Learn to see the material and the spiritual as cumulative not competitive

[Talk at Colorado State University, Denver, USA]

Transcript

This is an AI-generated transcript and may contain some errors.
I’m grateful to be here amongst all of you. And thank you for coming today evening. So I’ll speak on this topic of balancing the material and spiritual in three parts.
And then we’ll have a good amount of time for question and answers. First I’ll speak about the philosophical definition of material and spiritual. Then I will talk about the devotional redefinition of material and spiritual.
And then I’ll talk about the integrated practical application in Bhakti Yoga. So when we talk about material and spiritual, what do we exactly mean? Words have their meanings not just frozen in dictionaries. Words have their meanings which are shaped also by their contexts.
That’s why in philosophy of language, a lot of discussion goes on how meanings and words are associated with each other. So when we talk about material and spiritual, different people can have different conceptions about it. Nowadays especially the word spiritual is conflated, is confused or equated with the mental.
Anything that makes me feel good, anything that makes me feel peaceful, feel joyful, often that is called a spiritual. So for example, if you go to a beautiful natural place and it’s very attractive, serene scenery over there, some people say that’s so spiritual. Now what is happening there is they are feeling good over there and that’s what they are referring to as spiritual.
It may be, it may not be. So from the perspective of the Yoga text such as the Bhagavad Gita, material and spiritual is based not on how we feel. Although that will eventually be a result, it is based on what things are made of.
So material things are made of matter. Whereas spiritual things are not made of matter. Matter is characterised by temporality.
Everything material is temporary. So spirit which is the opposite of matter is eternal. So in one of the most poetic verses in the Bhagavad Gita, in 2.15, 2.16 it is said that of the eternal there is no cessation.
Of the temporary there is no endurance. So the temporary refers to the material. Now we see this majestic building.
It’s quite imposing when we look at it. But maybe 50 years ago it was not there at all. 50 years later it may not be there at all.
So the only thing constant in the material world is that nothing is constant. So the only constancy is the lack of constancy in the material world. So matter is characterised by change and temporality.
At the same time we see within us a longing for lasting existence and lasting love. If we were simply materialistic creatures and nothing material ever lasts forever then where would we get this desire for lasting life, lasting love? Most of the movies and novels are about romance. And the fondest aspiration in romance is happily ever after.
Ever after you want lasting love. And people go to great extents to avoid death for themselves. So we want lasting life and lasting love.
If we were simply materialistic creatures and in the material world there is nothing that is eternal then where would our desire for the eternal come from at all? If somebody has never seen a pizza, has never heard about a pizza and suddenly they get a desire for the pizza. Some tribals living in some Native American community, a small child says, Mummy I want a pizza. What’s a pizza? Where did you get a desire for pizza? If in the circumstance there is no knowledge, no conception of a pizza, there is nothing to give a desire for a pizza, where does the desire come from? So like that if everything, things around us are material and everything material is temporary then where does this desire for eternal life come within us from? Our very desire for lasting existence points to an inner aspect of our being that is lasting.
So this desire for lasting life is not circumstantially born. It comes from our innermost core, which is non-material. If we come in this room and we see a gold particle fallen over here, maybe a gold file, nothing around it is gold.
So then that gold particle, it cannot have just fallen from the roof or just a shred which has come up from the wall. It has to come from somewhere else. Because there is nothing golden around here and if I see a gold filing, it means it has to have come from somewhere else.
So nothing in this material world is eternal and still we all have a desire for eternal life. That indicates that this desire has come from somewhere else and that somewhere else, where is it? The desire is within us so that that origin of the desire is also within us. That origin is our spiritual side.
So the spiritual in the language of the yoga text refers to our non-material or trans-material core and that core is called as the Atma or the soul and there is, just as the gold doesn’t belong here, where did the gold come from? People may say that it came from a gold mine. Gold mine is a place where gold is found. So like that we as spiritual beings, we belong to a spiritual realm of existence.
So we are there, we are all conscious beings. So like that there are many conscious beings and there is one infinite conscious being. That is God.
He is known by different names and different traditions. The source of all of existence. In the Bhagavad Gita, He is known by the name Krishna.
So the basic point here is that before we take any discussion further about balancing material and spiritual, we need to have a strong philosophical understanding, conviction even, that the spiritual is also real. That the spiritual is the basis of our experience of reality. This computer exists, this table exists, this desk exists.
But if I put my hand on the desk, I may say, this is cold. But the computer is placed on the desk, the computer doesn’t say, this is cold. The computer does not have consciousness to experience.
So this desk is real. There is reality and there is experience of reality. For the experience of reality, consciousness has to be present.
And that consciousness does not come from matter. Say after this programme we have some delicious food. Now when that food is tasted by someone, they say, this is delicious.
The food doesn’t say, I am delicious. It is unconscious, it doesn’t have consciousness. So the first point, first step in philosophical understanding or in spiritual growth is to recognise through philosophical analysis the difference between the material and the spiritual.
Material is that which is made of material temporary substances, which keeps changing. Spiritual is that which is beyond material, which is eternal. And technically it is said that the soul has three defining characteristics.
It is eternal, it is conscious and it is blissful. So our longing for eternal life comes from the soul, which is by nature eternal. And we are always conscious.
Whatever we are doing, we are thinking of something or the other. That consciousness is the natural energy of the soul. And this natural energy of the soul is searching for happiness.
So there is the locus of consciousness, which is eternal. This consciousness is energy, which is going in various directions. And that conscious energy is searching for happiness.
That’s the satchitananda. That’s the defining characteristic of the soul. So in the Bhagavad Gita, especially in the second chapter, Krishna focusses on this radical matter-spirit differentiation.
He tells Arjuna that the body is destroyed. The soul is never destroyed. That he gives a list of ways in which the body can be destroyed.
And he says the soul is beyond incineration, beyond penetration, beyond desiccation, beyond dissolution. It cannot be burned, it cannot be dissolved, it cannot be broken, it cannot be withered. So the point is that whatever are the characteristics of the matter, the characteristics of the soul is different from that.
It’s almost opposite to that. So by this differentiation, the point that Krishna is making to Arjuna in the Bhagavad Gita is that don’t get carried away by material appearances. Focus on the spiritual substance.
And do that which is necessary for your spiritual growth. And for the spiritual growth of those around us, around you. Don’t be carried away by material appearances.
And this sort of radical differentiation between matter and spirit helps us as spiritual seekers in the initial stages of our life to know that we also have to nourish our spiritual side. So many different examples are given. Just like we have a car and a driver.
Now the car needs fuel, but that doesn’t nourish the driver. The driver has their own separate needs which need to be taken care of. So like that, by the radical differentiation between matter and spirit, we understand that spirit will need its own distinctive nourishment.
And material things will not, material gratification or material satisfaction, that will take care of the body. But that will not satisfy the soul. That is the first differentiation that we do at the philosophical level.
Then after that, when we come to the realm of devotion, there are different yogas and the Bhagavad Gita talks about Bhakti Yoga. And in Bhakti Yoga, so in philosophy, which is a part of a Vedic branch of knowledge called Sankhya, there is analysis. Analysis means dividing things into their part.
Bhakti, Bhakti Yoga focusses more on synthesis. In Bhakti Yoga, the focus is not so much on what things are made of. In Bhakti Yoga, the focus is on what is the effect of those things on us.
What is, where they are taking us in terms of our consciousness, in terms of our spiritual evolution or devolution. So in Bhakti, there is a devotional redefinition of the material and spiritual. So that means we focus on understanding, okay, this is material, this is spiritual in terms of their component, what they are made of.
But ultimately, in Bhakti, we recognise that everything comes from God. Everything is an energy of God, energy of the source, the absolute truth. And that means everything is connected with the absolute truth.
So in the initial stage, when our spiritual focus is self-centred, okay, this body is material, this hand is material, so I am not this hand. I am separate from this hand. So by focus, by this self-centred approach, not self-centred in the sense of selfish, self-centred in the sense of being self-aware, by this approach, we differentiate between what we are not and what we are.
Okay, I am not my looks. I am not this hand. I am not this face.
I am not this body. I am something different. So by this, we differentiate.
But then in Bhakti Yoga, when our focus shifts to the centredness on Krishna, then our focus is, okay, how can this be used? How can I move closer to Krishna? How can I grow in my devotion to Krishna? How can I raise my consciousness towards Krishna? And that which helps us to go towards Krishna, that is considered spiritual. And that which takes us away from Krishna is considered material. So this is more of a functional categorisation.
There is a categorisation that is based on content, what things are made about. And there is a categorisation that is based on functionality. What is the effect of things on us? So technology, for example now, I am using this computer to record, using a mic.
There is a camera over there. All this is technology. At one level we could say this is material.
But if it is used for the service of Krishna, then it becomes spiritualised. Now in this analysis, the focus of the analysis is Krishna-centred. What takes us towards Krishna and what takes us away from Krishna? And from that perspective, what is material and what is spiritual? That needs to be redefined.
In the Bhagavad Gita, in the 18th chapter, 46th verse, Krishna says that, यतः प्रवृत्तिर्भूतानाम् येन सर्वमिदंतकं स्वकर्मणातमभ्यर्च्यो सिद्धिन्विन्दतिमानवा So he says that by your work, स्वकर्मणातमभ्यर्च्यो, by your work you can worship that absolute truth. And by such work cum worship, we can attain perfection. And prior to this, these are the last two lines of the verse, the first two lines say that, that actually that absolute truth, यतः प्रवृत्तिर्भूतानाम्, everything emanates from that absolute truth.
And not only does everything emanate from that absolute truth, येन सर्वमिदंतकं, everything is pervaded by that absolute truth. So God is omnipresent. So in this mic, in this computer, in this camera, God is present everywhere.
So if we become attuned to the presence of God, if we become conscious that this is God’s energy, this can be used in service, then actually we don’t need to see that thing as material. We can see it as spiritual. So from this perspective, from the devotional perspective, devotional or spiritual is that which helps us to grow in our selfless devotion to Krishna.
So where there is self-centredness, that is material. Where there is selflessness, that is spiritual. So where I am concerned with myself, my pleasure, my gratification, my desires, and my I alone.
In general, we all tend to be I specialists. I specialists, not E-Y-E-I, but I. So in the Greco-Roman tradition, there is an example of Narcissus. Now we say a person is narcissistic.
So that originates from the story of a character named Narcissus, who was so good looking, and he was so proud of his good looks, that once he was passing by a river, and he started looking in the river. And he wanted to look how good he is. So he saw his face, he saw his shoulders, and he started looking.
He wanted to look more and more about how good he was looking. And his anxiety about how good he was looking, he fell into the river and drowned over it. So that is the idea of, from that legend has come the idea of, from that person, he was the Narcissus.
So narcissistic means, we are so consumed with ourselves, that in the process of being consumed with ourselves, we not only become insensitive to others, we become sometimes offensive to others, but we become destructive to ourselves also. So in Bhakti Yoga, self-centredness is considered material, and selflessness is considered spiritual. If we are doing something in a mood of service to Krishna, to help ourselves grow closer to Krishna, to help others come closer to Krishna, then that is spiritual.
A few months ago I was in an Indian university, and one student came and asked me, how can I inspire my friends to also practise Bhakti? So I told him, by studying. He says, if you study well, there is no guarantee that your friends will start practising Bhakti. But if you study poorly, there is guarantee that your friends will not practise Bhakti.
Why? Because they will start thinking, your spirituality made you irresponsible. Your spirituality affected your academic performance poorly. I don’t want to get involved in this.
So even at this level, if we consider that by the way I conduct myself in my academic circles or in my professional circles, we are making a statement of what is the effect of Bhakti or spirituality in general on us. And through that, people are going to evaluate. So, they say actions speak louder than words.
Actually, sometimes actions speak so loudly that you can’t hear the words. So, sometimes we may say, we may tell people, please come and practise Bhakti. This is so nice and this is so helpful.
Helps you to control the mind. But then, they say that if we are negligent in our worldly responsibility, this is all material, this is all mundane. I’m not going to get involved in this.
Then, what happens by that is, we act in a way that alienates people from Krishna. And that is actually, we could say, counterproductive. So, at least at that level of helping people get a positive perception of Krishna, making people come closer to Krishna, our academic performance, our professional performance, that is also a part of our spiritual life.
So, the better we do in terms of our commitment, our responsibility, our performance in our material life, people are attracted to that. Krishna also says this principle in the Bhagavad Gita that whatever great people do, other people emulate. What this means is that Arjuna is a great person.
Krishna is telling Arjuna, you are a great archer, you are a great prince. So, the way you are going to act, others will also act. Now, how did Arjuna become great? He had certainly some talent in archery.
But Arjuna became a great archer by his diligent practise. It is not that Arjuna was thinking when he was practising archery, all this is material, I don’t care for this. No, Arjuna was tirelessly practising his archery.
Why? Because he saw that that is the way I will be served. He got a name, Gudakesh. Gudakesh means one who has conquered sleep.
Because he was working so hard that one night, all day they would practise archery and at night, they would relax and they would talk and socialise. So, one night he was just eating and there was a lamp nearby. Gust of wind blew and the lamp got switched off.
So, he was eating food and as the lamp got switched off, his hand was on the way to the plate from which he was eating. His hand went to the plate and he went to the mouth. This is a completely ordinary incident.
But because he had such eagerness for his archery, he was actually itching to practise archery and learn more and more and excel. So, at that time the thought came in his mind, if I can eat in the dark, then I can shoot in the dark also. So, from that day onwards, he would start shooting, start practising shooting of archery in the dark.
And his capacity to detect targets simply by the sound that they created, that made him a peerless archer. So, he did not reject his archery as a material. He saw that also as a way to serve Krishna.
So, Krishna tells Arjuna, you are great. You are going to have great influence in society. But how did Arjuna become great? By doing whatever is his profession diligently.
Further, when we talk about our profession, in terms of the effect that it is going to have on others, our capacity to influence others positively can increase tremendously if we take care of our material side well, if we are committed, if we are responsible, if we are competent in that. So, in that way, it is a service. Another more important way for us personally, in our spiritual growth, is that any kind of responsibility requires us to resist the mind’s frivolity.
The mind tends to be frivolous. Today, I like something. Tomorrow, I don’t like that thing.
The mind tends to be frivolous. And this frivolousness of the mind often works against us in our spiritual life. Today, say, if we are practising chanting, we are practising mantra meditation.
Today, I chant. I just feel so good while chanting. I think, oh, I got such taste in chanting.
I have become a pure devotee now. I have become a great soul. I start thinking like that.
And the next day, I start chanting and take out the beads and see. Have the beads changed from 108 to 1008? This is just not ending. What is going on over here? The meditations, one day seems to be so blissful.
The other day, the meditation seems to be like just going on and on, so prolonged. When will this end? So, the mind is fickling. The mind is fickle, flickering.
And if we are to become purified, if we are to grow spiritually, we need to resist the mind’s fickleness. We need to persevere in spite of the mind’s fickleness. I feel like it, I don’t feel like it, but still, I’ll do it.
That is the nature of commitment. And in our spiritual life, we grow by our commitment. So, spiritual life, in the devotional, in bhakti yoga, is actually a growth of a relationship with Krishna.
In a relationship, there has to be commitment. If, say, a man and a woman, they like each other, they get married. And then, the husband is in a bad mood, he says, I don’t like you now.
He says to the wife. No, you cannot do that. If there is a relationship, there has to be commitment in the relationship.
So, without a commitment, no relationship can be sustained. And same way, in a relationship with Krishna, there has to be commitment. When the relationship is simply driven by moods, by feelings alone, not by commitments, and what happens? A boy and a girl may say, I cannot live without you.
I want to be with you, and I want to be with you right now. And a few days later, the mind’s feeling is just, I cannot live with you. Get out! So, what’s happening? It’s all driven by the mind.
And any committed, any steady relationship, for us to go deeper in a relationship, it requires commitment. The mind will go up and down. The mind will have its likes and dislikes, but we have to stay committed.
The same principle applies to our spiritual life. For our relationship with Krishna to grow, sometimes we may feel like doing some devotional things, sometimes we may not feel like doing those things, but still we perceive it. And this requires the training, the discipline, the intelligence to resist the mind’s moods.
The mind is feeling like this, but still I will perceive it. And this capacity to resist the mind, that can actually grow by any kind of responsibility. So, if we consider, I talked about selfishness and selflessness.
And spiritual means, material means selfish, spiritual means selfless. So, selfish actually means that we are driven by the mind. Mind feels like doing this, I will do it.
Mind doesn’t feel like doing it, I won’t do it. I won’t care about the influence on others. So, from that perspective, there is selfish and there is selfless.
So, to the extent we can resist, to the extent we are driven by the mind, to that extent we stay selfish. To the extent we can resist the mind, to that extent we become selfless. We can think of something bigger than ourselves.
I recently read about a case of how there was a hospital where there was a doctor and the doctor was attracted to a nurse. And there was a patient who was very sick on the verge of death and the doctor was so caught in flirting with the nurse and the patient died because of neglect of the doctor. What happened here? You see, the obsession with the mind, the mind is saying, I want to dally with her, I want to have fun with her.
Yes, there is a time for socialising, but if the doctor has to do the responsibility of taking care of the patient, that is the time when the doctor has to put aside that attraction, that infatuation and focus on the work. So, what happens? When we are too much driven by our mind, we can become selfish to the extent of becoming monstrously insensitive. If a doctor has the capacity to treat a patient and save a patient, the doctor just neglects that.
It’s monstrous insensitivity. So, how does that happen? Because one is too caught up with one’s own feelings, one’s own ideas, one’s own desires, one’s own pleasures, that one doesn’t think of anything else. So, even in material life, for doing one’s responsibility, one has to some extent put aside one’s own self-centredness, the desires and impulses of the mind and one has to think of something else, whether it’s our job, whether it’s the other person in the relationship, whatever it is.
So, in that sense, any responsibility, whether it is professional responsibility or it is familial responsibility, what it does is, it forces us to come out of ourselves. It forces us out of our self-centredness, out of our self-obsession. And if we consider spiritual growth as a growth in selflessness, then anything that helps us come out of selfishness, towards selflessness, that can help us to grow spiritually.
So, in terms of practical application, if we have a mood of service, yes, I am doing my job, why am I doing it? Yes, it is by Krishna’s arrangement that I am in this position, that I have this family or I have this occupation and I am going to do this in a mood of service to Krishna. And I take it seriously, I do it diligently, and in all that, in doing that, I have to resist my mind. And that resisting, that if I develop a habit of resisting the mind’s moods and feelings, then that capacity to resist a mind will help me in my direct devotional activities also.
Because when I am to study scripture, when I am to chant the holy names, even devotional life requires taking up responsibilities. It requires commitment. So, it will help me to, that ethos of commitment, if I have it in my material life, it can help me in my spiritual life also.
So, in that sense, the material and the spiritual can become cumulative, not competitive. So, what if I am committed in my material life, then that can help me to become more in control of myself and that can help me to grow in my spiritual life. Conversely, by our spiritual practises, we become more, we become purified.
The connection with Krishna, the remembrance of Krishna, Krishna is all pure. And the more we connect with Him, the more we become purified. When we become purified, we are better able to control the mind.
Because what makes the mind fickle and wild is the impurities within it. So, when the impurities decrease, then the mind becomes more easily manageable. The mind becomes more amenable.
So, the connection with Krishna through the process of bhakti makes the mind more manageable and amenable. And then, that helps us in our material life also. Because whatever we need to do, we can do it with more focus.
We don’t get so distracted. So, material and spiritual life can sometimes appear competitive in terms of time. Oh, this time I could be studying, I could be studying my college studies, but then I’m going for this programme.
This time I could be doing some assignments, but now I’m going to the temple. Or I’m doing my meditation. So, we feel in terms of time, we feel there’s competition.
I have only 24 hours, how do, either I have to do this or I have to do that. The fact is that at an external level, in terms of activities, there will appear to be competition. But at a deeper level, our time is not consumed by our activities alone.
We may say in terms of my schedule, okay, morning, morning I’ll do this, afternoon I’ll do this, evening I’ll do this. So, this is how my day is going to go in activities. But, actually if we see, a lot of our time is taken by our thoughts, by our desires.
Say, if somebody is, become alcoholic, and then, they, they’re going to, they just got, they’re going to class, and they’re sitting in class, and maybe at that time, they thought, they got a thought, maybe I should drink, I should just get a drink. And in one hour, sitting in the class, maybe just before that, they passed by a bar, or they saw somebody drinking, and that thought has got wedged in. And during that one hour, externally, the activity was there in the class, but nothing productive happened over there.
All that time was taken by the desire, by the craving for alcohol. Or say, maybe at a more familiar level, say, we come into a meeting, and then we greet someone, and that person just snubs us. We get so angry, how dare they snub me like this.
And the next meeting for two hours is going on, and our mind is on a spree of revenge fantasy. Public snub them. How? All that happened in the two hours.
We attended physically the meeting for two hours, but if we had to do something in the meeting, we’ll again have to ask someone, what happened in the meeting? We’ll have to spend all that time again. So when the mind is uncontrolled, even if we externally go through our schedules, but still, we will not be able to function over there. So our time is taken not just in activities, our time is also taken by our thoughts, our desires, our impulses.
And our spiritual practises help us to better regulate and discipline our thoughts, desires, impulses. So if we are studying, okay, this is the time for Serving Krishna to study, just focus wholeheartedly on studies of that. If we are relating with our family members, we see that also is a service to Krishna.
Let me be with my family members. Let me do as much as I can for them in a mood of service to them and to Krishna. So we actually become available for our obligations, for our activities more when our mind is under control.
And that inner control over our mind and our desires, that happens by our spiritual practises. So again, although at one level spiritual practises take time, at another level spiritual practises create time. At one level they take time because we have to do activities, spiritual activities such as meditation, study of scriptures.
But they create time in the sense that the time that was dissipated in stray desires, stray emotions, a lot of time is dissipated in worry. And worry has multiple reasons. But specifically, or generically, worry is caused by obsession, by over attachment, over involvement in material things which are not in our control.
And if we understand ourselves as spiritual, then we can create a distance between ourselves and that particular activity. And the worry level which we have will go down substantially the more we become purified. And I have a whole seminar on the anxiety epidemic.
And one point I make over there is worry is the interest we pay on loans we haven’t yet taken. That means most of the times we worry about problems that are not materialised. And if you think about it, 90-95% of the problems we worry about, they never materialise also.
So all that unnecessary dystopian fantasy of the mind. Utopian fantasy is very nice fantasy. Dystopian is dreadful fantasy.
So all the dystopian fantasy of the mind, all that gets curved because the mind comes into control. So in this way, our spiritual practises can benefit us materially because we are more available when we are doing whatever we are doing. And thus we can be more effective.
Even if we seem to have less time, but we can do more in the time that we have because in that time, we are fully available for what we are doing. So if we think of the material simply as non-devotional, anti-devotional, then we miss out on the opportunity to grow spiritually. Krishna in the Bhagavad Gita says that He says that if we think that oh this is very troublesome, so I’ll not do it.
And that is the basis of our renunciation, of our giving up things. Then this will not lead to spiritual growth. Because spiritual growth comes by being committed to doing what we need to do.
So our ability to tap our ability is enhanced by our spirituality. We all have certain abilities. But our ability to tap our ability.
Now somebody may be a very good baseball player. But if they are not cool-headed, they just get worked up, they get excited, and they play rashly. Or they just crumble under pressure, get nerves.
They have the ability, but they can’t tap the ability. So if they are composed, they are calm, they are collected, then they can perform much better. So we all have certain abilities and our ability to tap our ability is enhanced by our spirituality.
So spirituality involves doing direct devotional activities which directly connect us with Krishna. They are the primary engines. They are the direct sources of our spiritual growth.
And we need to give adequate time for them for understanding texts like the Bhagavad Gita, for meditating, for associating with spiritually minded people. The direct activities we need to give due time for. But along with that, the rest of our life, we don’t just think of it as material.
We see that also as spiritualizable. And that also as an arena for service. So I conclude with one thought that what we are is God’s gift to us.
What we become is our gift to God. What we are. We all are different.
And in materialistic consciousness, the major problem that comes is certain material features are glamorised. If somebody looks good, then everybody wants to look like them. Somebody has wealth, somebody can somebody has somebody can dance very nicely.
Everybody wants to become like that. But we all, we all are unique. If God had wanted us to be someone else, He would have made someone else.
He has made us and He has made us, us. So there’s a purpose for that. So what we are is God’s gift to us.
And what we become is our gift to God. So using the abilities that we have, using the talents that we have, we are all meant to make a contribution. A contribution in this world and a contribution also for our own spiritual growth.
Where we as eternal beings rise, as eternal spiritual beings, we rise to eternal spiritual consciousness. So if we focus on Krishna through direct devotional activities and we learn that everything else that I do in my life, that is also a service to Krishna. Then through it all, in a cumulative way, we grow forwards and we attain the ananda, the happiness that is our nature as spiritual beings.
So I’ll summarise. I spoke about three parts. About philosophical, we spoke about balancing material and spiritual aspects of our life.
I spoke about the philosophical definition of material and spiritual. Then I spoke about the devotional redefinition of material and spiritual. Then I spoke about the practical application of material and spiritual.
And philosophical definition, I spoke about how we have a spiritual side. That is, just as a person who has never seen a pizza, or never heard of a pizza, they get a desire for pizza, where does the desire come from? In a building which is made of stone and other materials. Suddenly we see gold.
Where does that gold come from? Like that, everything material is characterised by temporariness. But within this material world, we all have a desire for lasting life and lasting love. This desire cannot have come from the circumstance around us.
Because there is no source for that. Nothing is eternal over here. So that has come from internal, from within us, from our core.
That is the non-material soul which is eternal and which longs for eternal life. So the soul that is spiritual, it has three characteristics. In terms of composition, it is eternal, it is conscious and it is blissful.
So, in terms of philosophical analysis, we need to understand clearly that it is not that something which makes me feel good is spiritual. No. What is spiritual? That which is not temporary.
That which is eternal. And just as the car and the driver have distinct needs, which need to be separately taken care of. Similarly, the material body and the spiritual soul, they have different needs which need to be taken care of by distinct activities.
Now, in the devotional redefinition of material and spiritual, we understand that actually if we consider from the point of view of the source, the absolute truth, God, who is known in the Gita as Krishna, from his perspective, everything is energy. So, matter and spirit, both come from him. And both can help us to go towards him.
So, the bhakti vision is more of synthesis. And we see that in going towards Krishna, in helping ourselves develop spiritual love for Krishna, it is essentially a journey in selflessness. So, from our self-centred perspective, we need to go to the perspective of selfless love for Krishna.
Doing what will please him as an expression of our love. And this requires resisting our mind, resisting the impulses, the passions, the desires that are there in the mind. And this, learning to resist the mind, that which is required for our relationship with Krishna, that can be developed by our commitments in material life also.
To study, to do a job properly, say to do a medical profession properly. I gave the example of a doctor flirting with a nurse while the patient was dying. But to do even material responsibilities properly, we need to resist our mind.
Resist the impulses within the mind. And in that sense, if we consider spiritual growth as an evolution in selflessness, as a decrease in selfishness, then even our material obligations can help us in decreasing our selfishness. And further, if we see that those material obligations are also spiritualizable.
Firstly, because the way we function in material life, that is going to send a message to people, whether they also should become spiritual or they should not become spiritual. So if we are irresponsible or incompetent, then we alienate people. That is a disservice to them from a spiritual perspective.
In terms of our own inner growth, we focus on the understanding that the spiritual and material can be cumulative. In fact, they can be symbiotic. Our material commitments, if they help us to come out of ourselves and think of something bigger than ourselves, then that is a growth in selflessness.
And our spiritual commitments, when we do them diligently, they purify us. The mind that is wild, the forces that make it wild, they go down by the purification that comes with the practise of bhakti. So although bhakti activities require time, but they also create time.
Because the time that is wasted in stray thoughts, desires, impulses, all that, say the time in worrying, the time in revenge fantasy, the time in some unhealthy craving, all that is saved. And whatever we are doing, we are more available for doing that by our bhakti practises. So our ability to tap our ability is enhanced by our spirituality.
And lastly I concluded that once we do direct devotional activities and understand ourselves as spiritual beings who are parts of God, then our whole life can be re-envisioned as what we are is God’s gift to us. We don’t have to become like anybody else. We just have to become the best ourselves.
If God had wanted us to be someone else, He would have made someone else. He has made us us, and our goal is to become the best me. What we become is our gift to God.
And this way, when we work in a mood of service through direct devotional activities which connect us with Krishna, and through spiritualising our family and professional responsibilities, then we slowly but surely rise towards the spiritual consciousness where we experience the ananda, the bliss that we are constantly looking for. Thank you. Hare Krishna.
Any questions or comments? Yes, Miss? I was just wondering, would you mind elaborating on what someone would do if they had an occupation or a propensity that seemed less easily relatable to Krishna consciousness? Such as working in retail or working as an athlete, and maintain that occupation while performing the mood of service still? Okay. See, somebody were in a profession that is not easily relatable with bhakti, spirituality. How can they do that profession and still maintain their bhakti? The relationship is primarily in our intention.
If you consider from the spiritual perspective, Arjuna was a warrior, he was fighting. Fighting, how many people think of it as spiritual? Arjuna, when he was fighting, he was seriously fighting. It was not that when he was shooting arrows, Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna.
He was not doing that. He was wholeheartedly fighting the war. So, the connection between our vocation and our spirituality is first and foremost in intention.
If our intention is to serve Krishna, this is the ring, this is where I am gifted or this is where I am situated right now, and this is the way I can serve. Then that intention itself spiritualises. Secondly, even in whatever profession we are in, the activity itself may not seem spiritual in the sense that some talents like speaking or singing or decorating, they can be used for direct devotional activities.
But there are many other talents which are not necessarily directly devotionally usable. But still, they also contribute to the upkeep of society. And to the extent society is functional properly materially, spiritual life practise becomes easier.
It is not necessary that people will practise spiritual life. People may become complacent in material life also. But maintaining the order of material life is also important for making it easier for people to practise spirituality.
So for example, in India, many times the material needs of people are not so easily available. And the anxiety for that consumes so much of their mind that they are not able to invest time in practising bhakti. So in America, the material needs are much more easily available than if somebody wants to practise bhakti, they can practise bhakti more easily.
Of course, the problem is that much more than the material needs are available, lot of material fantasies allure and that also distracts. So there is always a balance to be done. But the point is, we as devotees, Krishna tells Arjuna that you are an important member of the social fabric and you have to do your role in maintaining the society.
Lok Sangraham is maintenance of the social order. So, for that, that is also a role of a spiritualist. So whatever profession we are in, we can see that it may not be externally spiritual, but we can see that it can contribute to spiritual growth.
Thirdly, that ultimately whatever profession we are in, we are associating with people. And if we ourselves are spiritual, in the sense that we are spiritually conscious, and that spiritual consciousness helps us to be more courteous, more sensitive, more gentle, then people see that and people say, Oh, such a nice person. I want to be like this person.
When Srila Prabhupada was asked, how do we know? How do we know a devotee of Krishna? So Prabhupada could have said, the devotee always chants Hare Krishna. And that is true. But Prabhupada said that devotees are perfect gentlemen, perfect ladies, perfect gentlemen.
It means culture behaviour. People see that, they are attracted by that. So whatever profession we are in, we can see that also as an arena where by our conduct, we can connect people with Krishna.
And further, if we have the desire to serve, Krishna will create arrangements. Now how Krishna will create arrangements, we may not know. I met one devotee recently.
He was in the US Army before he became a devotee. And then after he became a devotee, he thought, why should I fight and kill? But his spiritual guides told him, no, this is your job. You continue the job.
And he started trying to talk about bhakti with his colleagues. None of them were interested. But then they went on the war fields.
They went to first to Iraq, then to Afghanistan. And there, quite often they were subjected to ambush attacks. And because of that, all the soldiers were very jittery, skittish almost, fearful.
And throughout all by his spiritual practises, he would just chant Krishna, Krishna in his mind and pray to Krishna. And he was quite calm. And he helped his soldiers.
He was like a squadron leader. He helped his soldiers navigate several close encounters very skilfully. After one of them, his soldier is one of his assistants, one of the soldiers asked him, Sir, how do you stay so cool? As he was about to answer, all his assistants were eager to hear.
He said, that time I understood why Krishna sent me to Iraq. Because in America, when life was comfortable, these people were not interested in spirituality. But now when they were on the verge of life and death, now when he told them, actually I understand that I am a soul, the soul is eternal.
And the eternality of the soul, the awareness of the eternality of the soul is the basis of my fearlessness. They are ready to hear. They are ready to hear and they are ready to learn.
So then he started. It’s not that soldiers are fighting all the time. They also have their time of recreation.
So he started doing kirtans in the army barracks. And then he wrote a series of articles, small reflections about his experiences. He called them as battlefield bhajans.
So, you know, we don’t know what Krishna has in store for us. So rather than rejecting something as non-spiritualizable, we can say let me try to have an attitude of service and Krishna may reveal something wonderful. Thank you.
Any other questions? Any comments? Yes, please. Which part? I mean, the whole thing. I guess if I had to isolate a part, I would talk about how it’s so important to set an example in that in order to truly be connected to Krishna, it’s about balancing everything and working with what you have and following practise.
Yeah, thank you. So, you know, when we need to set an example, there is a tension over there. At one level, our values are different from other people’s values.
So they may go for parties where they drink and smoke and do all those things. And there are certain things in which our values and their values are different. So, sometimes we focus too much on the differences.
I don’t do that, I don’t do that, I don’t do that. So, we have our standards, we have our principles, but our principles are meant to sanctify us. Our principles are not meant to shame others.
Oh, you do this, you do that, you do that. No. They’re for our purification.
So, when we are with others, we focus not on how we are different from them. We focus on what are the similarities. So, ultimately, they also, everybody wants to become better.
Everybody wants to grow in their life. Everybody wants to make a better contribution in their life. So, you focus on the similarities.
Now, what are, everybody, as I said, everybody wants to improve. And they see that in terms of the values that they can appreciate. Everybody appreciates patience.
Everybody appreciates courtesy. Everybody appreciates gentleness. Everybody appreciates kindness.
So, there are devotional values which may not make sense to people. But there are the human values that make a lot of sense, that appeal to everyone. So, if by our practise of bhakti, we have developed human values, and we focus on connecting with people at the level of human values, and people see that, you know, such a nice human being, I would like to be such a person.
And that enables them to grow. So, you talk about setting an example, that doesn’t mean, you know, oh, somebody is drinking, I go and drink. That’s not the example.
What I was talking about, setting an example means, everybody wants to become a better person. And how the process of bhakti helps us to become a better person, someone like, they would also like to become. That way, we can set an example, which actually inspires people to bring out the best from within them.
Thank you. Hare Krishna. … Okay.
So, how do, if some of us choose to become fully devoted to spiritual life, say as monks or as full-time practitioners, then should one take up such a practise, or when should one decide to take up a practise? How does one know that one is suitable for such a vocation? The first thing is that we understand that we are meant to develop our relationship with Krishna. And we want to practise bhakti yoga so that we can grow in our relationship with Krishna. Once that focus is clear, like Krishna himself says in the Bhagavad Gita that that I will give you the intelligence by which you can come to me.
That means, what Krishna says, if we have the strong desire to come to him, what is the best way to him, he will reveal to us. But sometimes we focus while practising bhakti too much on the externals. You know, should I be this or should I be that? Should I be a person in the world or should I renounce the world? That dialectic is not as important as am I serving Krishna? How can I best serve Krishna? How can I best connect with Krishna? How can I best nourish my devotion to Krishna? If we have that intention, then everything external gradually is seen in perspective, it falls in place.
So first, as we say, the first thing is to put first things first. In our spiritual life, sometimes people get a little scared. Oh, if I become spiritual, then I’ll become a monk, I’ll renounce everything.
No. That is not the point of spirituality. The point of spirituality is to grow in our relationship with Krishna.
How we grow, that will become person to person. Once we are clear about what is the first thing, then other things fall in place. Now specifically, there are some people, there are two, three different kinds of people who may choose to fully pursue spirituality.
All of us are in the journey of spiritual evolution. And this journey, as souls, we are eternal. So, some of us may have started our spiritual journey in a previous life also.
And these are people who have, in a sense, their hearts have touched the sky, but their feet are still on the ground. So there are some people who are just different. Some people right from childhood, they’re just asking questions about things which even their parents have not thought about.
Where did I come from? What is the purpose of life? And such questions. So there are not many, but there are a few people like that. Krishna says that, By their past practise, they are helplessly attracted towards spiritual principles.
Even if their parents say, don’t be such a, don’t think so much. They just can’t do that. They have to think.
It’s almost like helpless. So there are some people who are like that. They, right from their childhood itself, they have a very deep spiritual craving.
They just find ordinary life so superficial. And such people, once they come to a spiritual path, it just clicks. This is what I am meant to do.
And for such people who are already evolved on the spiritual path, then everything else actually seems superficial. It seems insubstantial. So such people, if they are forced to be in material life, if they are forced to pursue material responsibilities, it will be torture for them.
And they need to be given the freedom to practise what they are naturally attracted to. So that there are a category, not many, but there are a small but significant category of people who are naturally spiritual in terms of their upbringing, in terms of the way they are. Apart from that, there can be some people who actually feel very inspired to commit themselves to a higher cause.
They want to make some contribution. And their focus is on how I can commit to some higher cause. And then if they come to bhakti and they understand how raising people’s consciousness to the spiritual level, that is the highest cause that we can contribute.
Then their zeal for activism. See, one is the first I talked about is they are just spiritually attracted. Second is people who are just activists.
They are activists and their zeal for activism, when they get connected with spirituality, they feel this is where I can really make a big impact, make a significant impact. Not just a big in terms of what creates news, but big in terms of what actually makes a change. What actually brings about transformation.
The UNESCO Charter has said that war begins in the minds of people. And therefore peace to be established also has to begin in the minds of people. So, if people will become peaceful, then we can have a more peaceful world.
Spirituality helps us to become peaceful internally. So, it is not going to make any sensation in the world. But actually it is going to bring a transformation in the world.
The more people become spiritual. So, there are people who are activists and they feel inspired to direct their activism towards spirituality. And there is another category of people who are just swept by the power of spiritual association.
These are such nice people. I just want to be with them all the time. I just don’t want to associate with other kind of people.
They are swept by the power of spiritual association. And then they move onwards. They can themselves develop that inspiration also.
One thing is to be inspired by someone else. Okay, this is such a nice person. I want to be like them.
But then we have to check whether that is my sustainable inspiration. Is this what I can do sustainably? So, basically for those who are not so much made for being monks or being full-time spiritualists, a lot of mental energy is dissipated in what I should give up or what I should not give up. Maybe I should give this up.
Maybe I should not give this up. But for those who become full-time spiritualists and can sustain full-time practise of spirituality, their focus is not on what I give up. It is what I take up.
And they are so taken up themselves by the spiritual practises, by the spiritual cause that giving up certain things is a challenge. But that is not what obsesses the mind. That is not what consumes the mind.
So, if we find that our mind is too consumed by what we are giving up. Should I give this up? Should I not give this up? Then we may actually become more spiritual by not focussing so much on giving it up. So we adjust our life in such a way that we have whatever material needs we personally feel we need and then practise our spirituality.
So, to summarise the answer, I talked about these three categories. Those who are already spiritually inclined, those who are activists and those who are swept by the power of spiritual association. They all can become full-time practitioners.
But individually the important thing is that if our focus can be on what we are taking up and we don’t get too much caught in what we are giving up then we can sustain that. But if we find that we are just too caught up in how can I give this up? No, I want to give it up. I can’t.
I must. If that dialectic is what is consuming us too much, then better settle for a spiritual practise which is less disturbing for us and which will actually be more fulfilling in the long run. Does that answer your question? Any other questions or comments? Yes, professor.
Thank you so much. There is one among all points that I used to ask you where you spoke of how the mind sometimes it can be present somewhere physically but not actually be there. And you gave the example of an alcoholic going to a meeting in the bathroom and the whole time thinking about alcohol, when can I get my next drink? So I wanted to ask how we can actually catch, because sometimes the mind I teach myself, sometimes it can wander and it goes on for a whole and I kind of catch it a little too much into and how we can be more aware when the mind is wondering how to bring it back.
So when the mind wanders off, how can we become more aware of the mind’s wandering and then get it back quickly. Yes. No.
Awareness of our lack of self-awareness is also a step towards self-awareness. I am not conscious where I am, what I am doing. So if I become aware of that, awareness of our lack of self-awareness is also a step forward in our self-awareness.
So earlier our mind just took us everywhere and we also went along willingly. But now why is the mind going there? I don’t want it to go there. So although the mind is going off, it is, at least we have become enough self-aware to recognise the mind is going off in a wrong direction.
So we can compare the mind to a horse. When a horse is, there is a in horse training there is a phrase called breaking the horse. Breaking doesn’t mean physically breaking it.
Breaking means basically taming the horse, training the horse to become malleable to the will of the rider. So when the horse is not broken, the owner, the person sits on the horse and the horse just goes off. And that’s how we have got the phrase in English, taken for a ride.
You know, taken for a ride means we are just taken somewhere where we didn’t intend to go. So like that often our mind takes us off for a ride. But over a period of time when the horse trainer starts pulling at the horse, trying to pull it back, pull it back up, force it, at that time there is a resistance.
Although the resistance is there, that is a step towards breaking the horse, towards taming the horse. So like that we didn’t feel very discouraged if our mind wanders off. My mind has wandered off.
At least we have realised it. So that is also a step forward in our journey towards self-awareness. Now, in general, if we have certain commitments which force us to be attentive, then that is very helpful in coming back to self-awareness.
So for example, if I am sitting and hearing, I may just wander off and I may not realise that I have wandered off. But if I decide I am going to write, that activity of writing forces a certain level of self-awareness. So, even if I don’t feel a very interesting point, but I just decide maybe every 2-3 minutes I will write one point.
And look back, you know, 15 minutes later I didn’t write anything. Then I can think, oh was I really aware or not aware. So basically, create, we can find out, it is not that in all activities we wander off.
There are certain activities in which we wander off, certain activities which we like, you know, we really get naturally focused on those. But where we tend to wander off, it is good to create activities or breaks that force us to become self-aware. For example, when we are studying scripture, there is a time when we can just wander off.
We just turn off. We were reading a book, but we are not reading anything actually. So, if I decide that, after I read one page, I am going to write one sentence of what was a significant point of what I read.
It may be just in my own words or it may be just a replication of what I read. But I am going to do something. Or if after I read one page, I will express the essential message in my own words.
So that, that intentional break where we do activity where we are forced to become aware, that is what brings us back to self-awareness. Krishna says in Bhagavad Gita that, This is 5.26 that wherever the mind wanders, bring it back. So, if we have this kind of reorient, this kind of awareness-forcing activities, just these activities force us to become aware.
Just like if you are driving and a speed breaker comes. We may just be lost in our own thoughts while driving, but say a speed breaker comes. Then what happens? It jolts us.
It forces us to become aware. So, if there is a school nearby and children may be walking along, they are slowed down by that. So, that speed breaker by a jolt forces, brings our awareness back from wherever it has gone.
So, same way we have to create our own speed breakers. Our own activities which jolt us out of our lack of self-awareness. So, what those activities will be, they will vary from person to person.
But usually it involves our doing something consciously. So, we may decide that, okay, every day at the end of the day, I’ll just recapitulate. For 5 minutes, just go over the whole day.
Maybe I’ll write a journal every day. And then I can think, okay, while doing this activity I was so absent-minded. This activity has absorbed.
Please evaluate. So, basically, finding out what kind of awareness-forcing activity works for us, that will depend on our own nature. Some people may like to just write things down.
Some people may just like to walk around. They are doing a particular activity. And I just get up and walk for a minute or two.
That forces me back into my awareness. Back into back into awareness of where I am. For some other people, it might just be taking a few deep breaths.
And we take a few deep breaths. For others, it might just be reciting some verses. Especially during our meditation, because we just sit in one place and try to chant, that time the mind can just go everywhere.
So, if you create something, okay, after every four, after a periodic time, I’m going to recite some prayers. I’m going to do, I’m going to utter some verses. I’m going to do something.
Maybe take a few deep breaths. So, those activities, if we create breaks in our activities and we those breaks will force us to become self-aware. So, what will happen is, the mind will keep wandering.
Its wandering will not stop very easily. But two things, the amplitude of its wandering, that will decrease. So, if it earlier it would just wander off into something entirely anti-devotional.
Now, it will wander off to something which is semi-devotional. Something which is devotional also. So, the amplitude will decrease.
And further, the frequency of the wandering will also decrease. So, say, earlier in 10 minute occasion, 10 minute period, my mind was wandering 10 times. But now, in a 10 minute period, it just wanders once or twice.
It will decrease. So, there is there is there are two things. There is control of the mind and there is conversion of the mind.
Control of the mind means that the mind wants to go off here and there and then we control it. Like, I go back to earlier horse example. The horse wants to go in here and there.
The horse trainer has to be expert to control the horse. But over a period of time, once the horse trainer and the horse develop a relationship, the horse wants to please the horse trainer. Then the horse becomes converted.
So, while we are practising bhakti, we have to focus on controlling. It goes off here, bring it back. And I talked about some ways in which we can do that control.
But we also need to do that just by the practise of bhakti itself. The contact with Krishna will purify the mind. And then it will become converted.
Krishna talks about how the mind is presently our enemy, but it can become our friend. So, even if this self-awareness doesn’t seem to be coming much despite our efforts right now, if we just perceive it in the practise of bhakti, it will happen at a subconscious level. At a conscious level, we try to become ourselves more and more aware.
But at subconscious level also, the awareness will increase more and more because the forces that make the mind wander off, they will become decreased by the practise of bhakti. Does that answer your question? Thank you. How can we help someone who is very disconnected from God? Say, lives a very unhealthy life, drinks alcohol and doesn’t see God anywhere.
See, for us, God acts primarily through His representatives. That means most people in this world don’t see God directly. What they see is godly people.
And if they see some people are godly, then they behave. It is something more than that. And the worst violence happens when godly people behave in ungodly ways.
Then people become very alienated. So, I was in Texas, there I saw, maybe it was an atheist or someone, he put a bumper sticker on his car. It said, Oh God, please save me from your preachers.
So actually, God saves us through His preachers. But if they come off as self-righteous, as moralising, as holier than thou, then they are alienated. So basically, the point which I am making is that whatever level a person may be at, if they can get good association, if they can associate with somebody who is spiritually minded, somebody who is devoted to God, then that association will trigger something spiritual in them.
So rather than thinking that somebody, because they are godless, because they are materialistic, because they are addicted to unhealthy things, that’s why they cannot come to God. You can see that, okay, wherever they are, actually, they are still parts of God. They are all children of God.
So, from Krishna’s perspective, nobody is beyond redemption. Everybody is redeemable. So, what we focus on is that we just try to connect them with some good association in some way or the other.
Now, that is up to our intelligence to find out, okay, even within their way of living, somebody, they like, say, violin music, but sometimes within music itself, they may find something which is spiritual but which attracts them. Now, devotional music can sometimes be soothing, but there are devotional devotees also who have mantra rock bands and things like that, where it is spiritual, but still at the same time, there is a substantial amount of energy in that. So, that is what may attract them.
So, we may have to use our intelligence to find out, okay, this is the circle of bhakti and this is the circle of this person’s interest. At first glance, they appear to be entirely non-intersecting. But if you look deeply, you will find there are some intersections out there, and we try to connect them through that intersection.
So, at the very least level, there are many people who were from a similar background, and they have become spiritual, they have become devotees, they have become spiritually minded, they have become advanced bhakti yogis also. So, often, you can just share their stories with them. There is a website called howicame.com It’s how I came to Krishna Consciousness.
That is the idea. Amazing stories of people from all kinds of backgrounds who have practised bhakti. So, sometimes, it’s a story like that that may attract them.
So, now, we also need to know that everybody is at a different stage in their spiritual evolution. So, we can try to help them, but sometimes, they may just not be ready right now. So, what we do is that we keep the door open for them.
We don’t have to shame them into taking up spirituality. So, we just encourage them, present them spirituality as attractively as possible, and then, even if they don’t take it up now, they’ll remember. You know, I met a nice person.
And later on, when life brings them up to some difficult turn, at that time, Krishna is also present in their heart. Krishna is present in the hearts of everyone. So, if we have just created a good impression about Krishna, good impression about devotees, good impression about bhakti, then Krishna will prompt them at that time.
You know, try that out. Read that. Meet that person.
Go there. So, we can, we may sometimes be able to connect them to Krishna using our intelligence and finding out some intersection point. Or sometimes, we may just sow the seed and they may come closer to it.
Because they may just not have the desire right now. So, the desire can be kindled by right association. But even after the desire is kindled, they also need to, they need to also let the spark to grow.
So, if they don’t do it right now, they may not take up. So, we can just keep the door open for them. Never should we, because they are not taking up spirituality, we shouldn’t judge them as bad and we should never slam the door in their face.
If you’re not doing this, get lost. It’s not like that. We just, we understand that whatever they have done, Krishna is still in their hearts.
Krishna has not left their hearts. So, Krishna still loves them. And we can try to create some bridge between them and Krishna and when they walk across that bridge, it’s up to them.
Actually, Prabhupada, when he came to America, he was an old elderly Indian man who had no experience of American culture, whose accent was very Indian and he had no idea about how he would actually communicate with Americans. So, he prays that, Oh Lord, that you are in the hearts of everyone. So, he said that, My dear Lord, you please make my world understandable so that they will take up your message.
So, the point is that we simply see ourselves as instruments and we try to offer the connection with Krishna to them. Whether they take it immediately or eventually, we do our part. And if they have some misconceptions, everybody has some self-sabotaging beliefs.
I’m not good enough for this. That could be one self-sabotaging belief. Or another could be, I’m too good for this.
Both are actually self-sabotaging beliefs. But during our interaction with them, we can find out what is their self-sabotaging belief. Then, we can also help them to fight off that belief.
So, there are some blocks which keep us all from growing. And, the expertise of a good spiritual teacher is that they give a generic spiritual message, but when they’re interacting with specific people, they identify the block which that particular person is having, and they try to remove that block. So, if we can get those people, get that person, just to meet some spiritually advanced person, some good spiritual association, some spiritual guide, they will be able to find that block and help them address that block.
I talk about four things, basically. First is that their current situation should not bias us. They can or they can’t.
They are also parts of God. We should be open to giving them the opportunity. And the opportunity primarily comes through good association, through spiritual association.
So, God manifests in this world primarily through the godly people, through His devotees. And secondly, we can find out what is their specific interest. Their circle of interest and bhakti circle.
Find out some intersection by which their interest can be kindled. Although their first reaction is, this is not for me. Then they can say, oh, this is what I’m interested in, and this is here also.
At the very least level, food is something everyone is interested in. So, Krishna Prasad is a common point of intersection for everyone. And then third point I said is that, actually even if they don’t take up, we don’t have to judge them as bad.
Just keep the door open for them. And lastly, concluded by saying that, if they have some blocks just stopping them, their self-supporting beliefs, if they can be identified and addressed, then from wherever they are, they can start taking their money forward. Does that answer your question? Thank you.
Any other questions or comments? Shall we stop here? Okay. Okay. So, if somebody, if we want to help someone spiritually, how sincerely we pray to them, does that make a difference? Yes, definitely.
See, there are two things over here. Our sincerity in praying is what, is how we are showing our concern for that person. And Krishna sees that.
And based on that, Krishna increases the facility and the opportunity for them to take up bhakti. So, by our sincere prayers, we increase the facility and opportunity for them to take up bhakti. At the same time, it is their free will.
And by their free will, they may choose not to take it up. So, the point why I am bringing this up is that, by our sincerity, we can increase the chances of them taking up bhakti. But, it is not that if somebody doesn’t take up bhakti, that means our prayers were not sincere.
We should never undertake, take up anyone’s not practising bhakti as a personal failure. You know, parents. Parents, especially if they are spiritually minded, they invest their life and soul in trying to help their children grow up spiritually.
But at the same time, the child is a soul, a separate soul. And the parents have done their part. And the child doesn’t take up spirituality.
That is not a failure for the parents. They are separate souls. In Chaitanya Chaitanya is a sacred book, it is said that Advaita Acharya, who is the greatest devotee of Lord Chaitanya, his son did not follow bhakti spirituality.
He became an impersonalist. Is that a failure of Advaita Acharya? No. Son is a separate soul in himself.
So, we should definitely strive to help others in all ways that we can, including by our prayers. But, say, I am talking, if somebody is trying to help someone and they are not able to help that person, that person doesn’t become transformed, then nobody should make them feel guilty that you were bad because of which that happened. Is it clear what I am trying to say? Our sincerity facilitates.
But it is our sincere prayers, our sincere attempts they facilitate. It is they who have to make the choice. Krishna will never force the choice on them.
Even if we pray, no matter how much we pray, Krishna is never going to take away their free will. So, by their free will, they have to choose. So, basically, we can do only three things for other people.
We can share knowledge, we can set example, and we can provide facilities. Ultimately, for us to influence anyone else, there are only these three ways. We provide them the knowledge.
Why this is good? Why this is bad? We share the knowledge. Along with that, sometimes we tell them something is good to do, but their circumstance may not allow them to do it. So, we provide them facility.
So, if somebody is a recovering alcoholic, we understand alcoholism is bad. But if they are staying in a circle of people who are alcoholics, for them to do it up is difficult. So, providing facility means helping them maybe shift to somewhere, some other social circle or whatever.
Provide facility. And then set an example. Means we are as we say, walk our talk.
So, if we are doing these three things, then we have done our part. And then it is between that person and Krishna. They may take it up immediately, they may take it up later also.
That’s between them and Krishna, but we have done our part and we will grow spiritually by that. Thank you. Thank you very much for your kind attention.
Hare Krishna.