​QA session at Perth

​Evening program at ISKCON, Perth

Transcript

This is an AI-generated transcript and may contain some errors.
please let me know. We can get here. So, the questions, I’ll take them as many as possible here.
How do we assume, how do we assume, how do we assume, that we are progressing in spiritual life? I think it’s not assuming, how do we infer, how do we infer, that we are progressing in spiritual life? In the 11th canto of the Bhagavad Gita, it is said, bhakti, pareeshaanubhava, viraktiranyatraja. Bhakti, is a process, that gives, paraeeshaanubhava. Eesha is controller or God.
Para is one who is transcendental. Anubhava is experience. So, bhakti gives us experience of Krishna.
And the result of that experience of Krishna is, viraktiranyatraja. Virakti is detachment. Detachment from other things.
That means, when we experience Krishna, that experience is so fulfilling, that we stop craving for other experiences. So, Sri Prabhupada, when he was asked, how do we know we are advancing? Prabhupada gave the example, which comes in the second part of this verse. When we eat food, how do we know that we are being nourished? Two things, we feel strong, and we don’t feel, the hunger for more food.
Similarly, when Krishna enters into our consciousness, when Krishna nourishes our consciousness, then, we feel spiritually strong. Spiritually strong means, that we feel determined, inspired to serve Krishna more and more. Spiritual strength is, in terms of our determination to serve Krishna.
And, secondly, just as when we are satisfied, when we are getting good food, then we don’t crave, our hunger gets relieved. So, like that. Similarly, when we experience Krishna, that experience is so satisfying, that we don’t crave for worldly experiences, for sensual experiences, for mundane pleasures.
In that sense, the internal symptom of spiritual advancement is that, we experience Krishna, we experience fulfilment, in the experience of Krishna. And the external symptom, is that, how do we know that somebody is actually experiencing Krishna? They are detached from other experiences. They no longer crave for other experiences.
So, if you see these two things, that, we are getting more and more satisfaction in Krishna, and we are not craving for other experiences, then we can understand that we are advancing. And, in this also, we need not focus too much on desires. Because, desires will keep coming and going.
Even when we become advanced devotees, still, we might see some sense object, and some desire may come temporarily. Spiritual advancement should be seen, not so much in terms of change of desires, as in terms of change of values. Change of desire means, that we never get any bad desire.
But, the nature of this world is, that we will see certain things, certain memories may come up, and some wrong desires may come up. But, what is our response to those desires? The famous verse, of Himacharya, which is a Prabhupada word quote, he says that, Whenever I think of sense gratification, my lips curl in distaste, and I spit at the thought. Now, Prabhupada would focus on his response, and how he would respond.
But again, the point is, that even for a great saint like Himacharya, the thought might come in the mind. So, desires may come, but how do we respond to those desires? That is change of values. Initially, I mean, we are materialistic, at that time, worldly desires, when they come in, we roll out the red carpet for them.
Welcome! But, when we advance, when we become serious devotees, what do we do? We raise the red flag. It is a danger. So, that change from red carpet to red flag, that is a change of value.
And, as long as our desires may not change, I mean, wrong desires may come up, but if you are not welcoming those desires, if you are not entertaining those desires, if you are resisting and rejecting those desires, then that itself is a sign of spiritual advancement. If all devotees of Krishna go back to Godhead, then some devotees are more dedicated and do more service, and others are less dedicated and do less service. If all of them are going to go back to Godhead, then what is the need to do more service and be more dedicated? Krishna Consciousness is a process of love.
It is not like a business of mutual exploitation, where we want to do as less as possible for Krishna, and we want to get as much out of Krishna as possible. That is not love. So, there is Krishna’s love, which is expressed in His declarations.
You do even little bhakti, I will deliver you, I will take you to me. Lord Ramchandra says that, if somebody chants my name only once, I will forever grant him fearlessness. That is His love for us, which is making His declaration.
But if I say, I have chanted once now, now protect me for the rest of eternity. Now that is not our love. So, love actually can be one way, but relationships cannot be one way.
For a relationship to be there, there has to be reciprocation on the other side also. So, Krishna always loves us. And out of His mercy, even if we do little, He will appreciate that.
But, if we want to love Krishna, then we have to do as much as we can in His service. And actually speaking, the purpose of spiritual life is not just to go to the spiritual world. Because, if I go to the spiritual world, and if I think how much money is in my bank balance here, then what is the point of being in the spiritual world? The speciality of the spiritual world is not just in the location.
The speciality of the spiritual world is in the disposition. It’s not just that, you go there, then you’ll become happy automatically. No, it is the mentality of the people there that makes them happy.
The disposition is that they are absorbed in Krishna. And that absorption we need to cultivate. So, Krishna is so merciful that He’ll open the doors of the spiritual world for even those who are practising bhakti a little bit.
But, these such declarations of Krishna should inspire us, Oh, Krishna is so merciful, why should I love anything other than Him? Let me offer myself wholeheartedly to Him. So, as sadhakas, the mood of love is that I want to do as much as possible for Krishna. And if I am not able to do, then still Krishna is not a fault-finding God.
Krishna will still accept. So, the scriptural statements have to be always seen in a proper light, which inspires us in our service of Krishna. If we use the scriptural statement to justify our lackadaisical performance of bhakti, our half-hearted performance of bhakti, then we miss out on the purpose of scripture.
The purpose of scripture is, there are multiple levels of instructions by which we can all come towards Krishna. So, Krishna will accept everyone, but actually to be accepted by Him, in the sense that for us to experience the sweetness of His love, we have to direct our heart towards Krishna. It’s like, if our heart is directed towards other things, because we are performing little bhakti, little dedication, and our heart is directed to other things, then we will not experience the ecstasy of Krishna.
The ecstasy of Krishna is experienced only when we are absorbed in Krishna. And that’s why we should strive as much as possible to offer as much as we can to Krishna. And then, we will be happy even in this world, or to speak of the next.
Why did Lord Ram not consult Sita before sending her to the forest? So, why did Ram not consult Vasishta before sending Sita to the forest? Actually, there are multiple things involved over here. Firstly, Lord Ram, He is God Himself. And when He descends in this world as an ideal human being, He demonstrates the duties of a human being.
But still, He does many times things which a human being cannot do. No human being could have killed Ravana. No human being could have single-handedly destroyed thousands of warriors at the time of the battle in Janasthanam.
So, Ram is God. And in some situations, He acts in His position as God. And in some situations, He acts as a human being.
That is the meaning of Leela. Now, in this particular situation, when He had to banish, when He had to send Sita to the forest. Actually, there are multiple levels of reason for this.
The external reason is that that she was accused of being unchaste and Ram, in order to protect the reputation of the king, He sent her to the forest. That is actually a very external reason. It is not that Ram was more concerned about his reputation than about his wife.
Actually, if you see the reason, if Ram had just been interested in one’s own pleasure, which might come through reputation also, then, actually later on, for a king to perform a royal sacrifice without his wife next to him, that is very improper. All the royal sacrifices that had to be performed, the husband and the wife had to perform them together. And Lord Ram never married again.
He never accepted any other wife. So, the point was, there was a higher principle involved over here. All of us have multiple rules that we have.
So, for example, you know, a woman may be having a job, she has a profession, and she is also a mother, she also has a house, she also has a wife. There are many different roles, like a man may be a father, may be a husband, may be a professional. So, different roles sometimes conflict.
So, for Lord Ram at that time, there were two roles which were there. One of the roles was a husband who is meant to protect his wife. The second is a king who, now the king has enormous royal opulence, and yet, the king is meant to establish the example of dharma and detachment.
While ruling, the king expresses detachment not by living in spartan austerity, but by subordinating oneself to the sages who have nothing. Normally, people offer respect to the people who are wealthy. But here a person who is fabulously wealthy is offering respect to someone who has nothing.
That’s how people developed appreciation for spiritual culture. So, the king is expected to express detachment also. So, now he had both these duties.
So, if a king appears attached to his worldly opulence, to his queen and such things, then that will set an example where everyone will become attached. That is undesirable for their spiritual growth. So, Lord Ram reconciled these two, these two different duties which he had by sending Sita to the forest.
Now, sometimes people say that Ram banished Sita. Banished is not an appropriate word for what Ram did. Because banishment means one is sent right out of the kingdom deep into the forest with absolutely nothing at all.
Ram, when Sita was sent to the forest, that forest was Valmiki’s ashram. It was not just out in the dark jungles. Banishment means the way Ram was sent into the forest.
Out of Ayodhya, into the deep dark forest. That was not what happened to Sita. So, Sita was still in Ram’s kingdom only.
Valmiki’s ashram was in Ram’s kingdom only. So, Ram was put in. So, that means Sita was still indirectly under Ram’s protection through being in his kingdom in the hermitage of Valmiki.
And from the Gaudiya Vaishnava perspective, we understand that love is intensified through separation. So, Ram arranged for Sita to be separated from him so that both of them could experience the intensity, the highest love of love and separation. Now, these are all transcendental considerations that he had.
And with these transcendental considerations in mind, he acted. So, the lord can sometimes act according to the instructions of the spiritual master. And sometimes he may act by his own will.
That is his supremacy. So, Ram also did not seem to obey Vashishtha when Vashishtha came and asked him to come back to the kingdom. So, actually the relationship over there is quite different from the way we have relationships in the Vaishnava sampradaya.
Now, Ram’s spiritual master was not exactly Vashishtha. He was their family priest. And even now, if you see, there are different traditions.
They have different ways in the Sri Vaishnava sampradaya. Usually they don’t have Diksha Guru the way we have in the Gaudi sampradaya. They have what is called a Grantha Guru.
That means for each, if you want to study one book, you go to one guru. If you want to study another book, you go to another guru. Of course, one primary spiritual guide, whose guidance we take, whose blessings we take, by going to various other specialist teachers also.
So, the point here is Vashishtha was the family priest. As the family priest, he was more of a advisor rather than a spiritual master. So, in our terms, we may use the word spiritual master, but the mantras, especially the martial mantras, were given to him not by Vashishtha, but by Vishwamitra.
And later on also, before the Kurukshetra, before the Lanka Yuddha, it was Agastya Muni also who gave another set of mantras. And Ram was able to kill Ravana using the Aditya Hridaya mantra which was given by Vashishtha. So, in that sense, the brahmana or the priest is the advisor for the king.
And the king has his discretion by which the king may sometimes choose to follow the instruction and sometimes choose not to follow the instruction. And Ram was not just acting in defiance of his guru. He said that I have my father’s instruction.
And there is no immediate exigency because of which I should not follow my father’s instruction. So, there is, in the Bhagavatam also we see that sometimes Bali Maharaj does not follow the instruction of Shukracharya. So, the point is that there is a principle of dharma and one principle of dharma is we should follow the instruction of our elders.
Spiritual master is the foremost elder and spiritual master instructions are extremely important. But in this case, Vashishtha Muni was not exactly the spiritual master of Ram. He was a royal priest and Ram had other principles of dharma to consider while choosing his actions.
That’s how he acted accordingly. Okay. So, it is said association of devotees is very important.
But what if when we are outside the temple, we have to associate with non-devotees? And what if we are in a situation where we have no option except to associate with non-devotees? Answer association association is not just physical proximity. Association is primarily emotional affinity. It’s not physical proximity.
Prabhupada would give the example that a fly sits on the lap of the spiritual master. The fly is not associated with the spiritual master. Because there is physical proximity but there is no emotional affinity there.
The fly simply irritates the spiritual master. So, like that association is a matter of where the hearts are linked. So, we may have to, for functional purposes, for professional purposes, we may have to associate with people.
And they may be devotees, they may be non-devotees. That is perfectly okay. Even in the past, in Vedic culture, even when Vedic culture was there, it is not that everybody was a devotee.
Everybody, in the past, people were more dharmic. But it is not, even in the past also, it is not that everyone was a devotee. So, there is always a situation possible where our values and the values of people around us may not be the same.
So, in such a situation, we need some devotee association which inspires us to recommit ourselves to our spiritual values. And when we associate with devotees, there, essentially, there should be a transfer of spiritual desires. Devotees want to study about Krishna, serve Krishna, chant about Krishna, worship Krishna.
And by associating with them, that desire should also come within us. And the desire is coming strongly within us, then we are associating with devotees wherever we may be. And if you work for functional purposes, and while working with others, one of the advantages of today’s post-modern culture is people don’t intrude into others’ space.
You be what you want to be, you let me be what I want to be. That’s how people are, mostly, in the profession of the world also. So, if we are doing our job well, if we are doing our work properly, then people let us do what we want to do.
They may push us a little bit, but if we make our boundaries clear, people leave it to us. So, usually, if we have strong devotee association, in terms of we are associating with those who infuse with spiritual desires, then therein we are getting good association wherever we may be. Nowadays, one advantage of technology is that we can get association, even if we are not physically close to a temple, we can hear classes, we can be on through various medias, we can associate with devotees.
So, we should make sure that we get spiritual desires through some association, some means. And while associating with materialistic people, if we stick primarily to the functional activity that we are doing, and we don’t get involved in maybe talking about movies and sense gratification and parties and these things, where these things involve anti-devotional actions, we don’t get involved in them. We keep a distance from them.
Then that, we may be physically associating, but we won’t be emotionally degraded by that association. Who is Vishnu and who is Krishna? Sometimes I get confused with these two. Vishnu and Krishna are the same one Supreme God.
They are one person, two personalities. One person in two different moods, two different personalities. Roughly speaking, we should say that Krishna is God at home.
Vishnu is God in office. Krishna is God at home. That is why Krishna is very relaxed.
Sometimes you may see here, the Prime Minister in office or the Military General in office, you know, he is having a formal uniform, maybe having guns with him and everybody is bowing down to him. But that same Military General may come back home and maybe he has a son who makes him a horse and rides on top of him. So like that, the Supreme Lord in the form of Vishnu is, he has Shankha Chakra or Gana Padma.
He is very formal and informally he is worshipped. That same Supreme Lord at home, he is Krishna. Sometimes he plays with his Gopas and the Gopas defeat him and they say you have to carry us now.
And Krishna carries, Krishna carries others. So it’s the same person in two different moods. And both of them are the same one Supreme Lord.
Their moods may be different but they are the same one Supreme Person. And we become devoted to that Supreme Person, we can become liberated from material existence. So there are subtle differences between the two.
But those subtle differences need not become too important for us. We should focus on the principle that they are one person in different moods. And because Krishna is God at home, so more, his more personal, his personal intimate nature is revealed more.
And the reciprocation of affection between him and his devotees is more easily evident in his form as Krishna. And that’s why we who want to develop affectionate love for Krishna, we focus more on Krishna and the manifestation of God as Krishna. But essentially they are the same person and we don’t have to make a big issue about the difference between the two.
It’s just different moods. Is it not better to learn or understand one God instead of many names? Yes, there is only one God. The one God and his many names are not contradictory things.
Because it’s the same one person who has many names. Advaitam achyutam anadim anantarupam. Advaitam is one person but his anantarupam has many many forms.
And corresponding with his forms, corresponding with his qualities, corresponding with his activities, he has different names. So we don’t have to think that they are two different persons. So if the different names of the Lord confuse us, then we should focus not just on the name, but understand the meaning of the name and understand who is being referred to by that name.
The same object may be called as water in English, it may be called as Jala in Hindi, it may be called as Aapo in Sanskrit. But it’s the same object. One God may be known by different names and we need to see that the names are referring to the same person.
And that way we can avoid confusion. Do we need to have a shiksha guru, diksha guru or is shiksha guru sufficient? Yes, both of them are required. The soul’s journey towards Krishna is facilitated, is guided by many different guides.
The first guide is one who shows there is a pata padarshan guru. Shiksha guru is one who gives instructions. And there can be many shiksha gurus.
Diksha guru is a person who formalises our connection with Krishna and takes the primary responsibility for guiding us towards Krishna. So, we should not separate the two as entirely different. Now should we think that one makes the other redundant.
They all play their different roles. So we consider sampradaya to be like a university. Samyak roopena pradayate.
This is sampradaya. That will give you the systematic spiritual knowledge is called a sampradaya. In a sampradaya, there is like in a university, when a student is admitted, at that time, there is a formal authority.
Maybe the dean or the principal or the chief administrative officer, whoever it may be. They formal, it is their sanction which ensures the student gets formally admitted. And without that, the student is not formally in the university.
But after the student is admitted, the student may have PhD. They may have different PhD. They may have one PhD guide for one field, another PhD, another guide for another field.
So they may have different guides over there. So specifically, the learning may happen from different professors. But all those professors are part of the same university.
And within that university, the formal admission happens through one particular authority. So the formal authorisation of our connection with the sampradaya happens from the spiritual master through the diksha guru. And that’s why the diksha guru is important.
But from the practical instruction point of view, the education that we get and the elevation that we have, that may happen through many other sources also. That’s why Chetan Chaitramurth says that the shiksha guru and the diksha guru are non-different. Non-different in what sense? That they are all fulfilling the same one purpose.
That is of elevating us by giving us knowledge of Krishna. So in that sense, we need all of them. We need to be formally admitted in this university and we also need to be systematically instructed in the university.
And all of them play their own roles. So both of them, shiksha and diksha guru, all are essential. We had this system here.
Don’t mind. Sometimes we make wrong choices, may act wrongly because of our proclivities, and we don’t even realise it. So if we don’t even realise what we are doing wrong, then how can we do the right action as devotees? Yes.
This is what happens, especially when we are in the lower modes. One humorous way of explaining the three modes is some people make things happen, some people watch things happen, and some people wonder what happened. So in goodness, people are purposeful.
They observe, they understand, and they make things happen. Brahmanas don’t just run around doing things. They make things happen.
Some people watch things happen. When we are too much in passion, at that time, I have to do this, I have to do that, I have to do that. But often we do things thoughtless, not very thoughtfully.
And that’s why one thing leads to a chain reaction. This happened, this happened, this happened, and everything becomes very complicated. And we just get to watch things happen.
This is happening, this is happening, this is happening. We watch things happen. And in the end, some people wonder what happened.
This whole thing is just, we just don’t figure out what is happening. Shri Govinda Tai Bhagwan ki… So, the process of spiritual advancement also means that we become more self-aware. Self-aware means that we become more aware of what we are doing, what we are thinking, how we are desiring, how we are acting.
And this self-awareness happens as we rise more and more towards Sattva. Self-awareness is not self-consciousness. Self-consciousness means that, if I am sitting right now, I am thinking, you know, how do I look? Is my tilak proper? What are people thinking about me? Is my… We are just basically conscious of our externals.
That sort of thing is unfavourable. Self-aware means we are more reflexively internally aware. Okay, what am I doing? Not in the sense of how the world is perceiving me, but in terms of my own values, how am I acting? That happens when we come towards the mode of goodness more and more.
There is an interesting psychological, psychiatric study that was done. Nowadays, a lot of people have a problem of over-eating and obesity because of that. So people were asked in a day, how many food related choices do you make? Should I eat this? Should I not eat this? Should I eat this much or should I eat this much? So like that.
So they did a survey and for several hundred people in the survey, they said that we actually did 12 choices. 14 choices, that’s what they said. But when they went back over the day, they found they had made 227 choices.
So more than 200 choices they did not notice of me. It was just like… So one of the things that happens is distraction is an invitation for temptation. That means if I am distracted, if I am doing one thing and I am thinking of something else, then while thinking, okay I am talking on phone, I am also looking at my computer and without my realising my hand goes into a sweet box and eat a sweet.
So what happens? If we are too distracted, then we are not aware of what we are doing. So sometimes we feel I am chanting and I am not able to concentrate on chanting. What is the use of my chanting? But to become conscious that we are not concentrating is also a form of concentration.
I may be distracted and I may not even realise that I am distracted. If I am distracted and I realise that I am distracted, that also indicates that there is some level of awareness. So even if we are chanting and we are not able to concentrate, still if we try to concentrate, that at least becoming aware that I am distracted and trying to concentrate again, again getting distracted, again coming back to concentration, this at least makes us aware of where our consciousness is.
And this helps us in the rest of our life. So when we are doing other actions, when we start doing something wrong, just by the attempt to concentrate during our chanting, we have become more and more aware and that self-awareness carries over to other activities. So in general, by developing Sattva Guna and by practising Krishna Consciousness, by which we become more and more aware of where our consciousness is, we can recognise when our proclivities are moving us towards wrong things.
And we can correct ourselves. And specifically if we have some particular conditions which pushes towards wrong things, then there are two things which we can do to deal with it. First is create some obstacle between ourselves and that particular indulgence.
So don’t keep that indulgence readily available. In Google, also they had, Google as a company, they had this experiment which was done that there was, they had their shop, the cafeteria sort of thing, where there were sweet chocolates and all such delicacies which were kept in transparent bottles. And as a part of the experiment, they just changed it and they put it in covers which were non-transparent.
And just by doing that, the consumption of sweets, of desserts, of chocolates among the employees decreased by 35%. So out of sight to some extent means out of mind. So that way, if you don’t keep the temptations readily available, even if the proclivity comes, come on, do this, but it’s not readily available, then we have to go through some trouble to get to that.
And in that process, our intelligence comes back to us. Yeah, I should not be doing this. So sometimes people have a problem that they may, nowadays with internet available everywhere, people can surf wrong sites, undesirable sites.
And just one click and suddenly the whole world of the world of garbage can open up to us. So then if that is a problem, then we have some internet filter, something which restricts the sites that we go to. So basically, whatever is our weakness, we can try to create obstacles between us and that intelligence so that in the instinct comes, we don’t act immediately on it.
And secondly, when this sort of thing happens, we can ourselves observe what are our triggers. What are our triggers means? Our consciousness has broadly three zones. There is a safe zone, there is a danger zone and there is a fall zone, a relapse zone.
Safe zone means at that time we are not very agitated. It is overall peaceful. Danger zone means the temptation is now troubling us.
And then relapse zone means when we fall into the condition. So it is our triggers that take us from the safe zone to the danger zone to the relapse zone. And all of us have different triggers.
So we can become more aware of what the triggers of our consciousness are. And then, once we become aware of the triggers of our consciousness, then we can take safety measures. Just like in a house, there is a fire occurring, if there is a fire alarm, the fire alarm occurs, then at that time, we come to know that the fire has come before the fire becomes very big.
So like that, as we practise bhakti, it is not that the fire of desire will not erupt in the heart. But if the fire of desire erupts, we become aware fast. This is happening, let me check myself.
So that requires practise. The important thing is not that what we do when the proclivity comes and pushes us. Sometimes, if electricity is there going like this, if this is normal electric level, sometimes electricity spikes come up.
And when the spikes come up, at that time the desire becomes very strong. And we may not be able to resist also at that time. But the important thing is what we do between the spikes.
That means sometimes we say, oh, I have fallen down now, so let me fall down completely. No. You have fallen down? Okay, rise now.
There is no need to fall down further, just because I have fallen down. The mind often plays a very dangerous double role. What is that double role? First, the mind makes us do wrong thing.
Do this, you will enjoy. Do this, you will enjoy. And then, after we do it, we say, it is so little pleasure.
Why did I do that? And what happens, the same mind, which made us a criminal, now goes and sits on the seat of a judge and judges us. Why did you do that? You are such a fool. And it beats us up.
And now, this beating, it actually doesn’t help us improve. It only makes us more discouraged. So, either way, in both cases, we are mind conscious.
We are not Krishna conscious. And mind consciousness means we will stay trapped in the clutches of the mind. So, okay, if the spike of desire came up and I fell down, I did something wrong, okay, that’s over now.
The spike has come now, now it is gone. Now, let me not think about that. Let me think about Krishna.
Let me, by practising bhakti intensely, purify myself, strengthen myself. So, if, when the spike happens, it may not be in our control, but what happens between the spikes, that is very much in our control. And if at that time we are intensifying our bhakti, that time we are purifying ourselves, we are nourishing ourselves spiritually, then gradually when the spikes come also, we’ll be able to resist.
So, rather than worrying about what will happen when the next time temptation comes, whether I’ll resist it or not, whether I’ll be able to protect myself or not, whether I’ll fall down, focus on what we are doing right now. Right now, we nourish ourselves gradually, we’ll come to a level where we’ll be able to resist temptation later. Why did Shalya fight on the side of the Kauravas? Just because Duryodhana served him when he was on the way to go to the Pandavas.
So, Shalya was the uncle of Akula and Sahadev and he was relatively speaking a virtuous king. He wanted to fight on the side of the Pandavas. But at that time, while he was going along, Duryodhana arranged a very receptive, high quality service camp where he could stay and he would facilitate.
He was so pleased. He just assumed that Yudhishthira arranged this. And he said, the person who has arranged such excellent facilities for me, I will surely give up my life for his sake.
And immediately Duryodhana appeared and said, I arranged all this. Shalya was flummoxed. He didn’t know what to do at that time.
So, actually it was, you could say, a mistake of judgement. The two mistakes, one of the principles which is said in the Nitya Shastra is when you are very happy, don’t make a promise to anyone. Because in the illusion of happiness, emotions often, they push our intelligence down.
And that’s why we may speak things which are excessive. So, that was one mistake on his part. And second thing is, yes, it was, a further mistake was that in such a situation, even if he has given a word, yes, a Kshatriya, for Kshatriyas, their word of honour is very important.
Because Kshatriyas have a lot of power. They are the kings and if they simply start acting according to their whims or according to whatever is convenient for them, then they can become very exploitative and abusive. And that’s why it is ingrained in the Kshatriyas that your word of honour has to be extremely important.
If you have promised something, you must do it. And by that consistent emphasis on their word of honour, the Kshatriyas are inspired to act honourably. And that’s how they don’t succumb to the impulse for power and impulse for exploitation or domination because of the word of honour.
And because of being brought up in a culture where one should honour one’s word. But sometimes, any principle can be taken to its excess. So word of honour is very important.
But if in order to preserve one’s word of honour, one has to live a life of dishonour, then that is excess of a principle. In the Bhakti Samhita, in Updesh Amrit, it talks about Niyamagraha, sticking to the letter of the law while forgetting the purpose of the law. So Shalya committed that error in terms of sticking to his word and ending up fighting on the side of Adharma.
But of course, you can also see it from the point of view of Duryodhana’s cunningness by which he trapped Shalya using his strength. Shalya was a very honourable person and quite often maya can be so subtle that the very thing that we can use in the service of Krishna, maya can allure us through that very thing. I may be a very good singer, and I can sing very nicely, and I can absorb myself in Krishna, I can absorb others in Krishna, but through that very singing, I become proud.
I sing so nicely. So what may happen is, by my singing, others are remembering Krishna, but I am not remembering Krishna. So we have to be careful.
So word of honour is important, but the word of honour also has to be used ultimately for the purpose of Dharma. So, please explain about Krishna’s disappearance. How is it that when he departed from this world, he left a material body? How was that? Actually, the Bhagavatam talks about this a little in the 11th canto, and Vishwanath Kirodhakar also explains this further.
He says, firstly, I’ll summarise these various arguments. First of all, if we want to go according to material logic, Krishna left a body, therefore, he is also a body and a soul. But then we can see further, what was the context? It was a hunter who came and hit Krishna on the leg.
Now, a wound on the leg is practically never fatal. A wound on the leg, an arrow hitting the leg, it may kill if that arrow is, say, rusted and there is infection that spreads all over the body. After that, after quite some complication, a person will die.
Normally, an arrow to the leg never kills anyone. And Krishna was not like some sickly, weak person. A small wound killed him.
He was a great warrior, even if you want to look from material perspective. So, the idea of an arrow on the leg killing someone itself is illogical. If you want to stick purely to logic.
Further, if Krishna’s death was like a materialistic person’s death, then when that hunter shot the arrow at Krishna and supposedly that caused a fatal wound, Krishna was not at all angry with that hunter. And the hunter was actually regretful. I thought this was an animal and he told you, Lord, please forgive me.
And Krishna told him, this is all my plan. Krishna was not at all angry. Normally, you know, even in an honourable war, if one warrior kills another warrior, that warrior feels anger, feels pain, feels at least the pain of being defeated.
And what to speak of somebody who attacks you and kills you when you are not even watching. You know, Krishna was sitting in a meditative posture, he was sitting under a tree with his legs stretched out, not exactly meditative posture, but he was meditating, he was absorbed in his thought and suddenly somebody attacks. It’s actually a very cowardly, very unfair, very outrageous kind of attack.
And yet Krishna was not in the least angry about it. Krishna told him, this is all part of my plan. And further, Krishna had already told Arjuna, Krishna actually sent a message through Uddhava to Arjuna that now I am going to depart from this world.
Associates are going to depart. So you take the remaining residents of Dwaraka to safety. And so basically Krishna knew everything that was happening.
Shukadeva Goswami also further says that if you look at Krishna Leela, prior to that, Krishna had gone even to the abode of Yamaraja. Normally when somebody goes to the abode of Yamaraja, a person doesn’t come back. You die.
You don’t come back. Not only did Krishna come back, but Krishna brought back people who had gone there. We have the case of Krishna’s spiritual master Sandipani Muni, his sons died and Krishna went and brought back that son.
So the point is if we want to look at Krishna’s death or we want to look at Krishna’s life, Krishna’s departure, Krishna’s life, there is nothing ordinary about it. And that’s why ordinary logic cannot apply over there. Then why did Krishna leave the body over there when he departed? So in Jiva Goswami explains in his Shatsang Darbhas and Krishna’s talks about this in the Chetan Charita Amrit, he says that some of the Leelas of the Lord are Asura Mohana Leela.
Asura Mohana Leela means normally the Leela is performed to attract the devotees. But some Leela Krishna performs to delude the demons. The demons, Krishna’s mercifulness is there such that Krishna can actually attract everyone, Krishna can attract even the demons.
But there are some people who are so stubbornly demoniac that they don’t want to change at all. So then Krishna allows them to stay in illusion. Krishna allows them to stay in illusion.
There is a classic example of this in Mahabharata. On the 14th day when Arjuna set out to kill Jaidrath. So at that time the Kauravas arranged their whole army to stop Arjuna.
And yet Arjuna was breaking through their formation and destroying everyone. To assist Arjuna, Yudhishthira first sent to assist behind his head Satyaki and after that he sent Bhima. And on that one day Bhima was so angry he penetrated into the Kaurava ranks and on one day Bhima killed 30 of Duryodhana’s brothers.
And Duryodhana was shocked. This Pandavas are charmed. My whole army is not able to stop them.
And despite everyone being Drona, Karna, Shalya, all of them, nobody is able to stop Arjuna. Bhima has killed 60 of my brothers. Surely Bhishma told me that I cannot win against the Pandavas because Krishna is on their side.
Krishna must be God. Krishna must be God. What is the use of fighting against God? I was just thinking like this.
He saw the sun going close to the horizon. There is a time still the sun is not set. I was thinking.
His desire to defy Krishna, his desire to defeat the Pandavas was so strong that there was such overwhelming evidence of Krishna’s power that he just disregarded all and he thought if Krishna is God how could we have killed Abhimanyu yesterday? Abhimanyu was dear to Arjuna and Arjuna is dear to Krishna. The very fact that we killed Abhimanyu yesterday means that Krishna is not God. And because Krishna is not God we will be able to fight and stop Arjuna.
And immediately he summoned six different warriors to come there, come between Arjuna and Jayadrath, to protect Jayadrath. So the point is it is said that for a believer needs no reasons. A non-believer accepts no reasons.
So that’s how it works out that for some people who want to disbelieve in Krishna’s divinity Krishna provides them reasons. And one such reason Krishna provided when he left his body behind and he arranged that even according to some parts of the tradition that even the body was cremated. All this was Krishna had his own transcendental form.
That transcendental form went back to the spiritual world but for the sake of deluding the demons he left behind the body and by that the demons could say that Krishna is not God. And that’s how they could continue in that demoniac mentality. So according to Jain conception Krishna is still living in hell.
Is this true? Actually you see Jainism and Buddhism, these two religions emerged in India as a result of the exploitative caste Brahmanas who were monopolising all power and privilege and neglecting the lower castes. There were many reasons but this was the main reason and Jainism and Buddhism they attracted a lot of people especially from the lower caste and later on they spread also very rapidly. Now because the Vedic culture at that time was so prominent, so Jainism and Buddhism they wanted to be ideologically autonomous but still most of the people who became Jains and Buddhists they were they were coming from a culture that was very deeply steeped in Vedic imagery and that is why originally these religions were meant to serve a particular purpose of elevating people to basic good living moral living and in general if you see Buddha himself did not talk much about ideology and Mahavira and the other they did not talk about much philosophy their focus was primarily on living in the mode of goodness live properly and the subsequent thinkers within those traditions they came up with various ideological interpretations of the teachings of their founders so what they tried to do is in these religions because they wanted ideological autonomy and the followers were still steeped in the imagery coming from the Vedic culture they often reinvented retold in a fictional way the stories which were known to those followers.
So for example there is a Jain Ramayana and the Jain Ramayana now what happens is this basic storyline is more or less similar but throughout his forest day Ram keeps meeting Jain sages and he gets good advice from the Jain sages and at the end when Sita is taken by the earth at that time Ram becomes enlightened and becomes a Jain so this is basically a fictionalised retelling of the Ramayana which is done by later Jain thinkers to try to subordinate a person who was very popular within the people at that time to say that he was also a Jain so this is actually Christians also did this this is for example what Christians did is when Christianity came from the Middle East to Europe to Greek. Now Greece was a place of learning and there the Socrates, Plato, Aristotle these were big philosophers as compared to that the Christian theology the teachings of New Testament were very simplistic so St. Augustine and others they integrated the two Greek philosophy with Biblical theology but then how could they take Greek theology because Jesus has not taught that so St. Augustine and other Christians, Christian teachers they posthumously appropriated Socrates, Plato and Aristotle as pre-Christ Christians pre-Christ Christians they were not Christians actually but they appropriated him like that so in general when a religion wants to spread quite often they try to appropriate the pre-existing imagery that is there into their own storyline so like that in the Jain spin that was given to the Mahabharata the idea is that some of the activities that Krishna did in the Mahabharata they from a moral perspective appear to be wrong now in an earlier class I discussed about how morality is not just contextual morality is not categorical, it is contextual what is right and what is wrong will vary according to time, place and circumstance and Krishna did not act immorally what Krishna acted was actually according to higher principle of dharma in those situations but because Krishna acted immorally so some later people in the Jain tradition they spun the Ramayana around and they said that because he acted immorally so he has to go to hell but this is a completely fictionalised rendition of the Mahabharata and actually Krishna is the supreme lord and he eternally resides in the spiritual world and periodically he descends to the world in various forms to elevate people what is the difference between a Brahmin and a sage? both can be similar a sage is basically a person who has spiritual wisdom and spiritual vision a Brahmin is a person who belongs to a particular varna of a Brahmana, now ideally speaking a Brahmana should also have a spiritual vision Brahma janaati iti brahmana so if a Brahman is truly a Brahmin in quality then that Brahman will naturally be a sage but if somebody is a Brahmin just by birth and not in quality then that person may be a Brahmana but may not be a sage if the mind, body and intelligence do sinful activities then why does the soul suffer for those sinful activities answer, the mind, intelligence and body they don’t do it it is they propose it it is the soul who accepts it the example to understand this is suppose suppose somebody is surfing the net and he is surfing on some site for shopping and suddenly some pop up window comes up and that is also a nasty site now the computer doesn’t take us to that site itself the computer prompts us it is we who click and then we go there so like that our mind our senses they bring they pop up images in our consciousness but when those images pop up when those ideas pop up when those desires pop up it is we who accept them it is we who act on them that’s why the doer is the soul the doer is not the body, the mind or the intelligence they can be the proposers we are the doers to give another example to illustrate this let’s say a person is driving a car and next to them there is a child and the child is starting, see that see that and the child is directing everywhere now this person who is driving that person has the steering wheels and the child cannot push this person away and take the steering wheel and take the car in some other direction but the child can distract and the child distracts, go there, go there now if this person listens to that child and they will go in that direction if they don’t listen to that child they will not go in that direction so that mind, our mind is like the distracting child we as the soul are like the person at the wheels of the car so it is we who choose so it is because we, what do we choose? we may not choose the occurrence of the desire, the desire may come and so on, but the indulgence of the desire is what we choose and we are responsible for that choice so how does the ego play a role in this? The ego is what causes us to misidentify with the voices of the mind, intelligence the intelligence here by intelligence we refer to the materialistic intelligence or the senses, Krishna talks in Bhagavad Gita in 3.40 that Indriyani Mano Muddhir Asya Adishthanam Uchyate that selfish desire is present in the senses, the mind and the intelligence so basically it is because we choose to do the action, that’s why we get the consequences how can we connect with Krishna or think of Krishna when we work in a factory or office for 8 hours a day yes primarily it depends on how we connect with Krishna when he is directly in front of us when we have opportunity to come to temple, when we get associated with devotees when we chant the holy names at that time how much we connect with Krishna that is more important, now suppose say a husband is working in some different city and the husband comes back home and then he tells his wife when I am there I think of you constantly but then the wife starts talking with him the husband starts checking his messages SNS and the wife will say see when I am right in front of you you are not even thinking of me then how can I believe you are thinking of me when I am not in front of you isn’t it so similarly when Krishna is right in front of us when Krishna is manifesting as the holy name when Krishna is manifesting as scripture when Krishna is manifesting as the deities at that time we focus on trying to offer our consciousness as much as possible to Krishna these are the times when we solidify our connection with Krishna and if we do this solidly gradually Krishna will enter into our consciousness as the goal of our life Vishwanath Chakrashankar gives the example of how we can think of Krishna constantly he says suppose a person a man is working a person may be far away from home and may be doing various kinds of jobs may be meeting with this person negotiating here, dealing there, travelling there but through it all a man is thinking that I am doing this for my wife or this is for my children I want to take care of them, I want to maintain them so it may not be the thoughts of the family may not be constantly in the foreground but they are there in the background as the purpose of why one is doing that so similarly he says as we keep practising bhakti as we understand the philosophy Krishna becomes the goal of our life and Krishna becomes the goal of our life then whatever we do we may be in an office doing a job, initially we may do a job because we just think I want to earn a lot of money I want to become wealthy and famous and popular but as we start practising bhakti more and more Krishna becomes the goal of our life then we say I am doing this job so that I can get Lakshmi, I can use Lakshmi in Krishna’s service so the activity may remain the same but the motivation, inspiration changes and that’s why to the extent we are associating with Krishna nicely when Krishna is directly manifest before us, to that extent our attraction to Krishna increases to that extent we become inspired by the desire to serve Krishna and when that desire to serve Krishna becomes the primary driving motivation in our life then that desire to serve underlies all our other activities also, whether it may be in the family or in the office, that motive will be to serve Krishna and that will define and that will be the background presence even if it is not the foreground presence and additionally even when we are working we can try to create spiritual stimuli, if we are working on a computer we can have some Krishna related wallpapers, if we are doing work that is not intellectually demanding we can hear some soft spiritual music some kirtans, if we strive to serve Krishna and we strive to remember Krishna Krishna will give us intelligence about how we can remember Krishna will give us ideas as many devotees during their lunch break they may hear some philosophy or if we find within our professional circles there is someone else who is spiritually minded then we try to share Krishna consciousness with them and that way also we can spiritualise our workplace but principally it is not that to remember Krishna is not possible when we are working we shouldn’t think of remembering Krishna as a simplistic artificial stuffing of our mind with Krishna remembering Krishna is something that organically emerges when there is an attachment to Krishna so we focus on the direct devotional activities by which we become attached to Krishna and when that attachment to Krishna comes then organically he will animate our whole life as our driving purpose so I am a university student and I have just joined ISKCON please tell me how I can be a devotee in my position and age group and what should I do to be a good devotee and serve the Lord yes it’s fortunate that in youth itself you had an opportunity to connect with Krishna and youth is a time when we have energy we have intellectual sharpness and we have a lot of drive in our life and at this time we can get Krishna into our life and all our youthful energy, intelligence, drive that can all be constructively utilised so one of the biggest temptations in youth is often we want to postpone a spiritual life to later but that idea of postponing spiritual life to later that comes because we think that spiritual life has only other worldly benefits yes, in my old age I will practise bhakti then I will go back to Krishna but spiritual life also offers this worldly benefits when we practise spiritual life seriously it enables us to actually become more focused more calm, more self controlled by which whatever we are doing we will be able to do it better so the vision of life that bhakti offers us is that what we are is God’s gift to us what we become is our gift to God what we are whatever talents we have whatever abilities we have, whatever resources we have they are our God’s gift to us and we use them use them in a mood of service we develop those abilities and that is our gift to God so the studies that we are doing whatever university position we are in I am not just doing this to get a job or to get a degree I am doing these studies to serve Krishna and earlier we may study just to get good marks but we can study now if we study nicely and get good marks our friends ask us, what is it that enables you to study how do you do so well I study but I also I am devoted to Krishna that helps me to focus, that helps me to do well we should see our service our studies also as a means to serve Krishna and that way if we focus primarily on direct devotional activities as much as our schedules allow then we can move onwards towards Krishna even through our other activities including our studies so if possible try to find other devotees in the same age group and with those devotees in the other age group in the similar age group you will also have like minded association that way you can move forward towards Krishna how important are Shastra conjunctions for all devotees to follow and why Shastra is basically like a manual so how important is the manual, manual is what enables us to operate a machine properly, so like that life we can live best when we live according to Shastra see broadly speaking we make our decisions based on four factors first is fashion now why do I wear this dress because everyone is wearing it everyone is doing it so I do it second is tradition why do I do like this because we have already done it like this third is feeling why did you go over there, I felt like going there fourth is logic why did you do that, it made sense to me now all these four are useful they can be potentially useful guides in our life but fashions can be foolish quite often you know Oscar Wilde said fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to change it every six months so the corporate controlled media it’s determined that one thing is fashionable and we rush to purchase it after sometime that same media determines something has to be fashionable and that becomes old fashioned so we have to give it up after that so fashions can make us foolish sometimes, traditions not all traditions are right many traditions can be wrong also for example within the Vedic tradition it’s the idea that a person is Brahmana by birth that’s something which is wrong so tradition can also mislead and our feelings are notoriously fickle same thing I like today tomorrow I just can’t tolerate it when we are driven just by feelings now when two people form a relation simply based on feelings they may say initially I can’t live without you and then after six months I can’t live with you so if we are driven only by feelings, we cannot move on and logic is useful logic is valuable but our logic is also limited we may not have enough information we may not have enough intellectual capacity to reason things properly and so all these four are useful parameters but they are not sufficient parameters beyond all these we need scripture. Scripture is the word of God that is the manual and we subordinate and integrate fashion tradition, feeling and logic with scripture and when we follow scripture that is the lighthouse that guides us that is the lighthouse which will never mislead us as I said through shastra shastra has a lot of knowledge but the most important part of shastra is it guides us about how we should act in our life tasmad shastram pramanam te karya karyavasthita vyatva shastra dhana uktam karma kartum yaha rasi.
Krishna says that therefore act according to shastra and in this way you will attain auspiciousness in life what are the essential qualities of leaders and how leaders can motivate others in Krishna consciousness what is the difference between a boss and a leader ok as far as inspiring or influencing others is concerned we everybody has free will and the door to individual transformation can be opened only from inside the door to individual transformation it cannot be opened from outside it can be opened only from inside as they say that we can take a person we can take a horse to the water we cannot force the horse to drink so we cannot force anyone to do anything Krishna at the end of the Bhagavad Gita also says that that as you desire so you do deliberate deliberate deeply and then you decide what you want to do the first principle in leadership is to recognise that others are independent living beings we cannot force anyone to do something to the extent we think that others should obey me to that extent we will set ourselves up for frustration now this does not mean that we shouldn’t guide or we shouldn’t lead but we always need to know that they are independent people and I cannot just create a throw a tantrum if others don’t obey me they are free they can do whatever they want and that’s why we cannot demand obedience we have to command respect we cannot demand respect now how can we influence others then we can’t force anyone to do anything but we can inspire them the way in general one human being can guide or influence or shape others actions is basically three categories 1. Provide knowledge 2. Offer facility 3. Set example whether it is a leader in a community whether it is a parent for children whether it is a counsellor for counselling these are the three main things we can do for others first is provide knowledge now we tell you this is right this is wrong not just this is right this is wrong not just do this don’t do this we explain why it is right why it is wrong why this is beneficial why this is wrong so not just not just giving a set of fiats do this do this do this that sort of leadership doesn’t work at all there is a atheist gag on the bible gag means like a cheap joke they say in the beginning was the word and the word was no in the beginning was the word and the first sentence of the bible in the beginning was the word and the word was god the word was no people have this very negative conception of religion religion means no don’t do this it’s not like that so as leaders we shouldn’t just cue don’t do this it’s a systematic knowledge of why something should be done why should not be done 2. Create facilities if you just tell people that suppose somebody says you should not take anything except prasad but then there is no prasad available anywhere are people to starve then no if we say all of you should fast for ekadashi and the only food available is grains what will people do if you tell people to do something it is our responsibility to provide facilities for them to do that thing now create facilities so parents they want their children to become devotees now they have to create a forum where there are other children of the same age where children can play with other children who are devotees which will create facilities for them to learn and release krishna consciousness in the way that is suitable for them so just giving knowledge without creating facilities is inadequate and third is set example krishna consciousness is more caught than taught I may say do this don’t do like this but if I say that you know we should very prayerfully offer our respects and worship the deity but when the deity darshan happens I am looking everywhere except at the deities then people will catch that much more than what I spoke in the class so it is very important that we set example so set example means that whatever principles of krishna consciousness we are talking about we also try according to our capacity to exemplify that and actually if you see this is what Srila Prabhupada did he provided knowledge, he wrote books he gave classes and he created the international society for krishna consciousness which is basically a facility and if you hear about Srila Prabhupada’s life he set an example constantly wherever he would go he was remembering krishna so leadership essentially means providing knowledge creating facilities and setting an example if you do this now creating facilities also means if you tell people to serve krishna you need to create systematic facilities so provide them services provide them facilities to execute those services and if you do this then definitely you can inspire many many people to move closer towards krishna so I feel very inspired to become a strong devotee and devote myself to krishna but I also have very short temper and I can’t control my material desires what should I do Srila Prabhupada was asked if our desire is to serve krishna if our purpose is to serve krishna why is maya so strong so Prabhupada replied because your purpose is not strong because your purpose is not strong what this means is that we are innately pleasure seeking creatures and we we cannot live without pleasure but we can choose where to seek pleasure so quite often if our conviction is not strong conviction means spiritual advancement in loving krishna there is real happiness if conviction is not strong then our determination cannot be strong so conviction is conviction refers to our internal understanding determination refers to our external action so we cannot have determination without conviction trying to have determination without conviction is like trying to build a big building on a marsh the building is just going to sink it is going to collapse so quite often when you say that I don’t have determination the problem is I don’t have conviction if you study the philosophy more carefully, understand the philosophical concepts then our conviction will deepen, when the conviction deepens then automatically the determination will also become strong so as far as the principles of bhakti are concerned irrespective of whether we have material desires or not, irrespective of whatever we are doing, we should always keep practising bhakti that means no matter what all problems we have, we should always keep practising bhakti and by practising bhakti the unorthodox will get removed so find out ways in which you can serve Krishna in a way that purifies us, that connects us with Krishna more and more, as far as the short temper or as far as the material desires are concerned we need not focus too much on them, focus on Krishna it is just like, say there is a glass here in the glass, I decide that I want to remove the air from the glass and make vacuum over there it is very difficult even if after a lot of labour I create a vacuum over there, just little bit I shift the lid, immediately air will go inside on the other hand if I decide that I will fill the glass with water, fill the glass with water, automatically the air will go out so like that if I think I will think I will not become angry and I will become angry about my not becoming angry so that’s why we need to focus on the negative, we focus on the positive, we don’t have to try to empty our mind of wrong desires we should crowd wrong desires out of our mind, crowd wrong desires means fill the mind with positive desires, let me try to do this for Krishna let me try to do this for Krishna and focus on that and while trying to do that the negative things will automatically go out in due course, so what is the importance of Ekadashi and the benefit of visiting temple on Ekadashi yes Ekadashi is an opportunity for us to do intensely at least for one day what we are meant to do normally that means the idea is that for us as sadhakas to practise intense bhakti constantly is not very easy so what we can do is at least for one day we practise intense bhakti and by that intense practise of bhakti we become, we get a taste of Krishna consciousness and as that taste increases more and more we become closer and closer to Krishna so although on Ekadashi we may fast, but fasting is not the primary purpose of Ekadashi sometimes we may fast and we may fast and then we may go and see who is eating what laughter this person eats so much, Ekadashi and you are eating sweets eating this, eating that laughter if we are doing like that then our body may be fasting but our ego is feasting laughter laughter so the purpose of fasting is not to just not just to show how sense controlled we are to the world the purpose of fasting is to increase our meditation on Krishna to put aside bodily distractions so that we can increase our focus on Krishna and I just said that whatever bhakti that we do on Ekadashi Ekadashi is a special day for Lord Vishnu and I said whatever bhakti we do on Ekadashi on that day we get special mercy we get much much more devotional credits for whatever we do on Ekadashi and that’s why any devotional activity that we do on Ekadashi, such as coming to temple, that is very beneficial so if we can’t come to temple regularly, at least we can come on Ekadashi and the important thing is we try to increase our remembrance of Krishna and the more we remember Krishna the more we try to connect with Krishna especially on sacred Ekadashi the more we can come closer and closer to Krishna what values can senior devotees impart to devotees in general how should they conduct their life so that they can help others yes in any course of action that we follow, when a student joins an engineering degree, or joins an engineering college the one thing that they see is those who have passed from their college, what are they doing if they are in good positions, if they have a bright career, the students will say, yes let me go there but if they see that, oh this person is doing engineering and now they are unemployed living on doors, should I do any second thoughts so whenever we take up any process we look at those who have followed this process, what have they or where are they situated so Bhakti is a process of inner transformation that inner transformation which makes us devoted to Krishna, Prabhupada was asked, how do you know, how can we know your disciples, Prabhupada could have given many answers, they are always chanting Hare Krishna since they wear Tilak no, Prabhupada says my disciples are perfect gentlemen, perfect ladies and gentlemen, that is Prabhupada focused on behaviour behaviour, you know gentle, proper behaviour, sattvic behaviour internally we are remembering Krishna but internally the remembrance of Krishna should manifest as as pleasing behaviour so if your senior devotee is we should be as kind and as gentle, as welcoming to new devotees that is how, kindness gentleness, sensitivity that is what attracts people towards Krishna and actually this is required not just for new people this is required even among devotees sometimes it is said that when we come new to ISKCON people feed us fried pakodas and then after we become devotees they fry us like pakodas we sometimes take devotees for granted they are already devotees no, at every time whether they have been practising devotional bhakti for 1 year or 5 years or 10 years no, everyone has to everyone has to get inspiration in bhakti and we are not going to get inspiration in bhakti from non devotees the inspiration for bhakti has to come from devotees only that’s why the most important thing that senior devotees, they deal nicely with new people, that is very good but how senior devotees deal with other devotees is important because when there is ultimately people people come for various reasons to spiritual organisations the philosophy is only one of the reasons it’s an important reason but it’s only one of the reasons one of the main reasons why people come is people want a sense of community people want a sense of belonging and that’s why if they see that here people are so affectionate people are so kind Prabhupada writes in the Act of Instruction Parpot that the Krishna Consciousness movement will grow is nourished and it will grow by the six-fold loving exchanges between devotees. It’s interesting six-fold loving exchanges are giving gifts, receiving gifts offering prasad, taking prasad revealing one’s heart, hearing others reveal one’s heart. Actually preaching is not there in any of these activities we think Krishna Conscious movement will go by preaching as we give classes to new people and attract yes, it will grow by that but after people are praying, they will see how we are living so the six-fold loving exchanges need to be there among devotees.
So senior devotees, if they exemplify these loving exchanges, then that will definitely attract a lot of, inspire younger devotees and attract new people also so that value of proper behaviour of sattvic behaviour loving Vaishnav behaviour that is what can inspire a lot of people to come towards Krishna so how can a community avoid Guru Groupism okay actually just now before I came here I was just with his Guru Jan Prabhu and he was telling me we were discussing various things, so he said that you may say that I am a Radhanath Swami disciple and you may say that I am a disciple of Radhanath Swami is there a difference between the two? yes so I thought about it I said I am a Radhanath Swami disciple when I say that means Radhanath Swami disciple is one group and I belong to that group so the identification is primarily with the group when I say I am a disciple of Radhanath Swami that means the focus is on the discipleship that I am a disciple of a spiritual master so quite often when we come to spiritual organisation also we bring our material ego with us so for example in India there is nationalism so the idea is Mera Bharat Mahan many Indians say that but they don’t know anything about India’s spiritual they don’t even know one verse from Bhagavad Gita and why is Mera Bharat Mahan why is India great? because I was born in India so for me the greatness of India is simply an extension of my false ego so like that unfortunately when we come to spiritual organisations we bring that ego into the spiritual circles also so we think yes I am great and therefore my Guru must be the greatest and therefore we try to promote our spiritual master a lot. But Prabhupada in a very beautiful lecture which he gave on the Vyasa Puja offering of his spiritual master Bhaktadhanjay Rampalji said he said the Guru is one although he may manifest in many forms. So ultimately Krishna Vande Jagat Guru it is Krishna who is manifesting to guide us through various spiritual masters and Krishna is unlimitedly attractive and Krishna manifests his attractiveness through different spiritual masters that means Krishna to one soul Krishna may manifest his attractiveness through one spiritual master to another soul Krishna may manifest that same attractiveness through another spiritual master but it is Krishna who is attracting it is Krishna who is attracting people and when we share Krishna consciousness with others and we attract people towards Krishna so if we have this mentality of the extended false ego then we think that my group should become bigger so people who come to my group they should become new people should come to my group but if we think that actually this soul is a part of Krishna and my duty is to help this soul to become attracted to Krishna so whichever medium through which Krishna manifests his attractiveness and attracts the soul that is fine that person is essentially meant to be attracted towards Krishna and when we have this understanding spiritual understanding of the dynamics of what is happening it is not we who are bringing somebody to become a devotee we may think oh I preach to you so therefore you should take initiation from my spiritual master first of all to think that I preach to you I made you into a devotee that itself is an illusion now Prabhupada in Mahabhagavata and when Prabhupada is composing the Markhane Bhagavata Dharma Markhane Bhagavata Dharma is the song that Prabhupada composed when he was in Jal Doota and there what is he praying he is not saying that I am going to make all these Americans into devotees Prabhupada is saying Krishna by your mercy please make my words understandable to them and then he says Tomara Icchai Sabahoy Mayavash Tomara Icchai Nash Mayar Parash says it is by your will that all people have come under illusion it is by your will that people can come out of illusion if you desire oh lord that people come out of illusion then please make my words understandable to them so Prabhupada is himself not thinking that I am making someone into a devotee he is simply saying that Krishna by his will will remove illusion and inspire people to become devoted to him let me just be an instrument so if we have that mood of being an instrument then we can avoid this sort of Guru groupism now there is another point here that there is a natural identification yes if I am initiated by a particular spiritual master then others who are initiated by a spiritual master there is a natural affinity between them but this sort of affection cannot be legislated it cannot be legislated sometimes for me at least some of my closest friends are devotees who are disciples of other spiritual masters relationships cannot be mandated so if we focus too much on externals then we forget the principle of bhakti the principle of bhakti is we want to develop relationship with Krishna we want to help others develop relationship with Krishna and we want to develop relationships with those who have relationship with Krishna so if others are also disciples of same spiritual master that may and that can act as an impetus for us to develop relationship with them but it is not necessary that our relationship will only be with them so we need to keep our spiritual focus in mind our spiritual focus is we want to love Krishna and we want to inspire others to love Krishna and whatever is favourable for that we need to do that we are keeping the spiritual focus in mind we can avoid extending the false ego into the spiritual realm in the name of things like Guru Gurpism so I think it is already 9.15 so actually I have I have my website thespiritualscientist.com so after I can take all these questions and I can answer these questions there if any of your questions are not answered if you subscribe for the daily feed on Spiritual Scientist in your inbox you will get the answers and many of the questions which I answered here some of them have also been answered over there so if your questions are not answered you can either search on the Spiritual Scientist or you can subscribe for the feed you can get the answers over there later thank you very much Prabhupada so