How to avoid gossiping

[Talk at Ottawa, Canada]

Video

Transcript

This is an AI-generated transcript and may contain some errors.
Hare krishna Thank you very much for coming today and So i’ll speak today on the bhagavad gita 17.15 On how to discipline our speech So i’ll speak broadly on the topic of Gossiping and how to avoid gossiping Nice So gossiping You know, what is gossiping centres? How do we know whether we are gossiping? It’s a broadly two characteristics When we hear something we like About someone we don’t like When we hear something we like about someone we don’t like so All of us If we look at the people around us There are some people whom we just instinctively like some people just we don’t like or some people May be neutral but over a period of interactions Sometimes it may become negative. It may become positive whichever way so we have our mind inside us And as soon as we see someone The mind passes some opinions about some other person You know, sometimes if a sports match is going on Then there’s a commentary going on with that match So like that the mind has a running commentary going on inside us constantly So you see this person short-tempered this person lazy this person forgetful this person insensitive This person in manner We have these comments going on in our mind constantly am I audible there can you hear me? Okay so So now what happens? We have A certain opinions about others. So there are some people we like and some people we don’t like Now people around us also so I spoke about this people we don’t like that’s the part the second part is about when we There are in our conversations.
We keep hearing different things about different people In general The topic that interests most people is people Now we can talk about things we can talk about people and we can talk about ideas Broadly speaking. These are the three broad subjects of discussion We can talk about things objects We can talk about now, of course apart from that we talk about you do this. I’ll do this.
That’s that’s functional conversation But in the deeper beyond the functional conversation. It has to be the centre on things or people or ideas Now things may be of interest to some people Say for example I did engineering So as when I studied engineering it is in general men are more interested in things Women are more interested in people so So women go more into occupations where there is personal relationships men can become nurses, but women are much better nurses Because they can they want to they’re more interested in people they can connect more with people and that’s immediately a gift so that they can connect with infants You know when connecting with infants and small children is very difficult because at one level An infant has no rationality Child at least up to a particular age is always right You know if an adult starts complaining about something late at night, let’s talk about it tomorrow You say why are you disturbing now? But if an infant starts crying at night Mother can’t say why are you talking crying now cry tomorrow morning It can’t do like that so That’s innate gift. So broadly speaking, you know Men are interested more in things people are women are more interested in people Now beyond that there are ideas Now we get an idea some inspiration.
This could be conceptual or it could be something. Okay, you can do this do that whatever So broadly speaking among these three things the most interesting is ideas Even when advertisements have to be made about certain things, sorry, the most interesting among these three is people So if we consider that The Even if things have to be advertised Then it is usually done with people The products are always shown with people when and the kind of Celebrities who endorse a product determines how attractive that product will be how much that product will be sold and similarly ideas Also need to be demonstrated through people In fact, the bhagavad-gita is philosophy And there are people who are interested in it but relatively speaking in the indian tradition the ramayan and the mahabharata and the bhagavatam they have had much more resonance with people because it is It is there are people over there bhagavad-gita is of course people but it’s after the initial Point of krishna and arjuna speaking. It’s very concept rich So in some ways the mahabharata is a demonstration of the principles taught in the bhagavad-gita how they are to be lived So what happens is normally In our conversation we do talk about people quite a bit so when we are talking with about people Then sometimes we come to know certain things about other people which are pleasing to us Sometimes we come to know something which are displeasing to us So normally if somebody hey this person did like this.
Oh, how could they spoken like that? How could they done like that? That’s how we respond at times Now generally what happens is If we hear something good about someone Oh, I didn’t know this person was so kind or this person was so extending or whatever Then our appreciation of that person increases But it’s a and if we also feel happy oh this person is so good But in general if there is some person whom we don’t like Then if we hear something unpleasant about them If we what happens is if somebody we don’t like and somebody speaks good about them, we’ll stop it We don’t want to hear their good side. You think this person like this, but I know how that person actually is We tend to think like that and we tend to In general what happens all of us when we relate with each other this is Of this we all do some attribution Attribution means that whenever we see somebody doing some action Now we never See an action as an action alone We put that action in some context so When we like someone Then we attribute their action to a good motivation And when we don’t like someone we attribute their action to a bad motivation Say for example if somebody is eating a lot I feel if we like them Must be very hungry If you don’t like them such a glutton Now it could be either in the either cases if somebody We don’t like sleeping a lot such a lazy person But if you like that person must be very tired So what happens we see actions But those actions we don’t just see them as actions Why is this person doing like this? We attribute some motivation to that And so this is called as a attribution assumption You know, we assume or we there’s a we attribute certain things and that is based on our assumptions that we have about other people So now this is in general what we how we refer to these other actions but further than that what happens is if we Have a particular perception about others and then Somebody speaks something which reinforces that perception Do you like that? Yeah, I was right you know there is There are practically no other combination of three words That give as much satisfaction to the human ego as I was right I was right So what happens because of this as soon as we hear something we like About someone we don’t like So we have people whom we don’t like so whenever we hear something about it like this spoke like that he spoke like that Then immediately we pounce on it We pounce on it and We start magnifying it Now this is what happens in the Ramayana In the gossip sometimes can be harmless But sometimes it may not be that harmless See, there are different kinds of aggression There can be physical aggression where people start beating each other Now in in civilised societies generally people not become physically aggressive But there is verbal aggression verbal aggression is where you make innuendos where we gossip and where we assassinate the reputation of a person And that can hurt terribly And gossiping might just seem like some fun, you know, we’re just talking about somebody but how it will snowball We don’t know so in the Ramayana We have the Princes Ram Lakshman Hanuman Ram Lakshman Bharat and Shatrughna. They are living together happily And Dashrath has his three queens Who are the queens? Does anyone know? Kaushalya Kaikeyi and Sumitra yes, so now among these See in every relationship recently I was at You know, I was in Stanford.
I was giving a talk over there. So after that one person came and asked me That you’re talking about these texts But these texts have so many objectionable things and I talk about Indian texts. I said, what what do you find? So there’s polygamy Isn’t that objectionable? So I said that There is Descript there in the scripture.
There is a descriptive section. There is a prescriptive section Descriptive means this is how it was prescriptive means. This is how you should act So polygamy is described in the scriptures But broadly speaking it is never prescribed In the sense that wherever there is polygamy there are problems You see almost every incident some problems do come up.
So in this case What happens is That the three queens are living together But Kaikeyi is the youngest and she is the fairest so Dashrath although Kaushalya is the senior most queen after Kaikeyi comes He starts paying more attention to Kaikeyi And Kaushalya feels slighted by that But she bears it and they’re living in a state of you could say unease in a state of Uneasy calm there’s no severe tension or stress between them, but there’s some uneasiness now In the world there are always people who have their vested interests And whenever somebody speaks something to us about someone You know why they are speaking it is important to understand it’s almost Whenever people speak something say what happens here Kaikeyi has a maid What is her name? Manthara. Yes. Now Manthara has been like a nurse for Kaikeyi.
She was there with her from childhood And she grew up with her. She grew up under care and she came with her after marriage to Ayodhya Now Kaushalya had sorry Manthara had a hunchback Now because of that some people would sometimes tease her. She was the butt of some jokes But Kaikeyi treated her almost like a second mother respected her very much And see sometimes if we have some limitations Quite often it is we who are more conscious of that than others After some time people okay.
This is how you are people get used to it But she was very conscious of that And what happened as Kaikeyi became the favourite queen in the family Then Kaikeyi’s stock rose in the royal palace And as Kaikeyi’s stock rose the stock Of her favourite maid servant also rose so she became the most Influential among the servants in the palace And then when she heard the news That Ram is going to be coronated As the prince regent and then the king. She was extremely agitated She thought That if Ram becomes the king Then his mother and his wife Will become the most prominent women in the palace And if Kaikeyi is no longer prominent Then I will have no prominence And she became very insecure and angry because of that And she ran to Kaikeyi. Kaikeyi was relaxing in her palace Says what are you doing sitting here in peace while everything is being stripped away from you So what do you mean? Says don’t you know? That Ram is going to be coronated as the prince regent So actually Kaikeyi Loved Ram.
Ram was such a lovable person And basically there was a lot of amity because there were some conflicts the conflicts were kept in major control. She was so happy She actually took out her jewel necklace and gave it to Manthara and she said that you Have brought such a wonderful news to me I am delighted. Here is your reward And Manthara took that and hurled it on the ground Says you call this good news.
This is catastrophe He said if Ram becomes the king Then he will see Bharat as a rival And he may exile Bharat or he may find some pretext and have him executed also This is all ridiculous and even initially Kaikeyi thought it is preposterous. He said what are you speaking? I have seen how the brothers interact with each other There is Ram can never do such a thing. He says You are the daughter of a king you are the wife of a king still do you not understand the ways of the king? ways of You want to get that chair here If it is because the mic is a little Is everybody able to hear? No, you can sit on the chair and be comfortable I am not used to sitting Sure, you keep the chair accessible in case they need it Is everybody able to hear me? Thank you No problem, that’s fine.
So at this point Kaikeyi just dismisses it but See everybody has We all have different attitudes to different people So Kaikeyi has personally no animosity against Ram And when Manthara is saying Ram will do like this she doesn’t believe it Then Manthara see Whenever people want to get something done through us What happens is they know which buttons to press They try to press this button. Nothing happens. You have to press another button.
Nothing happens They try this button and we get angry. Yeah now this is the button to press So what happens is those who anger us conquer us Those who anger us conquer us Now there are times when we need to be assertive But if our anger is simply triggered by others manipulation Then we may think we are we are strong See anger Gives the illusion of strength But gives us weakness When we become angry we feel I am being very strong. I am taking a strong stand.
I am doing this But actually we are being manipulated over there So when she presses the Ram button nothing happens then she says Actually Now she recognises that she cannot speak anything against Ashwath directly So she says When Kaikeyi looks at him, this is preposterous she says If it was just as preposterous as you think it to be Now, why is this coronation happening? When Bharat and Shatrughna are not here Why are they being sidelined? And now what had happened actually is That Somehow Dashrath Maharaj had got an inspiration to renounce He had been thinking about for a long time, but at one particular time Now there are there are stories given in the Ramayana there are stories given in the Other Ramayans or other retellings of the Ramayana which come afterwards. So this is not in Valmiki Ramayana He says that Dashrath Maharaj he had been ruling for a long time But at one particular point When he was just ready to go to the court As he does he just felt I am becoming old he saw creases on his face. He saw white white hair coming up.
He says I should renounce the world now And as soon as the inspiration came with the name he said Ram is entirely competent. Let me hand over And then he consulted astrologer and astrologer said that it is best that this be done if you want to do it do it soon So then all these factors came together And he decided to have this transfer And somehow at that time Bharat and Shatrughna were not there So what happens If you if you if somebody wants to make someone look bad None of us are perfect. Every one of us is false So people can find something and they can magnify it So in this case, he said why is this happening? When they are awake And he saw That I have got Kaikeyi’s attention Till this point Kaikeyi was dismissive But now she’s hearing it And then as soon as she noticed it that he’s got she’s got my attention then she went for the kill Do you know who is behind all this? Your rival your co-wife Kaushalya is behind this All this time The king was spending time with you And she must have been burning in envy And now she has got the opportunity to get back at you Now, although as I said, there was no overt enmity, but there was always tension among the co-wives And as soon as she heard Kaushalya is behind this Immediately she became agitated So what happened over here was That she found the button with which she could control And then she spun a whole narrative a whole narrative so Mantra kept speaking Kaikeyi kept hearing And Now Now I wouldn’t say that Kaikeyi and Kaushalya didn’t Kaikeyi disliked Kaushalya But it is that there’s always some tension because they were co-wives.
So it’s natural some rivalry would be there But as soon as she heard Oh She there’s a scheme over there. There’s a scheme to manipulate to Take everything away from me She got completely carried away and then You know when doubt comes in Sometimes there are valid reasons to doubt also But what happens when doubt comes in it starts growing it starts growing it starts growing and in general Whenever we are interacting with people we need to begin with the presumption of innocence We need to give people the benefit of doubt But if we let doubt grow uncritically Then it grows and what happens we become The plaintiff we become the judge we become the jury And then without even hearing from the other person We decide the case you are tried and you are convicted So that Is what happened to Kaikeyi? Just by hearing from Mantra and just dwelling on it everything grew so much within her and by the end What had happened was She when she went to Dashrath or when she started She went into her The place where she would go for it is like a sulking chamber for her She went there and when Dashrath came there was a jubilant mood And he was aghast to see her in distress like that. So what happened? And then when I’m very she could see that she was very hurt or very angry or very upset That’s whatever it is he was in a very happy mood I’ll do whatever you tell me to do And he was like unsuspecting Dear entering into a tiger’s den And then when she asked for those horrendous Benedictions Normally, we don’t think of benedictions as horrendous But that’s how it was.
She said that send Ram away to the forest for 14 years and let my son Bharat become the king Dashrath couldn’t believe this She said who is this person? What is she asking? She said how has Ram ever offended you in any way? Now he tried to He says if you want Bharat to he was initially not ready to give anything But he’d given the word of honour. Finally, he said please withdraw your request if you want Bharat to become the king Fine, but don’t send Ram away What fault is it and I can’t live without him But unfortunately what happened to her was That the more Dashrath protested the more Dashrath defended Ram The more it reinforced her idea That this is a whole scheme And she thought that actually I am protecting Bharat I am protecting his rights He is not here to protect himself, so I’ll protect him. So Mantara had coached Coached in the evil sense not in the good sense had coached That as long as Ram is in the kingdom Bharat Bharat’s hold on the kingdom will not be steady Bharat may not even accept the kingdom or even if he accepts the courtiers and the citizens will not accept Send him away for 14 years and 14 years is a long enough time by which Bharat will be able to show his expertise in ruling And he will win over the citizens and the courtiers and then Even if Ram comes back, there will be no problem.
So she said don’t compromise on either of these requests And that’s how Ram had to be exiled for no fault of his And exile is not a It’s not a mild thing I Just came from America about I was there for two months So I presume in Canada, it’s not that much of an anxiety. But in America, there’s a lot of anxiety about People not getting their h1 visa extended Most people are working in that category and if they don’t get extended they have to leave So as I spoke on the Ramayana So the nearest we can have an example of what Ram went through we had to leave the kingdom is If your visa is not extended You have to leave the country Now you say I have my life. I have my career.
I have my home. I have my family I have my social circle. I will leave everything and go Now even for that it’s not so bad for us because if we go to our home country, we also have a social circle there We also have our relatives there And even if you have to leave the country you can take our wealth with us and go But when Ram he went he had to leave everything and go so exile is just Is a the world is reserved for the worst of criminals.
That is just one level before execution Execution means your life itself is taken away. Exile means everything except your life is taken away So now Dashrath felt so guilty about this He felt so torn so afflicted And eventually he lost his life And it is through it all Kaikeyi had become so stone-hearted She did not feel anything It’s only when Bharat came back And actually when Bharat came back She told him very proudly You know, there was this whole column Nobody is actually guilty in their own eyes It’s very very difficult for us to admit our own faults Some people say you know that my opinion may be wrong, but I am right It’s very difficult for us to admit that we are wrong and what happens we repaint The story in such a way sometimes consciously sometimes unconsciously so that we think that we are doing the right thing So Kaikeyi honestly thought that actually she was She genuinely thought that she was actually only doing all this for Bharat And when Bharat came, Bharat asked her where is my father? Why is the kingdom in such gloom? He said that your father has departed for the next world the kingdom now awaits you What happened? And this she told there’s a conspiracy afoot to steal the kingdom away from you and I foiled that conspiracy She told the whole story and as Bharat heard this He was so horrified aghast. He says what? He says you send Ram away because of you my father died And you think I’ll be pleased by this? You are not my mother You are the goddess of destruction You are the goddess of destruction Descended in our dynasty to destroy our whole dynasty She said I reject you as my mother It was at that time When the real Bharat spoke these words Now there was an imaginary Bharat in her mind For whom she was doing all this and she was imagining that that Bharat will be pleased with her But what happened when this collision occurred between the imaginary Bharat and the real Bharat Then her illusion was completely dispelled But by that time it was too late It’s too late so Gossip, you know when it is when it can seem like it can seem like harmless fun But you know things that things that harm less Are not harmless They may harm they may seem to be not It’s a little harm, but that little may not stay little How it can snowball? We don’t know nowadays, especially With social media available You know one person makes one innuendo or pass one rumour And they just snowballs out of control.
It can go all over the world It said that A falsehood can travel half the way across the planet Before truth can even get dressed to go out That’s how things work in today’s world Now now we might get some pleasure When we hear something negative about someone And we might get some pleasure in sharing and telling that to others also So quite often what happens is often people say can you keep a secret? Now when they’re saying this itself, what does it mean that they can’t keep a secret Those who can’t keep a secret tell others to keep a secret So usually When we hear something bad about someone At that time it might give us some pleasure but What happens especially if it is something bad about someone we don’t like Then we need to check ourselves Because at that time we will grab onto it. Our tendency will be to grab onto it Because we already have a negative conception about that person And then on top of that when we hear something negative Just grab onto like a dog might grab onto a bone like that will grab onto it So at that time we have to be especially cautious. So those whom we those whom we respect and we Appreciate then we’ll give the benefit of doubt Sometimes we will give them only benefit of doubt and no doubt at all That may also happen that may not always be good.
But the point is that if we already have negative conception about someone And then you hear something negative We’ll just put two and two together and make 222 We’ll just expand it so much And especially As I said in today’s world because we have internet and social media things can grow very fast So what can I know as devotees who are trying to grow spiritually In a spiritual movement We also have a particular code of behaviour a code of conduct that we expect from each other And sometimes what happens our spirituality Instead of making us more understanding Makes us more judgemental Making us more understanding means yes, I have my struggles. We have their struggles. We are all trying to move forward But making more judgemental means this is how you are meant to behave.
Why are you behaving like this? So you become more judgemental And when that happens Then that when there is a overall judgemental attitude Then that is where gossip flourishes When there is more of an understanding attitude Then gossip doesn’t flourish Gossip may come it’s like the soil is barren Then whatever weeds are there they don’t grow. So if you consider gossip to be like a weed Then a judgemental attitude a suspicious attitude That is the soil where the weed of gossip grows very fast so I’ll talk about this about how to deal with gossip in three broad parts So first is that at a fundamental level We have to see that our spirituality needs to make us more understanding more empathic not more judgemental In 6.32 in the bhagavad-gita Krishna talks about the perfection of yoga At one level perfection of yoga krishna says is to see him everywhere. That’s 6.30 sarvam chamai pashyati One who sees me everywhere and sees everything in me that person is never lost And i am never that there was never lost to me and i am never lost to them Krishna says but then two verses later he talks about that perfection of spiritual consciousness Is not just seeing god everywhere in two verses later he also says seeing Everyone equally Seeing everyone equally means that Ultimately, we see everybody is a soul like me Everybody has a body and mind and everybody is struggling Now what i am struggling with may be different from what somebody else is struggling with Now I will be struggling with anger and somebody else might be struggling with lust I might be struggling with depression And somebody else might be struggling with loneliness I might be struggling with lethargy and somebody else might be Struggling with hyperactivity We all have different kinds of weaknesses but if we see spiritual knowledge spiritual knowledge essentially means As applied to relationships is to be able to see people separate from their weaknesses Okay, this person is here we have this weakness But if we if we apply permanent labels on people Then where is our spiritual vision? We are just being so judgemental we are reducing people to their weakness this person So all I said earlier labels we have that You may lazy Or arrogant or this or that in spiritual life.
You can also add a label deviant This person is deviating this person not following this person. So what happens? At one level, this is the person over here. This is the person over here.
This is their weakness And then on top of that is our label So when we affix a label on someone You know what happens we stop seeing them as they are Yes, they have their weaknesses but beyond that they are soul. So our spirituality means we should see more strongly beyond the weakness to the person That’s how we will become more understanding but sometimes in the name of spirituality we We see just the label We don’t see the soul. We don’t see the weakness.
We just see the label And then we reduce the person to that label. So for example I got this to demonstrate this Say if this is a sheet now if this is here, I can’t see him right now, but the closer this comes to me Then I can’t see anything except this sheet So similarly In our opinions about people they’re like that We cannot have avoid having opinions about people And we had a function in the world and our mind gives opinions But we need to hold our opinion loosely not tightly The tight more tightly we hold the opinion then we can’t see anything except the opinion But loosely means this is this is what I think about this person But who do I really know everything about that person I don’t know everything even about myself in every day If we observe ourselves, we discover so many things about ourselves No, I got so angry. I didn’t know I was such a short-tempered person I felt like that.
Okay, we discover good and bad about ourselves. So what to speak about others So our that’s that’s the first point I said for dealing with enemy dealing with gossiping tendency is that We we will have opinions but we hold them loosely lightly at a distance not tightly Completely covering our vision rather our spirituality What should do is we should be able to see people as souls who are potentially divine as parts of god and Beyond that they have certain certain body mind covering based on which they have some conditions. So I need to Now we cannot be blind to people’s weaknesses If a we know somebody is forgetful And that person they have something very some very important thing to be done Now if we forget that they are forgetful Then we will be a fool We cannot we cannot afford to forget that maybe it’s our duty to remind them or tell that somebody else to remind them Or tell somebody else to do that.
So that’s a that’s a functional understanding So we can’t avoid opinions we need for functioning. We need some understanding of how people are But we can’t apply those labels permanently on them and reduce people to their labels So if our spirituality is making us more judgemental means make our judgemental means obsessed on the labels then We we will have walls between us and them and that is where Gossip will flourish. But if you are more understanding, that means there is the label There is the there is the deficiency that the behaviour and beyond that there is a person So spirituality means we see the person beyond the particular behaviour And that way we can avoid being uh prey setting ducks to gossip If you are empathic Yes, this person maybe have made even if they have done like that, even if the gossip is true Now more often than not gossip is Not true But even if it is true, we can be more empathic and they have their struggles.
I have my struggle Had the first point the second point would be Like in order to deal with gossip We learn to give others as much benefit of doubt as We would like them to give us all of us There are somebody can speak bad things about us also And if somebody started spreading rumours things about us and they never asked us We would feel so bad about it so we Prajanak Pandit says that Atmavatsara Bhuteshu same point you see everyone equally like yourself this Atmavatsara Bhuteshu is basically a A vedic or dharmic version of the golden rule in christianity do unto others as you would want others to do unto you That means that If I were in the situation, how would I prefer the other person to be So, let me try to give them as much benefit of doubt Now this is not easy to do but it is very very helpful I travel across the world. Sometimes I had to Mediate and try to resolve conflicts But sometimes you know people are so judgemental. I was at one conflict resolution session mediation session and two people were Trying to talk with each other.
So one person was trying to resolve the issue Says I know you are angry with me The other person said i’m not angry with you Anger is an expensive emotion. You are not worth it Now that means somebody has already judged and convicted that person and reduced them to nothing Hmm So then Now you it might seem like very clever to say something like this, you know, but imagine if somebody said like that to us How we feel about it? So give others benefit of the give others the same benefit of doubt that we would like others to give us And it is helpful Especially when we are about to judge someone and we hear something from someone And then they’re about to speak it to someone else or even when somebody’s about to speak it At that time we say tell me more about it See quite often when we are hearing about Krishna We start thinking. Okay, when will this class end? But when somebody starts gossiping More more Please speak more it becomes like that So but whenever it starts at that time It’s helpful to to look at Times when we have ourselves being judged And just living life for 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 years, whatever we have lived we we all are have been at the Have been the you could say victims of misjudgment.
We have been the victims of gossip. We have been targets of that So how we feel about it? So generally Any negative resolution is very difficult To stick to if I say I will never get angry That is a very difficult resolution to keep Because what happens in that resolution it is more focussing on what I will not do And that is that creates a sense of deprivation that requires a sense of control Which we often may not have so a more positive resolution in that case Is that I will respect everyone’s right to be spoken to politely That means that if I was angry if somebody were angry at me I would expect him to speak politely Okay, and I may have made a mistake if nobody likes to be spoken rudely or arrogantly or dismissively disrespectfully So so I’ll respect everyone’s right to be spoken to politely so similarly if we say that You know, I will when whenever we hear somebody gossiping about someone speaking something which We feel joy When we hear something bad about someone and I will respect everyone’s right to get a fair hearing I’ll respect everyone’s right to get a fair hearing It could be that there is a person has done something wrong But everybody deserves a fair hearing. It’s it’s very painful for us When people judge us without hearing from us also It will be something similar for others So if we can learn to give others that benefit of doubt as much benefit of doubt as we would want them to give to us Now we may say but that person didn’t give me benefit of doubt.
Why should I give them? No, that’s true. It’s it’s it’s Understandable that kind of emotion this person judged me. Why should I not judge them this person gossiped about me? Why should I gossip about them? This is where I’ll come to the last point that actually In the spiritual path There are different kinds of Tests or temptations Now some temptations are very easy to perceive now if If say we are We have gone to supermarket And we see something Which nobody noticing there are no cameras.
Maybe I can just shoplift it We get the tendency we get the thought over it Now if we have a reasonably developed sense of conscience when saying this I should not do it I’m feeling tempted I should not do it Now at one level saying no to a temptation is painful But some some things which we easily identify as temptation Then we can say no to it much more easily But what happens it’s much more dangerous when our when our intelligence Is guarding us But sometimes what happens the intelligence starts instead of guarding Pointing out is a temptation intelligence are justified so I’ll conclude with this point that see basically If Inside us there is a lower side and there is a higher side So broadly you could say the mind is associated with lower side impulses. The mind has a tendency to gossip And the intelligence Has a tendency to intelligence tendency is to see long term to see or to see Uh things in a broader perspective and whatever the mind says the intelligence evaluates the intelligence checks Checks means in two senses the word check can have check means evaluate check also means regulate So the mind says come on yell at this person, but the intelligence checks Then what happens? Then if the intelligence is checking then we won’t just Wildly give in to our energies so if unfortunately our mind gets Mind controls the intelligence Then what happens? We do wrong and then we justify that wrong And I was talking where I was at one place and there The many devotees had complaints about one of the leaders over there that he was very short tempered and When I was talking with him, he says I don’t need to learn anger management People just need to learn to not make me angry So basically if we outsource the responsibility for our behaviour to someone else Then what is happening our intelligence is being used to justify what we are doing Rather than to regulate what we are doing And that is a very very dangerous situation to me So at that time when we see somebody starts speaking some gossip And then our mind can be so cunning Sometimes we start sharing with the others and say actually I’m increasing awareness in the community Now if you want to increase we are here as the international society for krishna consciousness So you want to raise awareness raise awareness of krishna speak about krishna Now if you want to speak aware raise awareness about people and their wrongdoings well, actually speaking the two The scriptures themselves tell that kaliyuga is an ocean of faults And now To Raise awareness about people’s faults requires In kaliyuga to raise awareness about people’s faults requires as much expertise As is required to show people water in an ocean Water is everywhere If you are an ocean and if you are lost We need to raise awareness of the land. That is where you go land is there So point now sometimes what happens when we tell people’s faults we feel i’m so clever I can see faults in this person.
I can tell the false other person But what is the use of that? Now, of course, there are certain situations where if somebody is abusing their power and then they have to be that has to be pointed out then in a proper Uh sensitive vaishnav way that can be done. But most of the time gossiping means If our intelligence starts saying that you know, actually i’m raising awareness Then Actually, we need to raise aware our own awareness that my mind has taken over my intelligence So we need to keep our intelligence strong And one way to keep the intelligence strong Is by studying shastra by connecting with krishna That means when we connect with krishna, like I said this person this person judged me So why should I not judge that person? But if we do like that then where is our spirituality where is our krishna consciousness so devotee the attitude is that Okay In this situation this person is speaking like this. How can I best serve krishna? In this situation, how can I serve krishna? Sometimes it might just be by changing the subject And that person is talking something gossip.
We change the subject and we talk start talking something about more about krishna If that person keeps talking about that Then we can politely You know either walk away from there politely saying i’m uncomfortable talking about this. Can we talk about something else? And somebody insists no. No, this is what we need to talk about then we might if we can’t walk away we can just be there for whatever time is required and then Be a little careful about associating with those people.
We can’t change people entirely some people just love to gossip They don’t get rasa in chanting the holy names They get rasa in gossiping about those who are chanting the holy names So what happens with such people it’s very important that we protect our bhakti so Krishna says in the bhagavad-gita that As all people surrender unto me I reward them accordingly What this means is krishna’s movement is so big that krishna just as krishna is a kalpataru Krishna is a desire fulfilling tree So krishna’s movement is also like a desire fulfilling tree So desire fulfilling tree means whatever we desire That tree will give us that So in krishna’s movement, whatever we desire, we’ll get it If somebody wants power somebody wants respect In krishna’s movement We can get a lot of respect Isn’t it where else if you go as soon as you enter if you just become little senior people will bow down to you Does it happen many places so if you want respect you can get respect if we can get want power we can get power Now if we want money We can get that also if somebody wants controversy They can get a lot of controversy also Somebody wants gossip. They can get gossip also And if somebody wants krishna, they can get krishna also It’s up to us what do I want So some people unfortunately might have got sidetracked when they are here, but they are interested in They are interested in gossiping they not really got a taste for krishna nor are they interested in getting a taste for krishna So then we have to say what have I come here for? I have come here for krishna. So let me associate with those whose association inspires me to go towards krishna And let me try to become a person who will encourage others to go towards krishna That’s where the krishna vision we are here for connecting with krishna So, how can I serve krishna in the situation? How can I please krishna in the situation? When we have that attitude then what will happen at the very least We won’t become transmitters of gossip And at the best we might even be able to transform gossip.
If it means you don’t gossip Sometimes it just requires one person. There’s one person who is inflaming and spreading rumours So in general most people go with the crowd So there’s one person who’s active I was at an interfaith conference recently and there they’re talking about almost all religious traditions The extremists are very few See most people who come to any religious path. They have come primarily to To get some aid for moving ahead in their life And to grow spiritually But there are always some extremists And usually those who are at the extreme they are the most noisy This is right that is wrong this is like this is like that and then what happens if we go along with them So if there’s one person who is like that And nobody opposes them then everybody goes that way Because most people tend to be go along with the flow But if you just stem the flow, let’s not talk about this Or, you know, we need to find out more whatever extend that flow then we can actually not only protect ourselves But we can also protect the community around us and that’s how Anudvega karambha can speak in a way that doesn’t agitate people’s minds But speak in a way That helps others To come towards krishna when we speak Not to often we speak to give others A piece of our mind We get angry we have some suspicions we have some make some accusations We should speak not to give others a piece of our mind We should speak to give others peace of mind But unfortunately we take away our peace of mind and take away others peace of mind So if we try to see how I can please krishna how I can go closer to krishna Then that is a very powerful way by which we can avoid the tendency to gossip.
So i’ll summarise What I spoke today I spoke on this topic of avoiding how to avoid gossiping. So what what does gossip mean? I think two things does anyone remember? Yeah To hear something about someone you don’t like to hear something No something more let’s hear something Yes to hear something we like about Someone we don’t like yeah do not like thank you. Thank you.
That’s gossip So then I talked about how we have our opinions about others some people just like some people who don’t like and in the so These may just be instinctive gut feelings or this may be based on experience and interactions But either way we have opinions our mind keeps giving commentary about others Whoever we associate with and then I talk about when we talk broadly we might talk about three things. Do you remember? things people ideas So Most people are interested in people in general So now when we talk about people, how do we talk about them? So then I talked about the story of mantara how she Manipulated kaikey So that her vested interest of maintaining her royal position As the most prominent Maid servant could be maintained So when people speak some gossip about someone You something negative about someone something is going on and they have their vested interests And they will find out which button can be pressed so that we can become controlled those who anger us conquer us And then I talked about how Uh, this is gossip. It’s not just some harmless fun Things that harm less are not harmless Eventually, they can snowball And in today’s world with social media around character assassination Can go across the world even before Somebody can issue a clarification so that’s why We need to be careful and they talk about three steps by which we can avoid The gossiping tendency first is that we become more empathic not more judgemental by our spirituality That means people are souls parts of god.
They have certain body mind which is based on their certain limitations And based on their limitations and our experience of their experience we form some labels So to be judgemental means to reduce people to their labels to hold the label So close to our eyes that we don’t see anything apart from that label Whereas to be spiritual means to go beyond the label to go beyond the body and mind to go to the soul And see everyone is a soul like me everyone Everyone is Potentially spiritual and that brought us the next point if everybody is so like me Then to deal with gossip. Let me give others The same benefit of doubt that I would like them to give me so I talked there about how the presumption of innocence Is very important Otherwise, we can we can jump to conclusions. I talked about attribution We attribute certain behaviour certain motivations to people’s behaviour based on our presumptions about them and Generally to make a negative resolution is very difficult.
I won’t get angry Or I won’t gossip But a more positive resolution is easier to keep that I respect everyone’s right to be spoken to politely or I’ll respect everyone’s right to have a fair hearing so that way we can we can Give people the benefit of doubt and if we feel that but they didn’t give me the benefit of doubt They judge me why should I not judge them? Then we have to think that why am I here for? You know, our mind can become so strong that it can use the intelligence to justify what it is doing But the intelligence is meant to regulate to check the mind check means to evaluate and regulate And for doing that we need to hear scripture regularly and strengthen our spiritual connection with krishna Then we can think why why am I here for? Krishna’s movement is like a kalpat like a desire fulfilling tree. So if you want respect if you want power if you want gossip And if you want krishna, whatever you want, you can get over here So we have come here to get krishna So let us act in a way that can help us to move closer to krishna And let us associate with those who can help us to move closer to krishna and At the very least by this we can avoid becoming transmitters of gossip And at best we can even become transformers of the gossipy environment So if we are not judgemental if we give the benefit of doubt and we are krishna conscious Then the soil of our relationships will become barren as far as the weed of gossip can grow And it can become fertile so that the the seed of krishna bhakti can grow And that can enrich ours and others lives forever. Thank you very much.
Hare krishna Hare krishna So any questions or comments Yes, please Do you have any comments any comments? Mataji you have any comments? Yes question I guess Fault finding would follow along the same lines of that are quite similar and how how can you get over that automatic fault finding? Okay, yeah Yeah, is it possible to get over the fault finding tendency well firstly Every tendency has a black and a white side so Sometimes some standards have to be maintained And for that if somebody is not doing the right thing Noting the fault is not a problem This is how it should be done. This is how it is being done. That’s okay.
But when we talk about a fault finding tendency That means we tend to see the fault first and we tend to see the fault the most As I said we reduce the person down to the fault So we if at all somebody has a very strong fault finding tendency We could use that fault finding tendency to find faults with the fault finding tendency itself Everything can be used in devotional service So we can use it use the fault finding tendency to find faults with the fault finding tendency. What does that mean? That means the one thing is That see everybody has faults I was once doing a Programme a workshop with devotees and then I was talking about tolerance So I said when you practise in spiritual life, you have to tolerate many things So what all the things we have to tolerate so one devotee raised is that I said yes He said we have to tolerate devotees They have to tolerate devotees I said yes, that’s a good realisation And we are trying to practise spiritual life. We have to tolerate each other because all of us have defects But as we grow spiritually, we will realise that devotees are tolerating us It’s not that we are tolerating others.
Others are also tolerating us. That’s how it is So in general, if we consider the fact that all of us have faults and Different people may have different faults so How how would we feel if somebody keeps finding faults within us? We are all here as volunteers And if somebody finds faults too much, we just become discouraged and go away So the most important thing that is required for anyone to perceive Perceiver on the spiritual path is encouragement It’s encouragement, appreciation, kind words And if we if we find faults basically we dishearten people And people just now People just go away and then what is the use of that? So sometimes it might be that a person is already burdened by 10-15 things that have gone wrong in their lives And one small fault that we find in them That might like become like an unbearable burden for them so So Fault finding doesn’t really help in the sense that fault finding simply alienates and disheartens people now If at all you have to find faults in the sense that we have to follow certain standards and somebody is not following them Then we have to do it in a very sensitive way So one of the best best Not judges the best parameters For understanding whether we have the adhikar whether we have the right to find fault Is to check our own reaction to it If we get joy in finding faults Then that means We are not purely motivated That means even if we don’t even if we speak politely Something in our tone will come out and that will alienate the other person So the the person who can find fault is the person who gets no joy in finding fault The purpose is simply to help the other person Now if you go on this path, then it’s going to hurt you. It’s going to hurt others also So if that is if we don’t get any joy in finding faults, then we It’s likely that at least at a subconscious level No, sometimes you know when some people are finding faults, you can almost see a glee on their face.
Hey, I caught you And it’s it’s very alienating when it is like that So that is the second thing when at all we are to find fault we should get no pleasure in it And thirdly we have to find the sometimes our tendencies as soon as we notice a fault just speak it at that point But sometimes that may not be the right time to speak it in general First of all what has if the soul is here the person the particular deficient behaviour is here So we need to we may have to evaluate the behaviour, but we need to validate the person first That means this is not a rejection of you. This is not a judgement about you This is about this so only in a relationship where there is some trust there is some Understanding that the other person is my value share When the other person feels validated By our overall conduct in that relationship then even if they feel evaluated At some other aspect they won’t they won’t get carried. They won’t They won’t feel too bad about it so in general we if our interactions with others have to be there we need to the appreciation needs to be more than the than the criticism in the fault finding Sometimes what happens is that we have a lot of appreciation in our heart But we don’t speak that at all.
And the only thing we speak is false And the only interaction that we have is someone. Hey, you didn’t do this. Why did you do like this? Why did you forget this? Why did you do that? And it’s it’s the relationship becomes very strained by that So we need to appreciate genuinely And then the appreciation and the person feels validated then if we have to find some fault, that’s it’s okay at that time.
Okay Thank you Any other questions? Yes Hmm Yeah So, how do we prevent the associative mode of the mind where We have to have some functional Opinion about the people but that shouldn’t carry over in other aspects Yeah, I think is I did an exercise I was in Australia recently and we did a treat over there so We did one exercise among that was it Let the first thought that you have about anyone be positive This is actually a vedic saying It was one way of it. Let let let everyone be happy. That’s one But there’s another is that let my first thought about everyone be positive and then so the exercise that we had done was that The people about whom we tend to think negative Now write down at least three positive attributes about them We will have to sometimes struggle to find those attributes But if you do it, we find that and then keep that with us and especially before we are going to interact with that person Sometimes we know Some interactions are like walking into a mind field Because already there is a history of tension and before that just try to look at those positive attributes So at that time when the impulses are going very strong the mind is in associative mode At that time for our intelligence to work And to think about something else It’s be difficult.
But if our intelligence has already done the work And then we keep the product of that work ready with us Then we can simply refer to the product of the work that’s easier in general We cannot be as perceptive In the mode of passion as we are in the mode of goodness The mode of passion where we are running around doing things mode of passion is mode of goodness is when we are thoughtful So so when we are calm and thoughtful we write down the good qualities of others And and when we are running around and we are about to have some Crucial conversation high voltage conversations High-stake conversations and before that look at that. So at least that positive attitude will Will that those thinking of those positive attributes of that person will bring some positivity to that interaction And it’s also good if we can talk with somebody Who appreciates that person? In my interaction this person has been so judgemental this person has been so like this But is there someone else? You see sometimes we see that somebody likes so many things. What do you see in that person? But maybe they’re seeing something which we are not seeing So it’s very difficult for us to change our opinion ourselves I don’t want to I don’t want to have this opinion about this.
I don’t want to be negative But if our interactions have been negative of or our impressions from those interactions have been negative It’s very difficult to change it ourselves, but talking with somebody who has had more positive interaction that person helps quite a bit There’s a question here. Yes, please Yeah, it’s difficult Yeah That’s true So, what do we do if we have a person who’s very angry gossipy negative And we have to be with them in work or home or neighbourhood Yeah, we can just control ourselves, but what about them there are broadly two kinds of people Some people bring happiness wherever they go And some people bring happiness whenever they go And in everybody’s life There are only some people in two categories both the categories So it’s just the way the world is fashioned that some people will be some people will be People who will we will heave a sigh of relief when we don’t have to interact with them That’s how it is now generally We can’t change anyone What we can basically do is that every relationship works best at particular distances That means that in every relationship there is a bond and there is a boundary And if there is no bond, then there is no relationship. But if there is no boundary, then also there is no proper relationship So we we can’t control the other person, but to some extent we can define the boundaries of the relationship That means that If that person talks and we don’t pay much attention to them If if we have a if we have the Kind of relationship you can tell them I don’t like to talk about these things I would prefer not to talk about whatever you say now.
We set the parameters now if they may go on doing it But we don’t have to reciprocate especially in today’s world where It’s more egalitarian Generally, the mood is that if you don’t step on my shoes step on my feet. I will step on your feet So so if we set the boundaries Then that person may be the way they are but it won’t affect us that much. Yeah, okay.
I’ll come to that point No, so now this is an important point and if they keep press they keep pressing our buttons so the issue is here that we all Just as sometimes we sustain physical moods We also sustain emotional moods So sometimes say somebody has got a bad shoulder Now sometimes the bad shoulder is so bad that you have to go to a doctor and do some therapy and try to get it healed Sometimes it’s just that okay your movement is limited, but you go on with life with that Just as different physical wounds we deal with differently Some we just let them heal naturally some we take some intensive therapy to heal it some we Just learn to live with it. It’s not curative. So what happens the pain because of the physical wound would be there But over a period of time and this is how it is Some people stammer while speaking Sometimes some stammer therapy might help them to cure it.
Some just have to know nothing is working So i’ll communicate with whatever way I can Using this with this limitation itself. So like that we also Will in the course of relationships sustain some emotional wounds So now some emotional moods we may want to immediately heal them This shouldn’t happen like this But some emotional wounds might just be like some incurable physical wounds They might just be there So then what we need to do is We may have to live with pain But we don’t have to live in pain What does that mean? We expand our consciousness That live with pain means pain is a companion but live in pain means pain becomes the container That means we that is what consumes our consciousness we can’t think of anything So live with pain means we expand our consciousness To see okay. This person is like this And this person keeps speaking like this.
Let me try not to take this person’s word seriously So it’s not that easy, but if we expect that we accept that if this person is going to speak like this so then gradually we we If we decide to we all can develop a thick skin We all as we grow spiritually we want a tender heart But we need to cover the tender heart with the thick skin so there are some people who will just criticise and in some ways we just have to Move on in our life without taking their words so seriously That means as I said that the dogs may bark, but the caravan rolls on so It’s important to if you’re going to interact with such people or work with such people It’s important to have the bigger picture in your mind Is what am I here for? What is my purpose? Say if you’re just going for a stroll and somebody insults us How dare you insult me? Now we might turn and argue with that person or confront that person But say if you are going for an important job interview Am I going on somebody insults the insult is the same and it will affect but I don’t have time for this Let me move on So in general if our purpose becomes prominent in our consciousness We focus on that purpose then what happens then that pain might still be there But the pain won’t consume our consciousness because our consciousness has become bigger by which we are focussing on the purpose And okay this person I have to tolerate let me just live with it And let me move on so tolerance comes primarily by Tolerance essentially means to keep small things small so that we can focus on the big things So now unless we have some big thing to focus on What will happen the small thing will become big if we don’t have anything to fight for It’s not that we’ll stop fighting If we don’t have anything to fight for we will fight for anything So in general If we don’t have a purpose Something something that is important for us something that we want to contribute in our life something which we really Want our life to represent Then any small thing will become big And of course big things will become huge Out of proportion only but if we focus on that big purpose then we may have to live with pain But we won’t live in pain So that’s the big thing Okay, thank you And if the ladies have any questions No Okay. Yes How to overcome the dualities of life In 5.20 in the bhagavad gita krishna says that That don’t become elated when there is happiness and don’t become dejected when there is distress So it’s interesting what he’s saying is he’s not saying don’t feel happiness and don’t feel distress The stress and happiness will come and we will experience it That sometimes good things will happen something bad things and bad things will happen And these dualities will be there but krishna is saying don’t you can’t blind ourselves to the dualities But don’t become elated when the pleasure comes don’t become dejected when the pain comes. Now, how do we do that? So first point is we don’t deny the duality But this is By focussing on spiritual reality by focus on brahman Ultimately the supreme brahman is krishna So if we study spiritual knowledge And then we practise bhakti yoga when we start connecting with krishna And if we connect with krishna, then we start understanding that absorb connection with krishna absorption krishna is Like you could say a five million dollar gain And that is say if we are going on our road say we have to get to our our ancestor Or some some relative who has passed away given the inheritance But we have to reach within a particular time if you reach there, then we’ll get the inheritance.
Otherwise it will go to the state So we are we now are going there and then we’ll get five million dollars But now at that time while we are going along the road If we see a five dollar bill on the road Say it’s fine. Let me get it Go and grab it. But as soon as you go to grab it, it flies away And then we are meant to go this way, but the bill is flying this way And we keep flying we keep chasing after the five dollar bill five dollar bill and what happens we miss the five million dollars But on the other hand see if you are going along that five that road And we have a five dollar bill in our pocket and some thief comes And grabs that five dollar How dare you take this five dollar start fighting with them And they start pulling and we start pushing and we start pushing and we start pulling and we start fighting fighting fighting And we get caught in that And again, we miss the five million dollars So for us life’s pleasures are like a five dollar game The world’s pleasures worldly pleasures and worldly pains are like that five dollar loss Whereas our connection with krishna our devotion to krishna our absorption krishna Is a five million dollar game Now about 20-25 years ago when I was introduced to bhakti this was a verse which inspired me very much To focus on krishna mahasaya krishna says that This is the state of spiritual absorption.
What is its characteristic? If you achieve it You will not long for anything else Achieving this will free you from craving for anything more and then he says Even if great distress comes it will not disturb you so it will free you from lamenting So now we can think of there are many things important for us But is there anything if we achieve it, it will free us from craving or lamenting I might become we might become the wealthiest person in the whole country Now we might have our dream job. We might have our dream house but is it going to free us from craving and lamenting so Now it’s not that these things are bad. We should not pursue them but pursue them in proportion Not at the cost not that they consume us so much That we give up so give up the five million dollar game So krishna consciousness alone is the five million dollar game Because when we become conscious of krishna, we will become free from craving and lamenting So by keeping things in perspective now the five dollar bill also matters But as compared to five million dollar it doesn’t matter that much So we can see life’s dualities with equanimity You can respond to them with equanimity with maturity if our vision is focused on the five million dollar game So yes, this bad thing has happened.
This good thing has happened, but my purpose is to move toward krishna So let me focus on that That’s how we can transcend duality 5.20 520 in the bhagavad-gita That is 622 Okay, yes until what time should we go on It’s 8 30 Okay, yes, please Okay, yes Like as a lay person Okay as a lay person What are the things we can do to go towards krishna? Broadly, we talk about a b c d four things as association books chanting and duty worship so association means And this is the first and the most important That we need to associate with those who are devoted to krishna those who are trying to move toward krishna Our desires are not just linear they are triangular Linear means we see something and I want it say we say go to some Supermarket and see some delicious food item. I want to eat it. That’s linear desire But our desires are not just linear sometimes some things don’t look that attractive But they are important for us So then it’s only if we see somebody else doing that that we feel like doing it so Does any of you know, what is a baklava? Okay The baklava, what is it? Yeah, it’s arabian sweet, isn’t it? Arabic sweet.
So about four five years five six years ago. I had gone to australia I had gone to one friend’s house One devotee’s house and he said that yes, we are having food. So he said i’ve got a baklava would like to have it I had never heard of a baklava And the name baklava doesn’t sound very pleasant also.
It is not a sweet name baklava. Okay So I said maybe later And there was another friend also was with me And then he said give me I took the baklava and he was eating it And he was relishing it as if he was in you could say culinary samadhi Hahaha When I saw him eating and delicious I said give me one So seeing or hearing about the baklava did not create the desire but seeing someone else Enjoying it created that desire The same way for us our desire to go towards krishna desire to grow spiritually It may not come just by knowing about but I know krishna is there But we are so seed So coming for programmes like this now we have a centre over here Where we have weekly sunday programmes Associating with those who are devoted to krishna that is that is vital and the first and foremost Then b is books We can’t associate always So we have books which we can read periodically books also nourish our intelligence. Why should we practise bhakti? it is not just a ritual that we want to do because Our that’s our tradition or that’s what people around us are doing it.
There is a whole philosophical reasoning How this can help us to fulfil the ultimate purpose of life? So that philosophical nourishment is important And that comes by study of books c is chanting that is The holy names of krishna with the kirtan of the hare krishna mantra. So god manifests in this age as his holy name And chanting is a very powerful way to connect with him So That’s chanting and d is deity worship like we have the images of the lord And we worship them we pray to them We offer our food to them and then we take the remnants as prasad So that way we can If we have deities at our home, we can make our home also into a temple So through this abcd we all can practise bhakti and go closer to krishna while in our old while we are in our own professional social familial lives Okay. Thank you.
So, thank you very much. Hare krishna