Science believes in experiments – what does spirituality believe in?
From Keshavagopal Prabhu
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmLgmoD4NgQ
Transcript
Disclaimer: This transcript was generated using AI and may contain occasional errors or inaccuracies.
Hare Krishna. Question. Science believes in experiments.
What does spirituality believe in? Answer. Firstly, science doesn't believe only in experiments. Science, first of all, believes as an act of faith that there is an underlying order in the universe.
The things that happen in the external world are not just disorderly. Now, actually, this faith is almost akin to a theological faith because science doesn't question where the order has come from. Science assumes that there is order and then tries to understand that order.
So, Newton observed the fruit falling and he wondered why the fruit fell. So, now the question why the fruit fell means, assume that there is an answer to this question and that answer indicates that there is some, the existence of answer indicates the assumption, faith-based assumption that there is an underlying order in the universe which can be understood by investigation, analysis, theorizing, experimentation, the various methods of science. But the important point is that it is simplistic to say that science believes only in experiments.
Science, first of all, believes in the existence of a rational order in the universe and then it uses experiments to find out, to confirm whether the explanations which it has come up about, so that means that science assumes there is an order in the universe. Then it comes up with some explanations, some theories, some laws, some equations for that order and then whether those theories are correct or not, they are tested using experiments. So, Newton assumed that there is some law, something in nature which causes the fruit to fall.
Then he postulated it was the law of gravity and then he did experiments, others did experiments and they consistently found that yes, the postulates of the law of gravity do seem to be universal, at least in our observation and therefore they concluded it's a law. So, now if some future experiments come up which counter it, then Newton's law of gravity will have to be contextualized and that's what happened when, that's why it led to the development of relativity for vast objects and to quantum physics for fundamental particles. Newton's laws of motion and other laws don't exactly apply in that domain over there as they apply in classical physics as it was thought originally.
So, now coming to spirituality, what does it believe in? Essentially, it believes in the same things that science believes in. Firstly, it believes that there is an order in the universe. Now, science unfortunately reduces that order to the order in material things because science largely studies material things.
So, now spirituality extends that and says that the order exists not only in the pattern of interaction of material things but there is an order that encompasses matter and consciousness. So, how we behave also has reactions and that takes us to the law of karma and then spirituality also goes, science focuses on the order in nature and it assumes that there is order but spirituality also asks the question, okay, what is the source of that order and then we come to the understanding of a super intelligent designer who has made that order, who is sustaining that order and that the Bhagavad Gita reveals to be God. So, now that means the same rational mode of investigation when limited only to the sphere of matter leads to the developments of material science which give us a fragmented view of reality.
As many Nobel laureate scientists have pointed out that science worldview does not answer questions about life. Even Einstein himself said that actually, Einstein said that technology can often become like a weapon in the hands of a madman. So, we can talk about the moral, the moral basis of science but we cannot talk about a scientific basis of morality.
So, there are questions science doesn't answer because science frame of study is limited. So, science doesn't talk about issues like pain and pleasure, beauty and ugliness and happiness and sorrow, it doesn't talk about these things and these bring meaning to our life. So, spirituality expands the same dome, same attitude of assuming that there is a rational order in the universe of trying to understand that order and then doing experiments to verify that order.
So, now but it expands the frame to include all of reality and so then we come to the understanding that there is a person who is supervising all this, who is overseeing all this, who has set it all up and then what is the theory that actually we are also meant to be in harmony with that person and when we are in harmony then we experience non-material enrichment, we experience a deep inner fulfillment and of course there is a whole process. Bhakti yoga is a stepwise process which is scientific in its systematic delineation and its experiential verification. So, now here when we talk about what does spirituality believe in terms of the third stage, we accept that there is a rational order, then we try to understand what is that order.
So, God has given us a scripture where he reveals that order to us and then now how do we verify whether that order is right? For that we have to experience. Now, when we study matter, we are conscious matter is unconscious. So, therefore, we can to some extent control matter and that's why we can do controlled experiments on matter but when we want to understand God and we understand the spiritual dimension of life then God is above us.
So, we can't control God and do controlled experiments on him rather we have to let him control us and then see the positive change that happens in us. So, bhakti yoga is also an experiment, it's a scientific experiment but rather than it being a controlled experiment in the sense of we controlling others, it's a controlled experiment in the sense that we subject ourselves to the control of God and this transforms our consciousness, it frees us from undesirable habits, unhealthy passions and negative emotions and it brings out the positivity within us, it brings out virtuous qualities and it brings out the best within us and it makes us happy and gives us a profound fulfillment and there is in the scriptures described step-by-step processes by which how this purification happens in from 1.2.6 to 22 in the Bhagavatam it is described stages and then further this is elaborated in Bhakti Samrit Sindhu the ninth season of bhakti and this is further elaborated by Vishwanath Chaturthi Thakur in his Madhurya Kadambani. So, the point is there are systematic stages and there are experiences.
So, spirituality is an experiential science but if we just simply consider only the experiential science then it may seem very subjective and unscientific. Oh, different people claim that they have seen God or they have had some experiences. No, it's not just experiential, there's a whole profound worldview within which those experiences are placed.
So, the philosophy gives us the understanding of that worldview and then when we do the experiments on ourselves then we get the experiences that help us confirm the truths that are talked about in the scripture. So, in that sense spirituality and science are much more similar than dissimilar as often thought to be. The main difference is that science restricts itself to the study of matter whereas spirituality encompasses the whole of reality and science involves studying external things by controlling them.
Spirituality involves studying ourselves, knowing ourselves by controlling ourselves and thereby preparing our consciousness to perceive higher reality. Now, this controlling ourselves, it may say why do I have to control myself? But the point is that when attention is fixed on one thing it goes away from other things. So, normally our attention is caught in material things and as long as it is caught in material things we can't perceive spiritual reality.
Just like a person who's too caught up in watching the TV loses track of what is around him in the room. Similarly, when we are too caught up in material things then we can't perceive spiritual reality. So, the controlled experiment on ourselves which will give us spiritual experiences is simply meant to decrease our infatuation with matter and thereby open ourselves to perceiving spiritual reality, the spiritual side of life, perceiving, to experiencing, to verifying the spiritual side of life.
So, in that sense the experiences are systematic, verifiable and repeatable. We're not just talking about supernatural claims, somebody saying I saw God, I had experience of God. No, it's a systematic process of purification that has happened with thousands of people all over the world and it can happen with us also where our lower cravings, lower habits go away, our higher qualities and virtues manifest and we experience non-material enrichment that can be seen in the fact that we no longer feel the need for undesirable, unwholesome, external pleasures.
So, in that sense the experiences are an integral part of a whole world view that is profoundly rational, intelligible and intellectually satisfying. Thank you.