilities can be heartbreaking. So, I said Maharaj, whatever abilities we have is all by your mercy. Maharaj remained grave and he said, Krishna has gifted me with deep concern for others.

And with that concern in my heart, whatever I speak, it seems to inspire others. He said, you don't have to change yourself but increase your concern for others. So, I found that as a very profound instruction.

But I also found it as profoundly unclear. Okay, what does increasing your concern mean? So, what happens in our spiritual life that when we get guidance? See, initially the guidance is like steps. Okay, do this, don't do this.

But as we grow in our spiritual life, the guidance we start getting is like seeds. Steps is more, do this, don't do this. But seeds is, this is a seed, we have to decide where to plant it, we have to decide how to water it, we have to decide how to nourish it.

So, Maharaj gave me a lot of specific thing to do. He said, he gave me a principle. Increase your concern for others.

So, I started exploring. So, I had started going abroad in 2014. So, I was quite excited, first time going abroad.

So, the previous 20 years, whatever I had studied, whatever I had learnt, whatever I thought were my best classes, I had given all those best classes in my first year of outreach. And I had gone. So, in 2019, in trying to understand, okay, how can I increase my concern for others, I started exploring.

So, I reheard some of my own classes. And they were my own classes but I had to pay 100% attention to understand what I was reading. And some of the points I knew, but still, why is this example coming over here? How is this point connected with that point? So, I realized that I am making too much intellectual demand from the audience.

So, one devotee told me that, aapke class sunta ho toh dimaag se dhua aata hai. So, then I started exploring what to do. So, I started making PowerPoints for all my classes.

During the pandemic, I worked, probably I made 2000-2500 PowerPoints at that time. So, for my previous classes, those classes, future classes, one time I asked one of our senior Godbrothers, has Maharaj ever used PowerPoints? So, somebody asked Maharaj this. And Maharaj just laughed and says, by Prabhupada's mercy, I can make powerful points without PowerPoints.

So, then I found that the PowerPoints were helping, but while my classes structure, but it's not a scripted class. Scripted means, after this point, this point, this point. For me, classes are as much about discovery as they are about delivery.

Delivery is, okay, these are the points you have to speak. Discovery is, okay, where is this going? What new thought comes over here? How can you take a detour? So, there was no room for spontaneity left in PowerPoints. So, the PowerPoints, maybe they are helping the audience understand, but I was feeling powerless by that.

So, then I explored various things. I looked at various books about educational techniques. I watched some videos and then that's how I came up with.

I have already said the technique is good. Don't forget to leave a concern for the audience. And that has helped me a lot because sometimes a PowerPoint does not work.

Then this tablet doesn't work, projection doesn't work. So, the principle of concern for the audience. So, I found Maharaj in all his books.

So, he does not tell people that you have to drastically change. That there are different devotees. If you see, broadly I have put as project builders or community builders.

Project builders are those who can use infrastructure. And for them, when Maharaj meets them, among our senior devotees, and God sisters also to some extent, when Maharaj talks with them, then he will talk about targets, about finances, about numbers. But there are some devotees, I was talking with one of our senior devotees, he said that Maharaj is there, till now he is 35-40 years, I have never asked him once, what service did you do last year? He said, that is not our relationship at all.

So, for those who want targets and goals, they are like poor beggars. So, Maharaj will provide that. Those who are not like that, Maharaj will not force them to do that.

You serve the way naturally Krishna has made, Krishna has created them. So, initially Maharaj would often say that, no, for us, people are more important than projects. But then, what happened, that now we are a big, big project going on.

So, devotees asked him that, Maharaj, have we shifted our attention from people to projects now? So, Maharaj said, no, people need projects. So, the idea is that, serve according to your nature. And Krishna's movement is big enough that everybody serve according to their nature, very easily.

Not very easily, but we can all find our space to serve. So, I will just make one last point. There are many other points.

So, when I started travelling, I asked Maharaj, where should I start, which places should I go? And how should I decide whether my travelling preaching is successful or not? See, if you stay at one place, you are cultivating people and we see how people are becoming practicing bhakti. So, mine is simply I am more of an educator than a cultivator. So, Maharaj laughed and said, if you are invited back again, you are successful.

So, I thought that this is a very baseline level definition. If you are not invited back, that means you have created so much trouble. So, then Maharaj laughed and he said that every project is like a flower bouquet.

And he said, in that flower bouquet, the leaders of each project, for them, every travelling preacher that comes is like one flower in that bouquet. And he said that they will decide where they put you as a flower in their bouquet. In the front, in the middle, in the left, in the right, in the back somewhere.

So, they will decide that. Whether they want you in their flower bouquet and where they want you. And he says, you have to decide which flower bouquets you want to be a part of.

So, I found that every project has its own mood. And Maharaj appreciates the service which different devotees are getting at different places. But not everybody's mood is compatible with our mood.

We cannot necessarily get along with everyone. One time two devotees, two disciples had a lot of differences among each other. So, when they went to Maharaj, Maharaj said that, I was telling one of them and he told me afterward that sometimes people can get along with people, sometimes people cannot get along with some people.

That is just the way the people are. But even if you cannot get along with someone, please don't spoil your relationship. What does it mean? You can keep a distance from people.

Ramobah's movement is big enough that we can find service at different places. So, it's like different areas. So, sometimes we cooperate.

And if we cannot cooperate, then we co-operate. Co-operate means what? I operate here, you operate there. And the idea is that everybody needs some space.

So, one senior disciple Maharaj was telling me that, when the Pandavas came back, Krishna asked for bottom level compromise. What was that? Minimum five villages. He said the Pandavas were all united.

But still he asked for five villages, not one village. Each of the Pandavas is a Kshatriya. They need their Kshetra.

So, every devotee needs their space for serving. And especially as devotees become senior, they will need space. So, Maharaj goes to facilitate devotees so that they can practice bhakti.

So, what Maharaj does not like, I will conclude with this point about it, that if you are in a particular place and you keep disrupting that place. So, Maharaj is not like in the counselor system. Maharaj has repeatedly said that if the counsellors become possessive about their counsellors.

You are my counsellor. My counsellor cannot hear from you. Maharaj said if the counsellors become possessive about their counsellors, then the counsellor system will become like a monster that will devour our community.

So, it is for service. The counsellor system is not possessive. So, if some devotee cannot get along with their counsellor, then they can always shift to another counsellor.

There is nothing wrong in that. The point is, don't spoil your relationship. So, being in a particular project, if you cannot be, Maharaj will not guilt you or shame you being in that project.

But if you are going to be in that project, serve in that project. If you stay at a particular place and disrupt that place, that's something which Maharaj does not appreciate. So, I talked about this theme of seeds.

So, the way I understood this, see Maharaj, I said he gives steps and he gives seeds. So, instructions can be steps or seeds. Mostly what Maharaj gives is seeds.

So, I have asked several senior disciples, I have not asked Maharaj directly, that why does Maharaj not do direct instructions? For example, one instruction could be something they cherish throughout their life. So, the answer I got was very insightful. He said that life is very unpredictable.

Things can change. And sometimes when devotees are given one service and their life is in such a way that they can't do that service, then they may start feeling guilty that oh my Guru Maharaj gave this service, I won't do this. So, that's why Maharaj gives seeds.

So, once a young couple came to Maharaj and they said that Maharaj, we have decided not to have children. Please give us your blessings. Maharaj smiled and said that whenever you decide to have children, you have my blessings.

So, the idea is that Maharaj doesn't want devotees to feel bound or imprisoned by a particular instruction. So, he is very careful. But what he gives through his lectures, he gives seeds.

And how to apply that? That is for us to develop the intelligence, learn from senior devotees and apply that. His overall mood right now is that there is a lot of concern about succession planning. That how would, after the spiritual masters depart, how will the next generation continue? So, Maharaj has been successful in planning himself from 1990 itself.

That even in his absence, he has created an infrastructure of guidance. Now, of course, the same thing might not be there in different places in the same exact way. But the point is that there are two things.

There is facility and there is freedom. So, in general, in any larger setup, we won't get both of these together. Any organized setup.

If we want facility, we will have to sacrifice freedom. If we want freedom, we may have to let go of facility. So, for example, what it means is, that if I come here to Hyderabad and say, do you want to organize a program for me in IIT? Or they organize a program for me in Salesforce or Intel or any big company, Google.

Now, if I say that, there he is arranging a facility for me to speak. If I say that, okay, I will go and study at Yugoslavia Satsang Dharma. I will study, tell how Achintya Veda is superior to Advaita Veda.

Now, that's completely irrelevant to that audience. So, if I want the facility to speak there, I won't have the freedom to speak whatever I want. If I come to a temple and I say, instead of Bhagavad Gita class, I will speak on Tattva Sandarbha.

Well, no, you can do Tattva Sandarbha in a class. That is a Bhagavatam class. It's not a Tattva Sandarbha class.

So, if I want the facility, it's not that I have to give up my freedom completely. But I have to recognize that my freedom will be restricted. Now, if I want to teach Tattva Sandarbha, nobody is stopping me from doing that.

I can start an online class. I can do a course at a particular place. And I can find people.

Then I have to create the facility. So, when Maharaj was in New Vrindavan, he was serving the deities. He was doing college preaching.

So, there he did not have much freedom in New Vrindavan. He came to India. He had freedom.

He created his own facilities. That is, sometimes devotees are disgruntled. They complain.

It's because they are expecting both. That I want freedom and I want facility also. That is not going to work.

Now, some people may say that wanting freedom is itself an independent mentality. That is not Maharaj's mood. If somebody is mature enough to take some initiative and do some service, then he often gives the devotee space.

But the idea is that if you want space, then don't ask for support. If you want support and want facility, then we have to work. Do something separately and do it.

Don't disrupt the existing system. So, generally, that's why I said Maharaj is a non-disruptor. Devotees ask me whether Maharaj is liberal or conservative.

So, Maharaj is, the way he will preach in New York is different from the way he will preach in Radha Gopinath temple. His idea is that liberals don't have to become conservatives to become devotees. And conservatives don't have to become liberals to become devotees.

From wherever you are, what is the ethos of the place, you move forward and practice bhakti from there. So, that non-disruptive attitude is what helped Maharaj attract devotees and disciples and followers for very diverse kind of natures and to keep all of them connected and dedicated to Krishna. So, I'll summarize broadly what I discussed.

I talked about life and lessons. And in the life, I talked about the acronym and I talked about, okay, R was realization, A was absorption, B was dedication, H was hope, D was non-judgmental, T was tirelessness, and then H was finally excellent. You got the whole thing.

So, this is the way to have an overview of Maharaj's life. And then the lessons, I talked about two main lessons. That with respect to our nature, that, you know, however we are, we can, if we have that concern for others, we got service attitude basically.

We have concern for the people whom we are preaching to, concern for our guides, concern for our equals. If we have that service attitude, we can find a way to serve according to our nature. We don't have to give up our nature to serve Krishna, but rather serve Krishna through our nature.

And then in terms of organization, I talked about three points. First was that, I talked about this flower bouquet metaphor. What Maharaj says is, that every, it's like, if you want to create a new bouquet, that's wonderful.

But don't be in a bouquet and keep destroying the flowers. So, that's the idea of what I talked about last time. If we want freedom, we can have it.

But then we won't have facility. So, the leader of a particular place will decide, this is the kind of flower bouquet we want over here. If we want a different flower bouquet, then it's not wrong to want some freedom.

But what is wrong is, to be in a particular place and disrupt that place. So, that way, the mood of Maharaj is to work in a harmonious way. Sometimes with different people, some people can cooperate.

That means they can work together in one project. But they can otherwise cooperate means, different devotees can have different visions and they can serve in different ways. And if the world is big enough, everybody can have space.

But two people fighting with each other, that is something which is, it is not at all pleasing to Maharaj. So, if the devotees fight with each other or disciples creating trouble in the project, that's something which he does not like at all. So, overall, for all of us, it's a great blessing that we have got Krishna Shelter and Prabhupada Shelter through Maharaj.

And this created a legacy. That legacy is the ethos of community building, which we all can have access with the senior devotees. And through them, I talked about Maharaj's instructions, we may not get them as steps, but we can get them as seeds.

And we can use our buddhi to see how to nourish those seeds, so that our Bhakti Lata Beach can grow and all can move towards developing love for Krishna. Thank you very much. Hare Krishna! Are there any good questions or comments? Yes, sir.

What about after marriage, husband and wife have similar problems? So, if the husband and wife have different counsellors after marriage, how do they move forward? Wife comes to husband. So, basically, wife comes to husband's counsellor as third option. Husband wants to be in that counsellor.

See, guidance can be legislated. Inspiration cannot be legislated. That is, we can create a system of structure, a system for guidance.

But nobody can legislate inspiration. And that's why we have, Tad viddhi pratipatena. That verse is what? Last line is gyaninas sattva-darshina.

Gyaninas is plural, it's not singular. That we learn from various sources. So, that's why, I think though, especially with the internet and social media, now outreach and inspiration has become very democratized.

So, devotee may be a part of a particular system. They don't have to disrupt that system. But they can take inspiration from wherever they want.

That is not making them anti to the existing system. That is not making them disrupt the system. You can get inspiration from wherever you want.

So, these are practical issues and I don't think there is any one universal principle for dealing with them. Overall the idea is that, so, the counsellor system, is it for inspiration, is it for guidance? Ideally it is for both. But we will see that if somebody is introduced initially in their college days or something like that, that time they need more guidance, they get more training.

But as one becomes grahastha, then everybody starts living their own, their life becomes more autonomous. And the bond between the counsellor and the counsellee is also not that thick or tight. In terms of affection it may be there.

It is not that they need so much guidance. So, I think that change of modality of guiding also has to be there. So, it's a practical issue.

I don't think Maharaj has ever been asked this question. And it's the principle is that it's not the system. Like Maharaj said, don't get caught in the technique, focus on the principle.

So, you only need to feel cared for. And I heard Maharaj say this very clearly that inspiration cannot be legislated. That you cannot force somebody to be inspired by somebody.

So, everybody has to find out where they are inspired by and they can move forward from there. In that case, husband should guide? No, I mean, everybody has to find where they can be inspired. So, ideally speaking, guidance should come from one family unit, guidance should come from one place.

But inspiration can come from different places. You can hear classes, get inspired. So, I think both of them can help each other to find the right inspiration.

Why western devotees are getting reduced? Three reasons. First is that Prabhupada went to America at a very extraordinary historical phase when there was counterculture and the hippies. And these people, they were actually very much exploring eastern spirituality, not just as an alternative lifestyle, but as a main way of living.

So, that phase died out by 1972-73 itself. So, and by 1980 it was completely finished. The counterculture phase.

So, second is that lot of gurus tapped into that, lot of spiritual groups tapped into their counterculture phase. And what happened? They created their own cults. And the cults did a lot of damage.

There was one particular cult in southern part of America where this person cut off all his followers from everyone. You should hear only from me. And he was committing criminal activities and doing lots of terrible things.

And he said, I am Jesus, come again, I will save you. And finally when the police were going to come to arrest him, he told, now is the moment you should trust me. And he told everyone to take poison.

So, parents gave poison to their children. And more than 1000 people, collective suicide they committed. So, then from that time there became huge suspicion of cults in America.

And somehow many of ISKCON's characteristics for them felt we are like a cult. So, ISKCON had to face a lot of backlash because of that. So, in one sense, the people who were coming, they got cut off because that cultural trend itself died.

And then we ourselves were highly suspected and targeted because of the way we lived. And some parts of ISKCON did become like cults unfortunately. So, that was the second reason.

And the third reason is that overall in the West, the focus became more on non-institutional spirituality. See what happened to people who came in 1960s, they had grown up in a Christian environment. So, they were used to accepting religious hierarchy and authority.

But they found their authority to be hypocritical. So, they rejected the church and they followed Prabhupada. But those who had grown up in the 1980s, 1990s, 2000s, they never really followed any hierarchical authorities.

And so, ISKCON appears extremely institutional and hierarchical. So, it becomes very difficult for people to see spirituality within an organizational setup. As I say in the entire Journey home book, Maharaj never says that I have joined ISKCON.

In fact, he uses the word ISKCON only once in the whole book. It's where he is introducing Prabhupada as the founder of ISKCON. So, in the West, people are interested in spiritual individuals.

They are not at all interested in religious institutions. So, now of course, spiritual individuals can be fostered in religious institutions also. But we are seen as far more religious than spiritual.

And the reason for that is we are very culturally Indian. So, people say that, you know, it's like many, many, many people who are interested in Bhakti also, even they are interested in Krishna Bhakti, they go to other organizations to come to ISKCON. Because they say we want to go back to Krishna, but ISKCON is not taking us back to Krishna, it is taking us back to India.

So, the idea is that, now how much of the Indian culture is essential to Krishna consciousness? That is, that is open to question. One reason why Christianity is spread across the world is, what Jesus Christians say that, Christianity is transcendental to any culture. That means an Indian can be, an African can be an African and still be a Christian.

An Indian can be an Indian, a Hindu can be a, an Indian can be an Indian and still be a Christian. That's why you see South India, Christian churches, some, they adopt many Indian symbolisms. They have Sanskrit shlokas, they have yajnas.

Some of the Sanskrit, their priests also wear saffron. So, the idea is that, ISKCON being tied to a particular culture, that attracts Indians to, because Indians who go to America, they find ISKCON to be their home for them. So, they want to pass their culture to Indians, to their children over there.

So, the very thing that is attracting Indians is alienating Americans or alienating western people. So, those who are successful in western outreach, they significantly downplay the cultural part. So, it's a complicated subject.

Nobody has got, like, a formula that works. So, but Maharaj has used primarily yoga. Through yoga to get people to bhakti, it's been enormously successful.

So, Maharaj said that what the counterculture was in the 1960s, yoga crowd is today. But it's better because the counterculture was into drugs. Those who are into yoga, they have some level of sattva.

Because you might bring some level of discipline. So, that pathway has been created and lots of people are coming to bhakti. But still, there is a long way to go.

Any last questions? I would like to appreciate and thank you that if you are appreciative of a person, for example, if you are giving a class, you are helping them. These people, whatever I am trying to deliver for Krishna, whatever I am trying to get closer to Krishna, that must matter. So, how can I not associate myself with how the person is delivering or giving my class? How can one expect? Maharaj's mood is that devotees should appreciate each other.

In fact, he very much encourages that. He says that if we see another devotee doing good service, that devotee will advance because of service. But if we appreciate that devotee doing that service, by appreciating we will advance.

So, we should have a culture of appreciating each other. That's very important. But having said that, it's also important to recognize that we are doing the service for Krishna's pleasure.

So, sometimes we do not get appreciated. And then it's for us to decide what to do at that time. Then do we feel sufficiently inspired, we can go on doing the service without appreciation.

Or we feel, okay, right now I am doing the service, maybe it will happen in the future and I am ready to persist in that. So, I asked Maharaj that as I give a class and the audience does not seem at all interested, so what do I do? So, Maharaj laughed and said, see that as preparation for future classes and the audience will be interested. So, I think we have to have that long term vision.

Thank you very much. One more question about the plan. So, the main plan in the plan is that for all the powers of placement.

In that plan whatever is the project leader is going to decide where and all the classes are going to be placed in the hotel. So, here we are taking on freedom and facilities. So, the freedom or facility is going to be decided by the classes which are going to be arranged in the hotel or all the properties.

And who does the planning, the freedom or facility? Is it the project leader or the devotees? See, broadly within ISKCON, not within ISKCON I would say, there have been three kinds of organizational structures. What they call it as soft, medium and hard. What it means is that hard, medium and soft.

So, after Chaitanya Mahaprabhu departed, Chaitanya Mahaprabhu did not start any organization. He had followers in Bengal, he had followers in Puri, he had followers in Vrindavan. So, there was no organizational structure.

So, it was broadly a very soft organizational structure that we all are inspired by Mahaprabhu, we want to follow Mahaprabhu. Now, what exactly are the teachings of Mahaprabhu? There is not much clarity about that also. But then Chaitanya Mahaprabhu was written and then that became like a core book, talk about your Siddhanta.

So, that is a soft organizational structure. Broadly, there is an overarching agreement about inspiration. It is a broad teachings.

Now, medium organizational structure came in Gaudiya Mahaprabhu's time with the Gaudiya Mata, which is subsequently ISKCON. So, the medium organizational structure is where there is a leader who decides or the central authority decides major doctrinal issues and major strategy issues. Like Bhagavad Gita is decided, we will go to America, we will go to Europe, we will send our disciples.

But beyond that, each center was quite decentralized. Now, broadly Prabhupada also wanted this medium organizational structure. So, the hard organizational structure is where the leader decides everything.

That every single thing, small or big, it is decided by the leader. So, now, Prabhupada was not very much in favor of this. At one time, the GBC decided that we will centralize all of ISKCON's finances.

And then, after centralizing all the finances, then that central committee will decide how much money to give to each center. So, all money from all centers should come to one place. And Prabhupada, GBC decided it without concerning Prabhupada.

And Prabhupada came to know about it. Prabhupada was so upset, he just suspended the whole GBC. And he told the temple leaders, you can't correspond with me directly.

Prabhupada wrote a very strong letter saying that decentralization business will not work. So, my point is that, now, different leaders, everybody who is a Krishna conscious leader, they have come from a particular background. The way their parents raised them, the way they were raised in schools, the way they were taught in schools.

So, they will bring their ethos of leadership. And that's fair enough. So, broadly, there are some organizational structures which may go more towards hard.

Some will go more towards soft. So, it depends. I don't think that as long as they are following Prabhupada.

So, in hard organizational structures, it's very, very difficult to make a change. And in soft, it is very, very difficult to stop a change. So, there is no pure blessing in this world.

Now, you can say medium is the best. But then what is the medium exactly? That is difficult to say also. So, I think it's something which is evolving.

So, in each place, generally Maharaj has tried to create in such a way that, Dada Gopinath temple, he has tried to build not one temple president, but he will have a group of people who are leaders together. And he has also tried to create, there is a leadership council and a temple management council. So, the idea is that leadership council gives more spiritual vision.

So, they are more Brahminical. And the management council is more Kshatriya. So, of course, I was talking with one of the leaders of the leadership council, he said, in the past, the Brahmins had the power to curse.

The kings don't listen to them. In today's world, what happens, Brahmins don't have the power to curse. So, the Brahmins are advisory.

But if their advice is not taken, you can't do anything. Isn't it? But Maharaj said that the leadership council is like a Brahminical body with teeth. That they can take managerial decisions when required.

So, I think as far as the specific structure is concerned, that's evolving. There is a proposal that within the GBC, we should have a two-level body. And all the gurus should be more in the Brahminical body.

And the managers should be in the Kshatriya. Managers should be in the second GBC council. More like what Maharaj has done in Radhagopinath.

But how will we divide that? Do we have sufficient leaders to do that? That is all a different, it's not an easy question at this stage to answer. So, I think this is evolving. So, we just work with whatever is there.

And if in future we get a leadership role, then we can try to see what system works best. And if we set up a model, that will be adopted by others. Thank you.

Last question, I think. We'll stop with this. Can you give the mic to him? You have a question? Okay, we'll finish with this.

I just want to ask one comment about the Gautam Gopinath Maharaj. First of all, I'm appreciating all the things that he has done. Because, for example, in the last session, Maharaj gave a wonderful lecture.

They actually, Gautam Gopinath, he was in one of the Gopinath Maharaj's lectures. He gave a very good lecture. But then, Gautam Gopinath Maharaj, then, how did his lecture end? Gautam Gopinath Maharaj was a very good teacher.

He was a very good teacher. So, if Maharaj has already provided many services, how can there be less services in the world? Because, Gautam has done more services. If we say, we are in worldwide, Gautam has done more services and more hardships than Maharaj.

Because, others also did it. I don't think so that I can also take the leadership. … Okay, Ma'am.

See, Maharaj is in one sense, Maharaj was never a temple president. He managed the college outreach. But then in Chowpatty also he came, he was never the temple president.

So Maharaj has been more in the role of a guide and an inspirer and he found competent devotees to take the leadership roles. So what happens is that, there is an organization and organization requires certain things. Without them things won't work.

But what happens? Beyond that there are personal relationships and those relationships are what nourish devotees the most. So when Journey Within book was written, at that time I got a lot of opportunity to edit the book for Maharaj. This is a slight tangent but I will come back to your point.

So Maharaj sent the book to me by email and he told me, give your suggestions about this book. So previously I had met Maharaj at the Journey Home. So he said that when you are serving as an editor, don't think I am your guru and you are my disciple.

You are an author, I am an author, just share your thoughts. So then I gave a lot of suggestions and then I sent the email to Maharaj and one day, two days, one week passed, two weeks passed, I got no reply. I started becoming very nervous that why is Maharaj upset with me? And then I showed some of my suggestions to one senior Godbrother and he said, who do you think you are? Why are you doing suggestions like this? So then I went to Radha Gopinath temple, I was in Pune at that time.

Maharaj was giving Sunday Feast class. So after Sunday Feast class, Maharaj was sitting on the asan and meeting different devotees. I thought should I go and meet him or not and at least I will go and offer obeisances.

If Maharaj is upset, we will see what happens, at least I should go. So I went and Maharaj was very grieved and Maharaj said, I got your email and I read all your suggestions very carefully and he still was extremely grieved. And then with the same gravity, he said, they are all very good and then Maharaj smiled and now it is your karma to implement all of them.

So the point is that I sat with Maharaj and Maharaj gave me a lot of time. So my beautiful Maharaj went, every day 3, 4, 5 hours, Maharaj would read through everything and I would write some things like this, like this. So basically that is very demanding.

So that was probably the time, continuously for 15-16 days, very intense service. Then the last day Maharaj told me that tomorrow morning we will send the book for printing. Can you do a last proofreading of the book? So it was almost 300 pages and Maharaj told me at 10 o'clock, tomorrow morning after Bhagavatam class, 10 o'clock we will send the book for printing.

So in night I had to proofread. So I was awake the whole night and previous many nights I had not slept much. So I was trying to read the whole book and I was feeling sleepy at night, I just fell asleep and my head crashed against the laptop, the laptop screen cracked and then somehow I was reading and trying to edit and my laptop died at that time, I got somebody else's laptop and I saved it.

Somehow I completed the next one. And then when I was doing final changes at that time, Maharaj said that, okay this is the final document, I don't want you to touch it. You tell me, I will make each of the changes.

And then I was telling some small changes here, there, here read a comma, here read this full stop, like that. So I am sorry, there is one place where Bhakti Sadan spelling was off. I told Maharaj, we need to correct this spelling.

Maharaj said, congratulations. He said, you would catch it or not. So I completely bewildered, Maharaj just tapped me on the shoulder, don't worry, I was joking.

So I did work, I don't know what it is. So after that, Gaurav asked me, so kaise taa Maharaj ka seva karna? I told him, 15 din bahut intense tha. So Gaurav said, tuvara 15 din hai, main 15 saal se kar raha hoon.

So now how is all this related? The point is that there is Maharaj, when he does his projects, there are certain projects where he is involved. And he is quite demanding. And there, demanding might be a negative word, but he is quite specific about what he wants.

And he will not guilt devotees if they cannot sustain that level of peace. He will still appreciate them. But if, so in an organizational setup, if some things are to be done, then we need competence, we need speed, we need a particular skill set.

So those devotees who have the skill set required for a particular set of services, Maharaj will give them more attention, more time, they will get a lot of association, but then they will also have a lot of pressure. Because within an organization to get things done, that requires effort. So Maharaj can also be quite specific and quite exacting in particular things.

So that is there on one side. At the same time, while being within the organization and working the way organization works, Maharaj is not consumed by that. Maharaj is also aware that there are devotees who will not always have the talents to be successful within the organizational definitions of success.

So somebody who is not, generally within ISKCON if you want to be successful, you have to be a good speaker, a good manager, a good fundraiser. It can be a good counsellor, that is recently it has started coming up. But generally in ISKCON, counselling is more getting people to obey you, not like actually guiding and nourishing people to find their nature and serve accordingly.

So that will also come slowly, it is not that I am not criticizing. But generally if you are a good fundraiser, if you are a good speaker and if you are a good manager, you can grow very fast. There are other services, if you are a good singer, if you are a good pujari, good cook, those are other trajectories are there.

Certain services get glamorized, but certain services do not. So Maharaj is conscious that there are others also who are doing services and those are also valuable. So in public, when he is speaking, he will often glorify these devotees also.

Because they will not be normally valued by the organization. Because Maharaj is the organization, in his personal interaction, so if some devotee is doing, not simple in a devaluing sense, but a devotee is doing a pujari service, coming on time, doing service year after year after year, Maharaj will appreciate them maybe on their birthday or some special occasion. But Maharaj is not going to spend time with them.

So, if Maharaj wants to have some new, maybe a new temple or new initiative in Govardhanikovillage, the devotees who are going to do that, he will spend time with them. So in one sense, both aspects are there. Those who have ability, those who have capacity, they will naturally be appreciated and Maharaj will also do that, through his association, through the time that he gives them.

But others can sometimes feel completely neglected and that he does not want. So, as I said, every service is valued. There is a story of the squirrel and Hanuman.

So in that sense, among all the leaders I have seen in ISKCON, Maharaj has among the best balance between being an institutional leader and being a spiritual inspirer. So, a spiritual inspirer does not necessarily see institutional parameters. So he will inspire and appreciate and encourage everyone.

At the same time, he is also within an institution and he also has to do certain things. So I think working out both is not easy. Does that answer your question? So thank you very much.

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