Reincarnation – From Romance to Research

[Prerna youth lecture at ISKCON, Nasik, India]

Transcript

This is an AI-generated transcript and may contain some errors.
Hare Krishna.
Thank all of you for coming today evening. And I will speak on the topic today of reincarnation. And we will discuss these aspects of it, reality, rationality, opportunity, whatever the topic will be, from romance to research.
So I just wrote a book on this topic, Demystifying Reincarnation, which will be available for those of you who want it after the class. But as I have been giving talks on this topic for the last few years, I have encountered a wide variety of questions. And one of the most entertaining questions that I got, not entertaining in a frivolous sense, but a question that later I found originated from the entertainment industry.
So that question stimulated this topic. So I got this question, a boy asked this, you know I love a girl and both of us want to marry each other. But our parents are not allowing it.
We are trying but they are not able to persuade our parents. So what karma can I do in this life so that I can marry her in my next life? So the question is that reincarnation is accepted as some kind of fact of life. But it is, it doesn’t lead to a change in the conception of life.
Now this question originates largely from Bollywood where often reincarnation is used as a tool for expanding a romantic story. So say a hero and heroine, they love each other. But then they are not able to unite and both of them die.
And then, usually this is the first half of their film and it seems to be like a tragedy, both of them are dead, there is an intermission. And then after the intermission, both of them reincarnate. And they reincarnate in exactly the same bodies which they had earlier.
So the hero and the heroine both play double roles. And then whatever the love story that was not completed in the previous life, it gets completed in the next life. Now in this case, the idea is that okay, after death maybe there is some other life.
But the basic understanding of reincarnation is, what is it that reincarnates? And the Bhagavad Gita explains that what reincarnates is something different from the body. It is the soul. So, Krishna says, inside this body, there is the embodied being, that is the soul.
So, the specific question, how I answer it, I will come to it at the end of the class. But let me first explain what is actually wrong in the assumption that led to the question. So, when people think of reincarnation, they think as, okay, I am the person and who am I? I am the body.
And okay, if I am going to reincarnate, that means the body is going to come back again. But the Bhagavad Gita says the body is equal to the soul. And it is the soul which goes from one life to another.
In fact, the very word reincarnation, re means again, in means inside. Karna is related to flesh, like we have carnivorous animals, those which eat flesh. So, reincarnation means to come again in flesh.
That means to come again in a body. It is not that the same body comes. It is the embodied who comes again.
But that soul will come in a different body. And if this is not understood properly, then one has actually not understood reincarnation at all. The basic principle that is emphasised through reincarnation is that the body and soul are different.
So, one of my friends who had gone to Russia and he was giving a class in Russia and he was explaining philosophically, you are not your body. That is the basic teaching of the Bhagavad Gita. And one person asked a question, Sir, if I am not my body, then whose body am I? So, the idea is that I am the body.
So, if I am not my body, then I must be somebody else’s body. What is going on? Is there some kind of astral projection? What is this voodoo stuff going on over there? So, the idea is that when we talk about reincarnation, this romanticisation of reincarnation that has been done by Bollywood and by some novels, that actually distorts the concept of reincarnation. It makes people think that it is the same body that is going to come.
No, our body is a resource that we souls have been provided. I will come to how we get a body a little later. But, not only does the idea of reincarnation as depicted in Bollywood lead to misunderstanding, it leads to the perpetuation of the misunderstanding that I am the body.
It also leads to trivialisation of the subject. Trivialisation means that just like in Bollywood, we see so many things. We see all kinds of stunts.
One person fighting against 20 people. One person being shot by 50 guns and not one gun bullet hits. In movies, we may see phantoms.
We may see vampires. We see all kinds of creatures. Basically, when we watch a movie, there is what is called suspension of rationality.
We suspend our rational thinking and just enjoy the story. Similarly, people start thinking just as for entertainment, we may imagine vampires. We may imagine stunts.
We may imagine ghosts. We may imagine a spiderman. We may imagine a superman.
So like that, we can imagine reincarnations. So reincarnation, when it is romanticised, it also becomes trivialised. But apart from this trivialisation, there is serious research done in this field.
And this serious research is what will be the thrust of the discussion. And then that will bring it back to the topic of romance and spirituality. So let’s look at the research.
So, go ahead, come back to the speaker. So what is the reality of Dr. Ian Stevenson? As the modern pioneer of the study of reincarnation. And he, can you go back? No, back, back please.
So he uncovered various levels of evidence. So when you talk about people who have past life memories, there are children, small children. Suddenly the child tells, mummy, mummy, I want to go to my other mummy.
What other mummy? Mother doesn’t understand. Papa, I was big then, I am small now. What? I was big then.
So they suddenly start speaking out and sound very strange. But then, they start giving precise facts. I was so and so person, I did this, I went here, I did that.
And these are the first level, that is, recollections. But beyond that, the children are taken to that place and recognise. This is my mother, this is my father, this is my sister.
This was my room, this was my toy. That is the second level. They actually go there, the recollections.
The third level of evidence is, their behaviours. So, say a child who has, died because, who has hydrophobia. A lot of fear of water.
Then the child, it’s found out that the child actually had died because of drowning in a previous life. Or, this child, in this life, behaves as if, the relatives of the previous life are real relatives. So, a child who sees a woman who has never seen, before in this life, calls her mom.
So, it’s not just, in terms of intellectual recognition, an emotionally appropriate behaviour also there. Which would make no sense from this life’s perspective. But, considering the reincarnation perspective, they make a lot of sense.
And, the fourth level of evidence, is birth marks and birth defects. So, children often have very precise marks in their body, right from birth. And, there is no biological cause for them.
And, these are very unusual birth marks. So, Stevens has wrote many books. So, the two of his books, the first and the last, 20 Days of the History of the Incarnation, were the first books that he wrote, in which he started.
After that, he spent almost more than 60 years, travelling across all the continents, and finding pieces of reincarnation. And, the last book that he wrote was, Where Reincarnation and Biology Intersect. And, he said that biology is the physical marks on the body.
So, that was the focus of this last book. Go ahead. So, when I talk about birth marks, if you see this, these are very, it’s not that some people have some scar on the body, there are some pimple on the body, some black spot on the body.
It’s not like that. This is a birth mark that was there, right from the birth, in this child. And, he claimed to be the reincarnation of a person, who had died in a previous life, because a truck had run over, had knocked him down.
The knock itself had severely wounded him. And then, when he was just thrown off, his one leg was straight this way, the other leg was straight the other way. And, the leg, and the truck, went over the leg at that point, at the exact thigh, in the femur area.
So, these are very unusual, extraordinary birth marks. And, scientists till now, know primarily two reasons, why birth marks may occur. One is genetic.
In the family itself, some marks are there in the, maybe some kind of pimple is there, some kind of black spot is there in some place, or whatever. Genetic. And, the second is, during pregnancy.
If the mother, either gets some disease, because of which, the digestive system gets upset, and, because of his basically, the disease of the effect, that the child’s skin gets scarred, or child’s body formation gets, gets interrupted. So, normal body formation doesn’t occur. Other than pregnancy itself, if the mother takes in some harmful substances, if she smokes excessively, if she drinks excessively, then that may also affect the embryo.
Now, in over 50% of the cases, that researchers, that doctors, have observed, when there are birth marks and birth defects, there are neither of these factors. Neither there is genetic cause, nor is there any cause during pregnancy. So, why do these 50% cases, have birth marks and birth defects, that has no satisfactory medical answers.
Now, moving on, let’s look at a specific case. So, this is a case, in a Muslim country, in Turkey, the case of Nesib, born to Dasya. So, Nesib, he was, when he was around the age of six, this boy was born in Adana, in Turkey, and, when he was at the age of six, he started saying, that, I am Nesib.
Yes, you are Nesib. This is an unusual case, when in his previous life also, his name had been Nesib, but his name was Nesib Udak. So, he said, that, I live in Mercy, no, you live in Adana, no, I live in Mercy.
And then, gradually, because, Islam, mainstream Islam, doesn’t accept reincarnation, in fact, it considers reincarnation heretic, the parents do not make any, reincarnation condition at all, and they keep rejecting. But, he did not. And then, as he grew older, he started insisting, that, you must take me.
That, if you don’t take me, he said, that I live in Mercy, and I want to go there. If you don’t take me there, I am going to go there alone. So, then his mother, as he was a year old, ten, eleven, twelve, she realised that, he can actually act on his own, let him go alone.
So, she took him, to her father’s place. Her father lived, in a small village, near Mercy. And, her father, had recently remarried.
And, she had, and he had, and his new wife, was from Mercy. And, this boy, Naseer, he immediately recognised her. And, he told her, you are here, and you are doing this, and you are doing that.
And, when he told her, that I am Naseer Buddha, she said, that yes. There was a person, named Naseer Buddha, who lived there. And, he had died, during a violent fight, because of, he had died, because of multiple knife wounds.
And, she confirmed, many of the facts, that Naseer said. So, Naseer’s grandfather, became intrigued. And, then he took him, to Mercy.
And, as soon as he, he had never been, to Mercy in his life, but as soon as he went there, he just directed his mother, okay, go here, go left, go right. And, he straight took him, to a house. And, that house, belonged, to a woman, who was, who was, whose previous husband, was Naseer Buddha.
And, she asked, she was even taken aback, with this boy, who claimed to be her husband. And, but then, she started asking questions. And, he answered, all her questions accurately.
He told her, who built the house, who built the wall, in front of our house. He told her, it was a man, who lived in the outskirts, of the village. And, he was physically, he had physical, physical handicap.
He told many things. And, all of them, were precise. And, one of the most, significant recognitions, that he told was, this Naseer Buddha, had been a short tempered person.
And, once, after drinking, when he had been angry, he had a quarrel, with his wife. And, during the course, of the quarrel, he just took out his knife, and, and, hit his wife. His wife moved away, but the knife, cut her at the thigh.
And, she, got a lifelong scar, in her thigh. Now, when, Naseer told this, when, the past life researchers, Stevenson and others, they, they had a female assistant. The female assistant took, this woman to a private room, and they examined her thigh.
They found that she had, a scar, at exactly the same place, where Naseer Buddha had said. Where Naseer Buddha had said, she would have. And, she also said, that, my, my previous husband, had, had attacked me, and that’s how I got this scar.
Now, this is, a very private knowledge. You know, in, in, in a private part, of a woman’s body, if there’s a scar, how can some boy, who doesn’t even know her, know about such a thing. So, there’s more, not only that, go ahead.
He, was, so, when he saw him, he had children, through this wife, and those children, were almost as old as him, some were older than him. And, yet, when he saw these children, you know, he would then, ruffle their hair, and he was affectionate to them, as if he was their father. And, these children, just couldn’t make head or tail, what is this? And, not only that, his, his wife, from the previous life, she had remarried.
So, her husband was not at home at that time. So, when Naseer, the small boy, he saw, his, previous wife’s, photo with her husband, he got so angry, and he picked the photo, and wanted to tear it apart. He said, you are my wife, no one else’s wife.
And, now, not only that, all these facts, and emotions, very difficult for a small child to make. But, most significantly, he had, six, correlating birthmarks. So, this Naseer, Buddha, he had a, got into a fight, after drinking with someone.
And, that person had stabbed him, multiple times. Now, when Naseer, in this life, would talk about, his previous life, he would, he would say that, that I was stabbed. And, when he was, when he was talking about, how he was stabbed, he would point to the birthmarks, on his body.
And, he would say, these, this was where I was stabbed. So, now, how precise, is this correlation, between, the previous life’s, fatal wound, and, this life’s, birthmark. So, to find this out, Dr. Stevenson, divided the, human body, as per, XY coordinate system, into 160 grids.
So, for example, you know, this right temple, this is one grid. So, the right part of the forehead, will be another grid. This, centre of the forehead, will be another grid.
Like that, 160 grids, he divided the board. So, 160 is a lot of number, that means, each grid will be very small. And, then he found out, how precise, is the correlation.
And, he found, in most cases, it was exactly, if the, if, the bullet had, hit a person, in the, centre of the right temple, the birthmark, would be also, the centre of the right temple, in the next life. So, this is, that means, the probability, of that correlation, is, 1, divided by 160. This, fatal wound, in this body, and the birthmark, in another body.
The possibility, that it would be there, exactly at the same location, is 1 by 160. Now, if there are 6, correlating birthmarks, that means, the probability is, 1 by 160, raised to the power of 6. Which, is an extreme, you know, probability. And, this is just one case, like this, researchers have found, hundreds upon, hundreds of cases, all over the world.
Of, children, who have, remembered past lives, or, recognised, things from their past lives, or, behaved appropriately, who have, birthmarks, and birth defects. Go ahead. So, now, whenever, this kind of cases come up, then, sceptics often say, this is all a fraud.
Somehow, then, this must be a fraud. So, let’s see, if, it could be a fraud. Now, why would people do a fraud? One reason could be, they want money.
So, Stevenson, and, all the researchers following him, they have made a strict policy, that when they, interview, the, the, subjects, in a past life memory case, they never give any money to it. This is that. Means, if a child is related to the past life, I have to remember a past life, whether that child and his family, or the, previous, personality’s family, they don’t give any money.
Because, their point is that, if you give money, then, in order to get more money, people may sensationalise, some facts. So, there is no monetary incentive over there. In fact, many of these children, are, born, poor families.
And, for the, and, if you look at, Stevenson’s detailed books, you know, he has, an elaborate process, of what all questions, are to be asked. So, that, the students, the, all the, participants, at least, are grilled, and, it takes hours, and, sometimes, multiple researchers ask questions, and, a police grilling happens. Not that hostile, but, it’s that serious.
So, for many of these, people, who are parents, who live, who barely give a hand to non-existence, for them to spend one whole day, sometimes, giving interviews, sometimes, several days, it’s, even on getting money, they lose money. So, there is no monetary gain at all. Even if, say, the children claim, that, they were born, that, they were, in a previous family, which was very wealthy, the parents, in this life, never ask, the previous family, that, you may be in this family, because, this is my child, you will take care of him.
So, there is no monetary gain at all. Then, what else could be there? Maybe, fame, or, my son has, reincarnation, or so and so. Well, there are, most of these children, who claim, to be, someone in past life, they talk about, someone who lived, a little known, or unknown life.
None of these children, claim to have been, anywhere famous. So, there is no fame, to be God, in, in, be the reincarnation, of somebody or other. Now, there are cases, of, claim, celebrity reincarnation, also.
So, for example, in the western world, there was, there was, a famous, woman, Marilyn Monroe. Now, there are, at least, six women, who have claimed, to be reincarnation, of Marilyn Monroe. Now, this is, researchers, serious researchers, treat such cases, of celebrity reincarnation, with suspicion.
Because, there is obvious motive, one wants to claim, to be famous, one wants to be famous, by claiming, to be reincarnation, of someone famous. But, in the case of, Stevenson, doesn’t investigate, on any, celebrity reincarnation, cases. And, now, there are more, serious researchers.
So, there is no fee, involved over there. Now, wouldn’t be, some people may have, religious motive, that, they, had a, you know, say, some Hindus, or some Buddhists, believe, in reincarnation. They want to prove, yes, our belief is true, and there is, scientific evidence, for this.
That also, doesn’t happen, because, most of the parents, who believe, in reincarnation, you know, they, they live in a society, as I said, many of the cases, are from rural places, where, if they believe, in reincarnation, nobody challenges, their belief. And, there is no need, for them to prove it. Moreover, even among Hindu parents, there is a, superstition, that, if a child, remembers, a past life, then, that means, the child, is rooted as, soul.
They feel like that, because, their idea is, that the soul, has not integrated, properly, to the body. Because, if the soul, integrates to this body, the soul will not remember, the past life. If the soul is remembering, that means the soul, is not integrated.
And if it is not integrated, then the soul, will soon get separated. Something like that. So, of course, statistically, Steven Stevenson, did not find, any correlation, like this.
Children, who remember, their past lives, do not die, younger than other children. But, there is a superstitious belief, that is there. Because of which, even when children, of, parents, who believe in reincarnation, talk about, their past life, remember, if their parents, often discourage them, they don’t encourage.
It’s only, when the children, that the parents, finally, remember. And then, there are many cases, where the parents, do not believe in reincarnation. Like, they actually, disbelieve it.
There are cases of, inter-religious reincarnation, Hindu to Muslim reincarnation, Muslim to Hindu reincarnation. And in these cases, the parents, don’t want to have, any reincarnation connection also. So, in fact, many parents, do all kinds of strange things.
Antonia Mills, is a researcher. She has written, in the journal, in the journal, Scientific Exploration, that in cases, like these, where there is, inter-religious, reincarnation claimed, the parents, go to great extremes, to somehow, make the child, forget. So, they sometimes, starve the child, spank the child, they take the child, to exorcist, maybe some, ghost has come into him, just put the ghost, out of him.
Or sometimes, they put the child, on a potter’s wheel, tie him to the wheel, and just make him, go round and round, and round, and round. And they make him, grow anticlockwise. Why? Because they want him, to unwind their memories.
It’s superstition. But basically, the parents, don’t encourage, parents discourage, many cases. So, that’s why, there is practically, no motive for fraud.
And there are, some cases, where, far from the parents, doing anything, the parents, lose something. The parents, lose respect. So, for example, there was this case of, this boy, Jasbir Singh.
Now, when he was around, two and a half, three years old, one day, he suddenly, very young he was, he suddenly told his parents, he was born in Jat family, and then, he told his parents, you know, I’m a Brahmana, I cannot eat food, cooked in this low caste house. And he refused to eat. And, for several years, after that, his father, actually had to pay, a Brahmin, to cook food, and get to his house, three times a day.
Now, how embarrassing is it, for a parent, to tell, to let the world know, that my son, refuses to eat food, cooked in my own house. Not only is embarrassing, child has to pay someone else, parent has to pay someone else, also for that. So, there is absolutely, no incentive, in many cases, for the children, for the parents, to do fraud.
And there is, strong disincentive. Therefore, fraud, is something, which is not really, very easy. There may be some cases, to be fraudulent, as I talked about, people claiming to be, celebrated reincarnations, but there are many cases, which cannot be dismissed, as frauds.
Go ahead. So, Tom Schroeder, was the editor, of Washington Post. And, when he heard about, these reincarnation cases, he was sceptic.
He said, I don’t believe this. So, he, decided, I will go with, Jan Stevenson, and I will see, first hand, how he investigates. How he, interviewed, these people.
So, he went to Libya, and he came to India. And he spent, nearly a year, with Stevenson. And, he saw, how rigorous, his investigation was.
And after that, what was his conclusion? Would someone like to read this? Do you have a mic? Yes. Who would like to read? He has a conclusion, intentional fraud, peer pressure, or coincidence, could explain, how the children, he had investigated, could have known, all that they knew, were strangers, whom died, before they were born. Tom Schroeder, editor of Washington Post.
So, Jan Stevenson, Jan Stevenson. So, they became friends. Tom Schroeder, wrote a whole book about this.
Called, Old Souls, an investigation of the past lives. So, this is a journalistic investigation. And, he remained a sceptic.
He says, I don’t know, how these people are able to remember. But, there is no fraud about it. So, that means, this evidence, has, withstood a critical scrutiny.
Go ahead. So, now, what is the reality? How is this incarnation, actually happening? The most reasonable explanation, for this, is that, actually, if we consider, set theory. Now, this is set A, this is set B. So, the person, who lived and died, at a particular time, at a particular place.
Now, that is set A. And, a child is born, at some other place, at some other time. That is set B. At the material level, there is no intersection, between the two. And, yet, this child, remembers, things about this person.
So, how is that? The only, most reasonable explanation, is that, there is, something common, between the two. And, that common, is something non-material. Because, the material body, is destroyed, at the time of death.
Because, that non-material, that the physical body, after it is destroyed, the non-material entity, that goes from one body, to another, that is the soul. The soul, goes from one body, to another. And, the soul, because it is the same, that is how, the soul is able, to remember certain things.
Now, like earlier, I said that, when the soul, goes from, one body, to another body, the soul never gets, the same body. The way it is depicted, in Bollywood, that the same body, comes back, that is in Bollywood. Why not? Because, the body, is like a, dress, or you could say, like a house, which is given, for the soul.
Now, when, we have lived, in a particular house, and we leave that house, because we are tenants, in that house, and our contract, has expired. And, we go to the next house, what house, will we take? Depend on two things, what are the liking, and what is our budget? So, similarly, the soul, goes from one body, to another body, it goes based on, two things. You know, what are the desires, of the soul? And secondly, what is the budget? The budget refers to, karma.
So, if the soul, has done good karma, or more good karma, than bad karma, the soul has a, positive karma budget. And then, the soul will get, a better body. The soul has a, more bad karma, than good karma.
It has a, negative karma budget, and get a body, that is worth living, in this life. So, because, the soul, in each life, does different karma, therefore, in the next life, the soul will never get, the same body, which it has, in this life. And, in this way, the common element, that is there, that, we can understand, is the soul.
So, the soul, reincarnates, from one body, to another. And, what is the, implication of this, for all of us? So, if we consider, all of us, we have a, innate longing, to love forever. No one, wants to die.
Even the smallest, of creatures, they want to, if a mosquito, is biting us, the mosquito, slips away. So, they are very, at trying to, maintain us. So, we all have, longing to live.
And, now, if you consider, this longing to live, forever, where does it come from? If we look at, the world around us, everything here, is temporary. There is nothing, that lasts forever. A few months ago, I was in America, so we passed by, I mean, we passed by the, area where the, twin towers have been there.
Now, and all that, when the twin towers, fell, it was not just, a fall of a building, the twin towers, represented, the American dream, of forward, and prosperity. And, its falling, symbolised, the shaking, and the shattering, of a dream. So, it was a tall, majestic building.
In fact, that building, was like a model, in which, buildings were built, similar buildings, were built in other parts, of the world also. When I was in Abu Dhabi, when I was in Dubai, and they also, have got towers, twin towers. Towers of twin towers.
Then they modelled, all that, New York twin tower. So the point was, that, that looks so big, so powerful, so secure, just comes from, love. It joins us.
So the point, again, is that, nothing in this world, is permanent. We don’t accept it normally, we think that things are permanent, but we know that, nothing is permanent. When you take big mountains, they are also not permanent.
So, if nothing lasts forever, if nothing in the material world, lasts forever, and if we are simply, material creatures, then why would we, ever get a desire, to last forever? If we are simply, the products of our circumstances, and in our circumstances, which is material world, material level, there is nothing that lasts forever. Where would we get that desire from? To give an example, say consider an African tribal child, who has, never gone, much beyond the vicinity of that village, where the child is new and grown up. And suddenly the child, goes, Mama, I want a pizza.
Pizza? Where did you hear of pizza? You know, there is nothing in the circumstances, the child knows of pizza. So, the child has got a desire, for like, a desire like this, which is not circumstantial, which is not coming from the circumstances. The first question will come, where did this desire come from? So, similarly, when, everything around us is temporary, where does our desire to live forever, come from? That doesn’t come from any material.
It comes from something non-material. It doesn’t come from outside, it comes from inside. At our core, we are souls.
And as souls, we are meant to live. We are meant, for eternal life. Because soul is eternal, and meant for eternal life, when we identify with the body, we aspire for that eternal life, and the body will be there.
Now, not only do we want to live forever, we want to love forever also. Most of the movies, they, or romance novels, they end with H-E-A. And they live happily ever after.
Actually, if you see, there is no ever after. Everybody is going to die. And yet, there is a strong longing, for happily ever after.
Like the Bhagavad Gita says, that this world is, Dukkhalayam Ashashvatam. So if you compare it, it is exactly opposite. Happily ever after, Dukkhalayam Ashashvatam.
So, Bhagavad Gita says, it’s temporary. Now, although, we see, that nobody lives ever after, and hardly anyone lives happily also. But still, that longing is there.
Why is it there? Where does it come from? So actually, it has come, from the soul. The Bhagavad Gita explains, that the soul, is a part of the whole. The whole, Mamai Vamsho Jeevan Loke, Jeeva Bhukta Sanatana, the whole, is known in different, by different names, in different traditions.
The Bhagavad Gita knows, that whole by the name of Krishna. So we are parts of Krishna. And as parts, we are meant to live, in loving harmony with each other.
So, not knowing, who we are, and not knowing, who we are, who we are meant to love, not knowing who we are, and not knowing, who we are meant to love, we end up, identifying ourselves with the body, and directing our love, at the body. And thus, we, if the relationship don’t work out, we get frustrated. So, actually, the concept of reincarnation, was not meant to create some, some, curiosity.
Okay, curiosity is good, but reincarnation is not just a tool, for expanding a romance plot, into another life. The reincarnation, the essence of reincarnation is, redirection. And, what should happen, when we understand reincarnation is, the result of reincarnation should be, redirection.
We direct our heart, from the world, to the source of the world, which is God, which is Krishna. And when we learn to love him, by practising bhakti yoga, then our longing, to live forever, and to love forever, will be perfected. So when this boy asked me this question, about, what can, what can I do, by which I can get, marry the same girl in the next, marry this girl in the next life.
So I told him that, actually, whatever it is, we are all souls, going through, various lifetimes, in different ways, and during our journey in this lifetime, we come across some other things also. And sometimes we find something, very attractive in some person. Now, the Bhagavad Gita explains, that whatever it is, that is attractive in anyone.
That attractiveness, is the spark, of Krishna, or attractiveness. yad yad vibhuti manasad from shri madhochita nirbhava tad viddhi madhava from mamatey jyotisambhava Krishna says in the Bhagavad Gita, that, everything attractive, springs from a spark, of this splendour. And that means, that whoever is attractive in this world, yes they are attractive, but they are reflecting, they are radiating, a spark of Krishna’s attraction.
And sometimes, by circumstances, by karma, we form relationships in this world, some relationships work out, and some relationships don’t work out. So, now yes, if you are finding some attraction, attractiveness, as a someone, you are getting some love from someone, yes we understand, this person is attractive, this person is loving, but at the same time, you understand, what they are reflecting is a spark. And, we, when we get, when we get completely in dark, even a small spark, makes things light like.
But actually, if I want to read a book, I want to do anything productive, I cannot do it with a spark. I need a proper source of light. So like that, in our present, we all live, in a love star of the condition.
And in this love star of the condition, if we get even a drop of love from someone, we get captivated, irresistibly captivated. But actually, even if that relationship works out, we will not get, the dream fulfilment, that we are looking for, why? We will not get the dream fulfilment, that we are looking for, even if we get our dream marriage. Why? Because, we, are, expecting from one part, that which can be given only by the whole.
So yes, they may offer us some love, they may be attractive, but that leaves a spark. What we need is the whole. So, if some relationships work out, good.
If we have unrealistic expectations, of the other person, the other person is perfect, we will be simply frustrated. But we understand, I am on a journey towards God, and, along that journey, I found various relationships. If some relationships work out well, wonderful, we move forward in that.
But, these relationships are not the purpose of life. They are a stains, in pursuing the purpose of life, which is, to develop a vertical relationship with Krishna. Because of relationships, some may work out, some may not work out.
So, what we should do is, that, yes, I found this person attractive, but what was it attractive about that person? That attractiveness, comes from Krishna. So focus, on developing the vertical relationship with Krishna. When you do that, whatever love, whatever joy, we could have got by developing this relationship with this person, we will get that, and much, much more.
Because Krishna is the source, of all beauty. He is the reservoir of our love. And, He, is, our ultimate, soulmate.
Many people talk about, when they want to get married, I want a, I don’t want just a partner for my body, I want a soulmate. Now when they talk about soulmate, and people ask, I was in the University of Denver and, a student asked this question, what is, their understanding of the concept of soulmate? So I explained, that, when you talk about soulmate, you should focus more on the soul, and less on the mate. When you talk about soulmate, you focus on the mate, I want to find a partner.
But focus on the soul, understand what the soul is. So instead of, bringing the idea of a soul, bringing the idea of reincarnation, into a materialistic worldview, you should actually, let the concept of reincarnation, change our worldview. So that we understand, that I am not a body, I am a soul.
And as a soul, I am meant for an eternal, reincarnation of the whole. When we practise Bhakti Yoga, then, by that redirection of our heart, from the world to Krishna, then we go beyond reincarnation. Instead of being born again, and again, and again, we attain eternal life.
And therein, we find everlasting fulfilment. I’ll summarise. Spoke on the topic of, reincarnation, from research, from romance to research.
Talked about how, this boy asked the question, how can I marry this girl, in the next life. And so in Bollywood, has a romanticisation, of reincarnation, where, the hero and the heroine, appear to the same body again. And, this perfect, this distorts the idea, of reincarnation, making people think, that the body is the same.
That body stays the same, from life to life. It not only, distorts, but also realises, because then people started, reading reincarnation, like, like phantoms, and ghosts, and superman, and all other kinds of ideas, that are there, for entertainment, in novels and movies. But there is serious research, for reincarnation.
And we discussed, one is Genesis, another is four findings. Does anyone remember, the four levels of findings? Recollections, recognitions, behaviours, birth marks and birth date. Thank you.
So, I discussed, the case of, Nasser bin Iskandar, in detail. And how, he knew about his car, and the tyre of his, like, previous life’s wife. How he was, jealous of, her husband, and how, he had six correlated, birth marks.
Means, a very low probability. Then we discussed, the flawed hypothesis, and how there was no, monetary motive, no faith, no religious motive. And in fact, there is disincentive, because sometimes, children’s behaviour, causes embarrassment, to the parents.
Like in the case of, Jasbir Singh. Then, I talked about, what is the implication, of this all? That, if there are two sets, which are not intersecting, person A, who lived in Dier, and person B, who is living, somewhere else. The intersection is not physical, so it has to be, something spiritual, that it was so.
And then, towards the conclusion, we discussed, reincarnating, not just, some subject, for, vague interest, it has an implication, in our life. We are going to die, and we are going to get, a next body. And based on, the desire, that we cultivate, and the karma, that we do, we get our next body.
So just as a person, who has a temporary house, they, would like to always, have their own house, because it is impermanent. So like that, the wise soul, wants not another, temporary material body, but an eternal, spiritual body. And that is, the essence of reincarnation, should be, redirection, of our heart, to the part, to the whole.
And, after discussing, scientific evidence, I discussed also, the point of view of logic, that, our desire, to live forever, cannot come from, our circumstances, because, there is nothing, that stays forever. Like a child’s, African tribal child’s, desire for a pizza. So our desire, doesn’t come from our, outside, it comes from our, inside.
To live forever, comes from the soul, which actually, is eternal. And the desire, to love forever, comes, from the soul, soul’s, position, of being a part, of the whole, of Krishna. So sometimes, the horizontal relationship, with others, may work out, sometimes, they may not work out.
So rather than, making these, relationships, the goal of life, we understand that, these relationships are, aids to the goal of life. And the goal is, to develop, an eternal relationship, with Krishna. Whatever love, whatever joy, whatever attractiveness, we get from, any person in this world, they are radiating, a spark, of Krishna’s attractiveness.
It’s a spark, may give some light, but it’s not, enough light. Like that, the love we get, from anyone in this world, it is valuable, but it is not, sufficient. So we need, to direct our love, towards Krishna.
And when we, direct our love, towards Krishna, then we go beyond, reincarnation, to eternal love. And the purpose, of understanding, reincarnation, is, when we redirect, our heart, when we learn, to love, Krishna, more than this world. Krishna, takes us, beyond this world, to his eternal abode, for a life, of everlasting joy.
Thank you very much. Hare Krishna. Does anyone have, any questions? Yes, please.
Question from audience. reincarnation of, 1.1, why does it, circulate, there is a circulation, around Swachh, other life forms, such as, are there only, 5 people, for reincarnation, or other? Yeah. So, why are there only, 5 people, people remember, their past lives, from, previous bodies? First of all, we can look at the question, why don’t they remember, why don’t most of us remember, our past lives also? See basically, each lifetime, is an opportunity, for the soul, to make a new beginning.
And, for that purpose, the soul is given, the memories, the recollections, that are necessary, for living in this world. Every action, if we start doing, you know, if say, I am talking with you, and, while talking with you, I ask, can you remember, I have met someone, whose face is exactly like you. I will get distracted.
Now, if I have met someone, like you, and if we have all gone through, hundreds of lifetimes, and all those memories, start coming to us, at all moments, we will just go crazy, there will be a, cognitive overload, for our brains. So, basically, from a practical, functioning perspective, we are given, the memories, that are necessary, for us to function, in this life. Also, death, and even birth, they are not, very pleasant experiences, they are traumatic.
And, it is a, psychological defence, mechanism, that, over a period of time, we forget, painful memories. Initially, those painful memories, stay very, they haunt us a lot, but over a period of time, we just need, to push them aside. And so, nature helps us, in pushing aside, the past life memories.
And more importantly, our memories, are also largely, triggered, by circumstances. That means, if you had, lived in a childhood, in a particular place, how much will you remember, about that place now? Maybe a few things. But if you go back, to that place, then you will remember a lot.
But, usually, when we, are reborn, we are reborn, in a different body, and a different place. So, because our circumstances, are different, because of that, most of our, thoughts, and emotions, are associated, by these circumstances. And that’s why, the recollection, of the previous life, is very less.
So, usually, the children who remember, their past life, have something else, going on also. They have some birth marks, they have some odd behaviours. And why do these particular, children remember, their past lives? It’s just, some peculiar, combination of karma.
Now it’s, just like, in this life, we all have different, memory capacities. Some people have, outstanding memories. They, they, meet one person, out of ten years also, they remember the person, and identify the person.
And some people have, outstandingly poor memories. They meet a person, and talk with him, for two minutes, and at the start, they hear the name of the person, after two minutes, what’s the name of this person? So, what happens is, we all have different, memory capacities. And why is that? It’s karma.
Some of us have better, very good looks, some of us not so good looks. That’s because of, past karma. So like that just, our memory capacity, is also because of, past karma.
Now similar, by some, peculiar karma, some souls, may remember their, past lives. Now, I use the word, peculiar karma, because, it’s not always, pleasant. We may think, it’s sensational.
If I could remember, my past life, it would be so exciting. I’d go and meet those people, and talk with them. But actually, for the children, who go through it, they often have, identity crisis.
Who am I? Whose child am I? What am I actually? So, for this purpose, it’s important, that, in general, we understand, the rationale for forgetting. In exceptions, there will be remembrance. But, although the soul, can go from, one body to another body, one species, to another species also.
But, the transition, the, the transition, in consciousness, is enormous. And that transition, requires a wipe out, of the memories. Say for example, the soul, was in a, hog’s body.
And from there, say the soul, has come to human body. Now, the hog, finds, human excreta, irresistible. He rushes towards it.
Humans, find that same, object, intolerable. Now, it’s complete, not just difference, it’s opposite perception. So, for such, radically opposite perceptions, to happen, there has to be, almost thorough, memory blackout.
So that’s why, in general, the soul goes from, one species, to another species. There is, so much difference, in consciousness, that a memory blackout, is required. That’s why the soul, won’t remember, lives, in previous species, when they were, in a different species, in previous life, when they were, in a different species.
Yes, yes. Yeah. Hello, hello Dr. Ali.
First of all, thank you for the session, and the thought process. Well, what I wanted to ask was, related to, view on, whatever. As you rightly pointed out, it’s very easy, to prevent, underground mentalizations.
Like, you see, it was, many times with them, you and they, and we and so on. But, simultaneously, it is very difficult, to prevent, virtualizations. Because, the realisation is not like, a bit, but, in a lot of cases, I mean, a bit is like this.
So, how do you really, balance that, between, horizontal relationships, and vertical relationships? Yes. when horizontal relationships, are very easy to develop, and vertical relationships, are quite difficult. So, how do we balance both? So, that we can move towards, our ultimate goal.
Yeah. That’s why, we need, horizontal relationships, that assist our, vertical relationships. It’s not that, suddenly, one day we wake up, and we say, I love Krishna.
It doesn’t work out like that. So, it’s actually, by associating, with those, who have, devotion for Krishna, that is the, primary way, we can succeed. Sangat, bhakti, sanjayate, the 11th canto, of the Bhagavad Gita, that the association, of those who have, bhakti, we can find.
So, we, there are practises, such as, chanting the holy name, studying scriptures, worshipping the deities, doing puja, all these, they help us, to develop our, bhakti for Krishna. But, they, need, to be sustained, they are not, what we can do, all the time. And, we need to interact, with lot of people.
So, as much as possible, we form the, horizontal relationships, that assist our, vertical relationships. So, if we associate, with devotees, develop friend relationships, with devotees, and, we develop not, we, have friends, if we can, if our relatives and acquaintances, also become, spiritual minded, then, that can assist us. So, that way, the balance is, that, we give, due time, for directly, developing, our vertical relationship, by the appropriate, bhakti practises.
At the same time, we, also, try to make our, horizontal relationships, as favourable, as possible. That way, we can, get, whatever, connections of, connections, that we need, at the horizontal level, but, that sense of connection, at the horizontal level, will not cause, disconnection, at the vertical level. Did you answer your question? You can speak, I will repeat.
You said, in, the, lecture, truth is, remain, calculation, is based on, two aspects, desire, and, karma. So, if one, man, performs, karma, like animal, and desires, like animal, then, it is certain that, he will get the, birth in a lower, spiritual world. Right? So, getting a lower, spiritual world, is itself, a punishment.
So, what is the need of, health, in the beginning? Why do we go to, health? So, if a soul, by bad karma, gets a, lower body, that itself is a, karmic punishment. Why not go to health? No, there are different, kinds of, karmic reactions, which come in, different ways. So, we consider say, this is, this much is, 100 is the, karma stockpile.
So, out of which say, 30, we may get, in a lower body. 30, we may get, in health. And, the remaining 40, we may get in a, future human body.
Because, there are certain, kinds of, karmic reactions, they need to come, in particular, circumstances. So, that’s why, it’s not that the, suffering is replicated, rather, the, suffering is, distributed. So, the reactions are, distributed, some in lower species, some in health, and, some in a, future human body.
Yes, behind you. Do you know, your past life? So, do I know, my past life? As far as, say, some, recollections, are concerned, no, I never had any recollections, like that. So, that is no, paranormal one.
But, to some extent, our mind, is, a template, for understanding, who we were, and, who we will be. When, we go from, one body, to another, it is not, just, the soul, that goes. The soul, with the mind.
So, the soul, with the mind, that means, all of us, we, we have, certain, recollections. I was in, London, I was doing a talk, on the incarnation, and, for that, programme, two twins, had come to me. And, those two twins, they were, what is called, identical twins, or, in more scientific terminology, monozygotic twins.
That means, when the, sperm and the egg, unite, one, zygote is formed, and then, that one zygote, splits into two. And then, they are two. So, they are not just, similar, they are identical.
100% identical. And, yet, they are two, different persons. Now, why is that? So, it is because, although, genetically, they are identical, still, spiritually, they are distinct, they are individual.
So, their spiritual individuality, and, they have a mind, soul has come from, into that mind. So, their mind has, different intonations. So, one of them is extrovert, the other is introvert.
So, it is because, they are different. So, I have given this example, to illustrate that. So, there is no, biological reason, for being, such a radical difference, in personality, between these two people.
So, if somebody is introvert, in this life, that means, they can understand, in a broad way, that they must have cultivated, some introvert tendencies, in their previous life. Somebody is extrovert, in this life, that means, they have cultivated, that kind of tendencies. So, by broadly, looking at our mind, looking at our natural life, looking at our intonations, we can, get some, indication, of what, we were, in a previous life.
But, it is interesting that, although, as I said, we may feel, it is, it will be fascinating, if I know my previous life. But, without, philosophical understanding, it does not lead to, really, transformation. One of the, one of the celebrity cases, of reincarnation, which are not, included in my book, because it was a celebrity case.
There is basically, there was a, ship, Titanic, which was designed, one of the main designers, for that ship, was, a person named, Thomas Andrews. And, he was on the, board of Titanic, when it died. And then, he was blamed, for its faulty design.
And, this Thomas Andrews, reincarnated, as William Barthes. And, he, remembered, many precise, details, of how the, of, what all events, happened in the Titanic, and, not only that, he actually, explained, scientifically, how was it, that a ship, that was so, strongly designed, which, when it was made, was advertised, that a ship, that even God, can’t sink. Now, how did it sink? So, he explained that.
He said that, when he had been, testing the ship, at one time, he took a hammer, and just, hit it. And, when he hit it, at one point, a loud, resonance, happened. And, at some other points, he said, that resonance, didn’t happen, so much.
At some, specific points, it happened. And, he said that, this is too much. He said, we need to, thicken the hull, of the ship, so that, the resonance, will not happen.
But, other person, who was the main, financier, and more of the, black, he said, he said, no, we don’t have time for this, just forget it. And, then, that black, he survived, the titanic, sinking. And, he laid, the whole thing on, anchors.
So, William Barnes, he gave the whole thing, explaining, how titanic sank. And, from his facts, many neutral observers, concluded that, he was a reincarnation. But, why I am telling the, whole story is, that William Barnes, was asked, you know, so, if you are the reincarnation, of Thomas Andrews, what does it mean for you? He says, the mission of my life, is to clear the, good name of, Thomas Andrews.
There is no, spiritual inclination, at all. Oh, Thomas Andrews was maligned, I have to now, clear his good name. So, you know, whether we remember, our past lives, or not, that will not, transform our life, as much as, whether we, philosophically, assimilate, a spiritual conception, of life.
That’s why, if somebody remembers, the past life, that’s fine, but that’s not, as important as, whether we, truly understand, the meaning of life, in this life. So, any other questions? Yes, please. Good question.
So, sometimes, in a class, I deliberately, don’t answer the, point to check, whether somebody, will ask the question, or not. So, thank you, for getting, your attention. So, the question is, that, if the body is destroyed, then how do these, subjects, they get birth mark, in the next body? Basically, the link, between, this body, and the next body, is not just, the soul.
The soul is spiritual, but along with the soul, there is the mind, what is called, the subtle body. And, this, mind, it is the link, it is the, it is the connecting link, between, the spiritual, soul, and the physical, body. So, in the mind, shock, and an impact, and an impression, is created.
So, for example, a truck has, run over the, the truck ran, over my leg. So, when that impression, is created, especially, many past life, memories, are had, by subjects, who, have, died suddenly. Not all, but many.
And, especially, when it is sudden, violent death, then, the person, the person’s mind, does not have the time, to process the event, of death properly. And, even when the soul, goes from one body, to another body, at that time, because that, trauma, that impact, that impression, Oh, a truck ran over me. So, then, because of that, impression, whether the soul, enters into new world also, that, body, gets marked, because of the mind.
So, Stevenson also wrote a, paper called, Paranormal Modification, to Biological Form. That means, that he, gave several, statistical pieces, from other sources, not just past life, memories, where, a person’s thoughts, create marks, on their bodies. Say, a person thinks, I don’t know, this is a person.
So, for example, if, what to speak of, the same person, happens, so, if some Christians, they become, very deeply absorbed, in Jesus, then, on their bodies also, the marks appear, which appear, on Jesus’ body, when he was crucified. Or, some people, get very strongly, traumatised, they say, oh, some person, horror movie, and get traumatised, by that. Then, if some particularly, violent scene, had happened, on that, they’ve seen, the horror movie, and say, somebody was wounded, or something, their hand gets, distorted, and sometimes, some kind of distortion, happens on that.
So, the mind is very influential. In fact, it has also happened, that, when a mother, sees a horror movie, in which, say, a child is maimed, or a child is injured, then, impression, impacts the child’s body also. So, basically, the mind’s, impressions, make, they impress, themselves, on the body.
And, because the mind, has the impression, that this wound happened, over here, say, when the mind, goes to the next body also, it creates, some kind of distortion, some kind of, mark or effect, at that particular point, in the next body. Okay? One last question. So, thank you very much, for your kind attention.
I think I’m going to stop. We have,