Scripture is a torch to see the world a mirror to see the self and a window to see God

[Talk to IIT Kharagpur students at Kharagpur, India]

Transcript

This is an AI-generated transcript and may contain some errors.
I’m grateful to be here amongst all of you today morning. And I’ll speak on the topic of scriptural knowledge, how it helps us. So, I’ll talk in three terms.
Scriptural knowledge as a flashlight for the world, as a mirror for the self, and as a window to God. In the Bhagavad Gita, in the 16th chapter, Krishna says in the 24th verse that तस्माज्शास्त्रं प्रमाणं ते कार्याकार्य विवस्तितं घ्यान्वाशास्त्र विधानोक्तं कर्मकर्तुम् इभाधः सेविधी He says, therefore, with Shastra, with scriptural knowledge, understand how one should act in life. So, basically, in existence, there are three principles.
The Upanishads talk about तत्वत्रै तत्वत्रै is there is matter, there is consciousness, and there is a source. So, in Sanskrit, these can be referred to by the alliterative जगत, जीव and जगतिष् जगत is the world around, is matter. जीव is the consciousness, the self, that which is observing matter.
And there is जगतिष् So, now, what does scripture do? It offers a flashlight to see the जगत, to see the world in a new light. And it offers a mirror to see the जीव, to help us to understand ourselves. And it helps us, it’s a window to see God.
So, let’s look at all these three one by one. Often, there is sometimes perceived a conflict between scientific knowledge and spiritual knowledge. So, yesterday I talked elaborately about the strengths and the limitations of science.
Today I will focus on scripture. So, in scripture, we have scriptural knowledge has a purpose. Every system of knowledge, it has a particular purpose.
Say, before this class started, anybody came and told me, please speak in simple English. So, now, it’s not that I am conscious that I speak in difficult English. So, I told him that, I’ll just speak, if you find anything difficult, tell me, I’ll repeat it.
So, the point is, there is a medium of communication. And when communication is done, it is done for a particular purpose. So, I am not giving an incidental.
The purpose of this class is not to speak in a particular level of English. The purpose is not to strictly adhere to or defy the rules of English grammar. The purpose is to communicate some spiritual knowledge.
And while communicating spiritual knowledge, yes, a certain level of language is spoken, a certain vocabulary is used, that is incidental. Now, that incidental also matters. That if, say the English is of a level which audience doesn’t understand, then it’s a problem.
But English is not the primary subject of the discussion. Every discussion, every, just as there is a talk, similarly there is a book. The book has a purpose.
And there is a central purpose and there is an incidental other things involved. The language, the purpose, what is, what is the subject being discussed over here, that is spiritual knowledge. Similarly, when we study scripture, the purpose of scripture is not to give us material knowledge.
Scripture gives us material knowledge also, but that is incidental. Central, when Arjuna is in the middle of the two backgrounds, he is overwhelmed. He is in between the two armies.
He is standing between the two armies and he wants to see who are the opponents. And then they start speaking. They start speaking.
I want to know what is dharma. So, it’s a very unlikely setting for a person to have a philosophical discussion. To understand how unlikely it is, say now this cricket champions trophy is going on.
Suppose the final match is there and say two top rivals, maybe India-Pakistan rivalries almost meet it now, India-Australia or India-England whatever. So, two top rivals are there and there are thousands of spectators in the stadium. The fielders are set.
The bowler is about to start the run-up and then at that time the batsman striker who calls the non-striker and both of them come in the middle of the pitch and they start talking and they keep talking and they keep talking and they keep talking. How everybody is mad. What is going on? Come on, it’s a time for action.
Sometimes there are some players who resort to what is called gamesmanship means that they try to use some underhanded means by which you break the tempo of the other team. Say the other team is winning then you know ask for injury break or just slow things down so that their rhythm gets disturbed. So, now if the striker or the non-striker they are known to be very good players, honest players, they are not likely to resort to gamesmanship.
Then just the very fact that when thousands of people are waiting to watch the match means it must be something very serious. So, something similar happens. Thousands of soldiers are assembled and they are not there just as spectators they are participants.
They are there to play the match. So, the conches are blown that means the task has already been done and they have already taken out their weapons and they start playing. So, the fielding is set, the ballers run up and suddenly Krishna and Arjuna stop the match.
So, what is it that they talk about? So, Arjuna says I want to know what is Dharma? What is Dharma? What is the right course of action for me Krishna? Please tell me. So, now after the Bhagavad Gita is spoken Arjuna fights the war and he wins the war. Now did Arjuna win the war with the knowledge of the Bhagavad Gita or with the knowledge of archery that he had acquired from Dronacharya and others? It’s a question.
Did Arjuna win the war with the knowledge of the Bhagavad Gita or with the knowledge of archery? Yes? Archery? Yes, good. That’s one answer. Any other answers? As some of you said both.
Krishna is not asked by Arjuna any question about archery. How to shoot this arrow? How to use this astra? How to hit this target? That knowledge is different. So, the spiritual is not the replacer of the material.
The spiritual is the director of the material. The knowledge of the Bhagavad Gita gave Arjuna a direction about how to use what he had acquired throughout his life. So, scripture may give material knowledge but the Bhagavad Gita does not give Arjuna knowledge about archery.
Bhagavad Gita is answering one question. Please tell me what is Dharma? So, if you understand the purpose of scripture similarly if you consider Bhagavad Gita understanding what is Dharma? What is Dharma? The Bhagavad Gita is more specific. The driving question of the Bhagavad Gita is what is the Dharma of a person who is about to die? And in Ramayana its driving question is what are the characteristics of an ideal person? Is there a person who has such ideal characteristics? So, each book which is there in our sacred canon and we need to keep that driving purpose in mind.
Otherwise, incidental details that are there we just get caught in that. Yes, they can also be fascinating. Say some of you is very interested in English and then you observe what is the vocabulary level of the speaker and if they use some interesting word that also interests but the point is if you find an interesting word and take out a phone and start looking at your phone for the meaning of that word they forget the whole class.
No, vocabulary is meant to help us understand the central message. If you want to study vocabulary there are separate classes for that there are separate books for that. So, like that in scriptural study there is a central message of scripture and along with that the perception of a conflict between science and scripture comes when we misunderstand the purpose of scripture and the purpose of science.
Science is not giving us spiritual knowledge. Science gives us operational knowledge about how to function in this world. Scripture gives us knowledge about the ultimate questions.
So, science and scripture deal largely speaking with different domains of knowledge and that’s why if somebody positions scripture as a competitor to science those who position scripture as a competitor to science they actually devalue scripture. Scripture is giving us higher knowledge. Knowledge about who am I? What is the purpose of my life? What is the ultimate purpose of the world? This is knowledge that science cannot give us.
So, we have been trying to come up with correlations about how material things function in this world and that’s very valuable but that has its limitation. So, it’s like if I have a fishing net and a fishing net has a hole of say one inch by one inch. Now, I can cast the fishing net for a hundred years in a lake that is filled with fish but I will never catch any fish in that lake.
Why? Because that net is meant for a particular purpose and fish net is smaller than the size of the hole in the net. It will slip out. So, similarly science casts a net at this world to acquire knowledge about it but the net it casts focusses on acquiring material knowledge.
To acquire, science looks for in its own language natural explanations Last year I was in Cambridge and we passed by that while I was going to Cambridge University to speak on science and spirituality. There we passed by that tree where Newton is said to have seen the fruit falling. Now, Newton himself believed in God but when he saw the fruit falling he used to say God made this fruit fall.
That’s a valid explanation but that is not what science is focussing on. Okay, God made the fruit fall but how did God make the fruit fall? What is the loop by which it happened? What is the natural explanation for it? What is the material phenomenon material mechanism that is explaining it? So, that’s why the two are not contradictory. The two are complementary.
There is an explanation that God is the ultimate cause of all causes but how is that cause happening? It is happening through a particular instrument that is material mechanism of gravity. So, science looks at this world it’s a torch which helps us to see the ultimate elements. Now, scripture also puts a torch on this world and shows us this world but it shows us this world is connection with its ultimate purpose.
That is the speciality of scriptural knowledge that the torch light which it shows on the world it may illuminate the material phenomenon also but the purpose is what is life like? What is the purpose of life? So, within the scientific community there is a conflict. The conflict is that in this world if you study it carefully there are lots of signs which are indicative of precise design. So, for example, if the earth had been a little closer to the sun it would have been too hot for life as we know to exist.
If it had been a little further away from the sun it would have been too cold for life as we know to exist. Now, if our moon the moon the satellite revolving around the moon is significantly large and the presence of that satellite is a part of the set of factors that causes the axis of the earth to tilt and the axis of the earth being tilted at a particular angle is what enables seasons to happen and it is because as seasons are there that vegetation grows again life is possible. So, if the moon had been of a slightly different size or if the earth had been tilted at a slightly different degree again life would not be possible.
So, the point which I am making here is that on one side we see design but on the other side we see suffering in this world. So many people fall sick in so many ways people grow old people get diseased people do so many terrible things and then ultimately we die. So, now those who are theists they point to the point to the features of design in the world and they say therefore there must be a God and atheists point to all the suffering in the world and say therefore there cannot be God.
How can there be a God if you allow so much suffering? How can there be a good God if you allow so much suffering? In fact, I was in Britain and Britain is probably one of the most aggressively atheistic countries in the world right now. There are others also but Britain also. So, there one atheistic philosopher has made a made a court case to declare belief in God as immoral.
What is the logic? He says believe if you believe in a good God there is a gravity of suffering that people are going through in this world. People are suffering so much and when people are suffering so much you say there is a good God. You are actually minimising decrying the suffering of people.
Now, what he doesn’t understand is that the two are not irreconcilable because either we see only the suffering or we see the design but it is scripture that helps us to see the world in the light of the purpose of the world. See, to evaluate anything as good or bad without considering its purpose is by that we can fault any design. Say for example, if I take over a phone and I start typing my next book on my phone now it will be so messy.
I use one finger even if I use swipe typing still it’s very different from typing on a proper keyboard with a computer and then when I start finding the phone to open the phone very difficult I start cursing what stupid designer of the phone they made typing so difficult over here and the phone is not meant for typing a book the phone is meant primarily for communication additionally you can send some messages you can type some things so if I want to fault the design of the phone if I divorce the design from the purpose then any design can be faulted. So we have to see the design in the light of the purpose and scripture tells us what is the purpose of this world purpose of this world so the light that scripture shows us on this world is it helps us understand what is the purpose so in a verse in the Bhagavad Gita Krishna says in 8.15 so he says that those who worship me do not come back to this world which is a place of misery which is temporary but they attain my eternal abode now here there are three important things in this verse first is it is telling us about the nature of this world and this is a place of misery now one of the senior scholars in our movement who I met in Philadelphia last year this year also he was selling he had read many books on eastern spirituality and they were all telling you do this you will become happy actually you are happy you are just not realising you are happy now everything is wonderful then when he came to when he read the Bhagavad Gita for the first time he said this world is a place of misery he said at last somebody is speaking the truth because we all experience distress this is a fact of life at last somebody is telling this world is a place of distress so scripture matches with our experience of reality but at the same time the purpose of scripture is not to perpetuate misery at the start of the Bhagavad Gita Arjuna is in tears he is overwhelmed thinking how can I fight with my relatives now Krishna does not tell Arjuna Arjuna you are dukkhi now you realise this world is dukkhalayam stay dukkhi if you are miserable stay miserable because misery is the nature of this world see misery is a feature of this world misery is not the purpose of this world misery is there in this world it is a feature but it is not the purpose so Krishna tells that this world is dukkhalayam but it is almost like an incidental fact what Krishna stresses those who practise bhakti they will go out of this world they will attain maya bhakti so to understand these two together to understand how there can be desire in this world and how there can be suffering in this world we need the right metaphor and that metaphor is a metaphor of a hospital in a hospital there is suffering but the hospital is not designed to cause suffering the hospital’s purpose is to heal suffering similarly now how will the healing happen not automatically but the physician who operates with the doctor and takes the treatment and that is what Krishna is telling us also Krishna is saying if you practise my bhakti you will go beyond the misery of this world and ultimately you will go beyond this world by the end of the Bhagavad Gita Arjuna is composed ashtamohasmate labdha patprasadamaya achyutam sitausmigatasandeha karishevachinantara 18.73 he says determination is installed now I will move your way so the message of the Bhagavad Gita helps Arjuna to regain his morale and this means that actually scripture gives us a different way of seeing the world if we see this world as a place of pleasure or a place where we will get pleasure we just do a few adjustments then we stay in the misery but scripture says that this world is like a hospital and we treat ourselves so scripture gives us a flashlight by which we can see the world in the proper light sometimes people ask that you know dad I was in Australia and Melbourne and then one devotee Mataji she asked this question I am chanting Hare Krishna so seriously but still I am getting so much suffering in my life so why is that so I explained that actually you are realising the truth of scripture see for a if you don’t have a philosophical understanding scripture is not the light with which we are seeing the world when we think I have problems and God will solve my problems and if my problems are not being solved what is the use of worshipping God so this is faith at a cultural level it is good to have faith cultural faith means but the Bhagavad Gita offers us not just cultural faith so there is cultural faith there is philosophical faith and there is spiritual faith so philosophical faith means what we understand that yes scripture tells us that this world is a place of misery and now I am experiencing misery that means what scripture says is true therefore the experience of misery rather than causing doubt it actually increases faith because what I say is scripture is true but then scripture doesn’t just say oh this world is miserable stay miserable no scripture tells us that the other half of scriptural teaching the other half is that if we take shelter on Krishna we take shelter on Krishna and we can transcend misery mat-chit-taha-sarve-durgaani mat-prasada-tare-shasi Krishna says if you become conscious of me you will pass over all obstacles by my grace this means that Krishna is not saying you stay miserable if you take shelter of me you will transcend misery say if it is very hot and we are tormented by the heat and then we come to an air conditioned room immediately we feel relief we feel comfort it’s still hot there outside here we feel relief so like that outside is the problem filled world but when we become conscious of Krishna we are entering an air conditioned room we will experience happiness experience relief so for a devotee for a person who has philosophical faith when they experience misery they think now I have experienced one side of scripture to be true that this world is a place of misery the other side of scriptural teaching is that by taking shelter of Krishna we can transcend misery let me see if that is true and then the devotee takes even more shelter of Krishna and then we experience relief so scripture shows us that this world has two purposes that at one level we can experiment various ways to enjoy I am really frustrated by those enjoyments so experimentation and redirection I try this, I try that I try hundred things for enjoying they don’t give me enjoyment then I redirect my heart towards Krishna I become absorbed in Krishna and there we get relief so there are many specific details about the world but what scripture thrusts is it uses these two understandings this world is like a hospital so we can try various things to enjoy but when we decide I don’t know, I want to connect with Krishna that is the way to real happiness then the scripture offers us facility to redirect our heart towards Krishna so Prahlad Maharaj says that यस्मान्प्रियाप्रियवियोगसैन्योगजन्मचोकाव्धिनासकलयोणिषुधायमाना दुखहुष्यधं तदपिदुखमतद्याहम् भुमान्ब्रह्मामिवदमेथवदास्योगम् says my dear lord I have just been wandering in this world trying to avoid misery and trying to get pleasure the Priya, that which is dear I am trying to get it and that which is a Priya that is unpalatable I am trying to avoid but unfortunately I am getting the unpalatable and I am not getting the palatable and this way I am miserable but worst is sometimes when I get the palatable that also doesn’t satisfy me that also gives a little satisfaction and that also causes frustration therefore I dear lord I have decided to stop doing all this please instruct me how can I serve you वदमेथवदास्योगम् please instruct me how I can serve you lord so scripture helps us to see light see the world with this light that it is meant and second is scripture acts as a mirror for the self so often when we go in front of a mirror we may see is my hair proper is my dress proper so a mirror is what helps us to look at ourselves a mirror helps us to simply see our body it doesn’t help us to see ourselves scripture is the mirror by which we learn to see ourselves यत्रोपरमतेचित्तम्दिरुद्धं योगसेवन यत्रचैवात्मनाप्मानं पश्यनात्मनितुष्यति सुखमात्यन्तिकं यत्तदुद्धीग्राहिमतेद्रियं वेद्धीयत्रनचैवायं स्थितश्चलित्तक्वतः so in 6.21, 22, 23, 24 Krishna talks about a state of samadhi where one is absorbed in the supreme he says, what happens यत्रोपरमतेचित्तम्दिरुद्धं योगसेवन the consciousness is always moving outwards I want this, I want this then here one ātmā means the mind the other ātmā means the soul so with the mind turned inwards one can see the soul पशनात्मनितुष्यति when we see like this we see आत्मनितुष्यति we rejoice in the self सुखमात्यन्तिकम्यत्तत् at that time the ultimate happiness is experienced how is it experienced बुद्धिग्रहयं अतिन्द्रियं it is experienced with the बुद्धि अतिन्द्रियं, beyond the senses we don’t see the senses we see something beyond the senses वेत्तियत्रणचयिमायं having seen this तितश्चलिंद वद्धः one will never depart from the truth once one has got this realisation so a mirror to see the self this means that scripture gives us the process gives us the purification by which we can see ourselves now all of us have certain self conceptions about ourselves so we may think I am very clever or we may think I don’t speak so fluently I look so good I don’t look all that good we all have certain self conceptions about ourselves and many of these self conceptions some of them they bloat our ego some other self conceptions they limit us I can’t do this, I can’t do that I am like this so we all acquire certain self conceptions and they are the mirror with which we see ourselves so suppose somebody looks very good but they are looking at themselves in a mirror that is distorted and they will say what happened, why am I looking so terrible so even a good looking person will look terrible if the mirror is dirty, if the mirror is distorted so all of us have a mirror with which we look at ourselves we have certain self conceptions presently our mirror is distorted the primary distortion is about what is the source of our happiness what is the source of our security what is the basis of our identity so in this mirror when we see ourselves we think I need this, without this I can’t be happy I need this, without this I can’t be happy I need money, I need this, I need that now we may need those things functionally money is what we live with money is not what we live for what we live with is the means of living what we live for is the purpose of living so when we have a materialistic self conception when the mirror it shows us it makes us think depending how much money I am earning that good a person I am so what this materialistic mirror it makes us equate our net worth with our self worth it makes us think as much as my salary that much I am worth now yes how much we are earning that matters at a functional level but that doesn’t determine who we are our self worth is determined by who we are it is not determined by what we possess how much is in our bank balance so a materialistic self conception or the materialistic world view it distorts our self conception and no matter how much we have materialistic self conception will always keep us dissatisfied even if I have a lot I will always look at someone who has something more and I will stay dissatisfied so the scripture gives us a mirror by which we understand ourselves for who we are we understand that I am a soul the soul is a part of the whole the soul is Krishna the soul is Sanchitamanda I just have to realise my joyful nature I just have to direct my consciousness towards Krishna we understand that we are indestructible nothing in this world no matter how devastating it can even scratch us leave alone destroy us when we understand this the mirror of scripture by which we see ourselves it calms us it clarifies our self understanding it actually gives us inner satisfaction if we are internally satisfied then no matter how much we have or how little we have we will be satisfied if you are not internally satisfied if you are craving for external things then no matter how much we have we will not be satisfied why? because the materialistic mirror is distorted in a particular way say this floor is inclined and this floor is inclined like this then if the floor is inclined like this if I put water on it by default it will flow in this direction even if I don’t want it to flow in that direction by not wanting I am not going to change it why because see intention is no cure for inclination my intention is water should flow that way but if the inclination is this way the water is going to flow this way so similarly lobha pravatarambha karmanam samaspruha rajaseetani jayante yurudhe kuru nathana in 14.12 the Bhagavad Gita Krishna says that a characteristic of the materialistic vision of the mode of passion is lobha lobha is greed greed basically means we see what we have we see what we don’t have in every situation we can see what are the things we have we can see what are the things we don’t have to the extent we see that which is going wrong in our life to that extent we will be dissatisfied but the point is this is not simply an intellectual exercise people say count your blessings and we have it yes it’s a good advice but when our mind will not let us count our blessings it will make us count our lackings now what we don’t have you have got good marks no but he has got more marks you have got a you have got a job that is paying this no but he has got a job that is paying more so what happens when the materialistic world view is there our consciousness becomes inclined in a particular way our emotions similarly our consciousness our thoughts they flow towards the things which we don’t have and thus we always feel deprived we are always dissatisfied so scripture gives us a mirror which removes this distortion it helps us to see ourselves for who we really are and then later scripture says if I am in this room then there are walls all around I cannot see what is outside but if there is window through that window I can see the sky over there this seems to be a rural area where is it? so a window gives us a facility to see what is outside so we at present although we are spiritual beings we are caught in material consciousness and because we are caught in material consciousness we can at present only see material things we cannot see spiritual things so God is spiritual being so how do we see him? Bhagavata explains that by understanding God’s presence in this world Arjuna asks Krishna in the 10th chapter of the Gita Krishna says Krishna says how can I think of you while I am observing the objects of this world and interacting with objects of this world so Krishna says Krishna says Krishna says that which is opulent, anything which is especially attractive in this world, Krishna says it manifests as far as my splendour. So, whenever we see anything attractive, the spirituality is not meant to deny, it is not meant for denying our experience of reality, it is meant for deepening our experience of reality.
So, you know, eat some food, it is delicious. Now, we are not meant to say that it is not delicious, it is we are experiencing the delicious. The illusion is to think, if I just eat more and more and more of this, I will be happy.
Now, if somebody looks beautiful, we are not meant to say they don’t look beautiful, they look beautiful. But if I think this beauty is the source of happiness for me, that is an illusion. This beauty, this taste, it manifests a spark, a spark of Krishna’s all-encompassingness.
So, if we are cold or if we are in dark and we see a spark, the spark gives some light, some warmth. But the spark cannot show us the way, the spark cannot remove the coldness. So, like that, nothing attractive in this world can actually satisfy our search for happiness.
But there are attractive things in this world and we don’t have to deny their attractiveness. What we have to be careful about is that the attractive objects of this world don’t become competitors to God. Now, this is so attractive, why do I need God? I have so much money, I have so much power, I have such a beautiful partner, I have such intelligence, why do I need God? All these things are valuable, all these things are attractive.
But Krishna says where does this attractiveness come from? It comes from a spark of his lender. So, the attractive objects of this world, they are meant to be pointers to God, not competitors to God. They are meant to be pointers to God, not competitors to God.
So, Vishnu Prabhupada in a lecture he says that suppose somebody is an alcoholic and he just cannot give up drinking alcohol. Prabhupada says then you think that the taste of alcohol is Krishna. You know, and by thinking like this, by thinking about Krishna, one day that person will become a great drinker.
Now, Prabhupada is not saying by drinking alcohol they will become a great drinker. He is saying that alcohol, what is the taste coming from? Where is this irresistible taste coming from? It is coming from Krishna. So, that is manifesting a spark of Krishna’s taste.
So, everything attractive comes from Krishna. But everything attractive doesn’t take us to Krishna. So, we have to select those manifestations which take us to Krishna.
When I was in Australia, I was asked a question that if God wants us to do good things, the right thing, then why are there so many wrong options in this world? The right options are so few, the wrong options are so many. Actually, I answered that is how it is in any multiple choice exam. In any multiple choice exam, say 5 out of 10, 4 are wrong, only 1 is right.
Now, the student can make a court case against the teacher. You get 4 wrong options, the probability of getting a right option is only 20%. And if passing mark is 40, then you have rigged the system by which I am going to fail.
So, this is match fixing, exam fixing. The problem with that argument is that the answer is not to be determined by probability. Isn’t it? The teacher has given education, the student is expected to have studied the subject.
And then the student is supposed to select the answer not by guesswork, but by study. So, similarly, yes, in this world there are many wrong options. Why? Because this world is a reflection of our desires.
Most people have materialistic desires and that’s why there are so many materialistic options for enjoyment. Now, but along with that, Krishna gives knowledge in the Bhagavad Gita. That we are all meant to learn to love him, to become absorbed in him, to attain him.
And the attractive objects of this world are meant to be pointers to him, not competitors to him. So, when we understand this, then yes, the objects of this world are attractive. But instead of picking those options, we pick Krishna as the option.
We move closer to Krishna. So, if we understand this window of looking at the world. Yes, we come to the temples and we take darshan of the Lord, the altar, etc.
But most of the time we are going to function in this world. And there will be objects which attract us. So, rather than getting captivated by these attractive objects, rather than thinking that these alone will give me happiness, we see where is this attractiveness coming from? It is actually coming from Krishna.
So, if this object is so attractive, how much more attractive will Krishna be? And thinking like this, we can direct our attraction towards Krishna. We can become absorbed in Krishna. You may feel, I don’t feel absorbed in Krishna right now.
Yes, that’s fine. But there is a process to develop that attraction. That process is Bhakti Yoga.
So, when we practise the process of Bhakti Yoga, we chant the holy name, we study scripture, we associate with devotees, we render seva, we do puja, then by that we all become purified. Our attraction gets redirected from the part we know. And it is this process of redirecting our heart in the world to Krishna that is the central gift of scripture.
It is the central gift that Krishna Prabhupada presented. If you read Krishna Prabhupada’s books, he has commented so much in so many different books. But there is, in the variety of the subjects that are covered in scripture, there is consistency of purpose in Krishna Prabhupada’s commentaries.
He focusses, always reminding us of the central purpose of scripture. We redirect our heart towards Krishna. And to the extent we keep that purpose in mind and we apply that purpose, then even in this world, even when we are under its problems, we can experience relief.
We can experience that the remembrance of Krishna, the service to Krishna shelters us. It raises us above the stresses and the stresses of the world. It enables us to find relief in Krishna.
So scripture helps us to understand that whenever things are going wrong in life, actually they are wrong only from our perspective. There is a higher plan going on. And by that higher plan, things will work out right.
The materialistic world view, if you look at the world and ourselves, through that flashlight of material knowledge, in all that we see two options. Things are in control or things are out of control. But scriptural knowledge gives us a third option.
Things that are out of my control are not out of my control. They are in Krishna’s control. And he will work them out well.
When the patient is sick, sometimes the patient feels good, sometimes the patient feels bad. But if there is a proper treatment going on, the patient is under control. Although the patient may still be feeling bad, the doctor knows there is a treatment and the patient will be healed by that treatment.
And that way actually we can stay composed, stay purposeful, stay focused no matter whatever life sends our way. This is the gift of scripture to give us direction, to give us composure, to give us confidence in marching through life, knowing that Krishna is with us. And under with his shelter we can pass through all problems.
So I will summarise. I spoke today on the topic of seeing scripture as a torchlight to see the world, as a mirror to see the self and as a window to see God. So as a flashlight to see the world.
The Bhagavad Gita is not giving knowledge about Archery to Arjuna. So the scriptural knowledge, the spiritual knowledge in scripture that is not a replacer of material knowledge. It is a director of material knowledge.
So Arjuna, he did not stop in the middle of a battlefield to ask about how to shoot someone or how to shoot a particular arrow. It was not like in a world cup final a batsman stopping the match just so that he could learn some new tricks about how to bat. Something much more fundamental was going on.
What is the right thing to do? So the knowledge of dharma. So in scripture there will be material knowledge also. But that is incidental.
Just like when a person is speaking philosophy, there will be particular vocabulary, particular language level that is used. That is also a matter of interest but that is incidental. Central thing is the message that is given.
Similarly scripture’s message is what is the right thing to do? What is dharma? What is the correct way to act? Mahabharata’s driving question is what is dharma? Mahabharata’s driving question is what is dharma of a person about to die? Ramayana’s driving question is what are the characteristics of ideal person? So if you position scripture as a competitor to science, that means we see science, scripture, material knowledge, we see the contradiction and we get obsessed with that. Then we devalue scripture. Science can give us operational knowledge, scripture gives us transcendental knowledge, ultimate knowledge of the life’s purpose.
So science casts a net for catching knowledge but it is like a fishing net in which small fish will slip away. So like that science looks for material expression for material phenomena and non-material truths will slip away from it. So from the materialistic perspective, we can see the design in the world and say god exists.
We can see the suffering in the world and say god doesn’t exist. But the appropriateness of the design has to be seen in the light of the purpose. So this world is like a hospital.
There is suffering but suffering is not a purpose. It is a fact. And the purpose is to heal us of suffering.
Krishna tells Arjuna this world is dukkhal, but he also gives the process of bhakti by which Arjuna and all of us can become relieved of misery. So when we face misery, if our faith is simply cultural, we think oh god doesn’t help me, what is the use of worshipping god? But if our faith is philosophical, then we will understand that scripture says this world is a place of misery. I am experiencing it to be true.
That means scripture says it is the right thing. And the second thing that scripture says is that by taking shelter of Krishna we can get relief from misery. Let me see why that is true also.
And how do we get relief from misery? Just like if it is hot and we come to the air-conditioned room. So like that our mind gets agitated by so many problems. If we fix it on Krishna, he will come.
So scripture helps us to see the world in the light of its ultimate purpose which is experimentation and redirection. We enjoy various things as per our fancy. The world provides us facilities.
But then once we understand, no, this is not going to lead to happiness. Then we redirect our heart towards Krishna. And the world provides a facility for that also.
Scripture offers a mirror to the self. A physical mirror only shows our body. But we all have a conceptual mirror.
Our own conceptions about ourselves. And a materialistic world view often gives us conceptions that are dissatisfying. It equates our self-worth with our net worth.
And just as water that is inclined to the floor that is inclined, water will flow in that direction. So even if we say I want to think positively, I want to be grateful, the materialistic world view, we will keep seeing things that have gone wrong. We will keep seeing things that we don’t have.
And we will stay dissatisfied. But scripture gives us a mirror by which we see ourselves for who we really are. We are souls.
We are parts of Krishna. We are indestructible. We are by our nature joyful.
We just have to practise the process by which we realise it. So in this way, the distortion that happens by materialism or the self-conception that is corrected by the scriptural mirror. It helps us to see ourselves for who we are.
And then scripture is also a window to God. The attractive objects of this world, we don’t have to say that they are not attractive. But we have to be careful that we don’t think they themselves are the source of pleasure.
So spiritual knowledge is not meant for denying our experience of reality. It is meant for deepening our experience. Yes, we see them as attractive.
But see that this is a spark. It cannot provide me adequate warmth or light. If the spark is so attractive, how much will the whole be attractive? The whole has to become redirected to the whole.
The objects of this world should be competitors to Krishna. They should be pointers to Krishna. So there are many wrong options in this world.
But they are like the wrong options in multiple choice exam. If the students study, they can choose the right option. If we study scriptural knowledge, then we will get attracted to the attractive objects.
We will stay focused on becoming attracted to Krishna. By the process of bhakti, we can increase our attraction to Krishna. The more there is connection between our consciousness and Krishna, the more the attraction to Krishna will be awakened.
And with that attraction, we can experience satisfaction even in this world. The scripture world view helps us to navigate the life journey. Rather than becoming worried when things are going wrong, we just don’t see things are in control or out of control.
We see that things are out of control, the system of Krishna is in control. And thus we can stay faithful and march through life. Can I conclude with one thought that in scripture we understand that when we are down to nothing, when things are going wrong and we are down to nothing, Krishna is up to something.
So what that something is, will be revealed when we practise bhakti study. Thank you very much. Hare Krishna.
Are there any questions or comments? Do you have a mic or you can repeat the question. I will repeat. With western philosophy.
How can different religions be united with western philosophy? The bhakti wisdom helps us to understand that there is a progression in all diversity. Last week in Jaupati I gave a seminar on world religions and spiritual perspective. Appreciating the spiritual universality amidst the religious diversity.
So basically, Bhaktivinoda Thakur says in Chaitanya Chakram that whether it is Plato or it is Patanjali, the thinkers from the east, thinkers from the west, they have all perceived the same one absolute truth from different perspectives. And they have got different understandings of it. So the one absolute truth, when it is perceived by people from different cultures, different languages, different mindsets, they perceive differently.
But it is one absolute truth that is being perceived. So the bhakti wisdom helps us to understand that different people are at different levels of consciousness. I reveal myself based on how people approach me.
So therefore, even if some people have a slightly different conception of God, some different conception of the absolute truth, we understand that based on their present level, this is how they are conceiving God. Their conception may be somewhat aligned with reality, of what the absolute truth is, may be highly misaligned with reality, or it may be completely off. But still, they are conceiving that one absolute truth in different ways.
So what we need to do is, whatever is people’s deepest experience, that is their experience of Krishna. Now when say a cricket match is going on, and people are passionate about cricket, Krishna says, I am victory, I am adventure. So when cricket fans are excited, now the last ball, what is going to happen? They are going to hit a six and win the match or they are going to lose the match.
All that excitement that people are feeling, what is that excitement? That excitement is actually an experience of Krishna. So all our deepest experiences are actually the experiences of God. But we just don’t understand that we are experiencing God.
So you get that experience and it’s over after some time. So whatever level of consciousness people are at, they are experiencing some reality. They are experiencing something, and whatever is their deepest experience, whatever is their conception of reality, that is actually their experience of God.
That doesn’t mean their experience is the full experience. It doesn’t mean their conception of reality is the complete reality. But, Prabhupada writes in the 7th Canto, Bhagavad Gita, that the jurisdiction of Krishna consciousness extends everywhere.
That means no matter whatever hole one is experiencing, we can see that actually they are experiencing Krishna. So at one level we say intoxication is bad, regulative principles to give up intoxication. But Prabhupada is so inclusive, Prabhupada is saying that your experience of the taste of wine, that is the experience of Krishna.
I am not telling you to keep experiencing Krishna at that level. No, experience Krishna in his fullness, in his richness, in his sweetness. Practise the process of experiencing that.
So when we see in this way, different people are on different levels in their spiritual evolution. And based on their level, they have different paths, they have different conceptions, but ultimately they are experiencing Krishna in their own way. And when we understand this, then we can speak to them from their experience and help them rise up.
na buddhivedam janaledam adhyanam karmasamjnanam joshyate sarvakarmāni vidvāyaka samāchitam Krishna says don’t disturb the Buddhist people who are ignorant. Eliminate them from where they are. So Bhaktivinoda Thakur in a famous passage says that if we go to a place where God is worshipped in a way different from what we conceive, then what should we do? He says we should stay there in a labyrinthian way.
Thinking that my same worship of the Lord has now manifested in a way that I don’t understand. And he has manifested to attract people of a different mindset. So by seeing his magnanimity in how he is attracting people, my attraction to the Lord in the form that I am doing, that is increasing.
So when Srila Prabhupada was in Iran, at that time he was talking with the devotees in the background, the prayers of the namaz started. And Prabhupada folded his hands and closed his eyes. He heard the full prayer.
And then when the prayers got over, Prabhupada opened his eyes. His eyes were bright. Wasn’t that beautiful? So the devotees were taken aback.
One of the devotees said, wouldn’t it be better if they were chanting Hare Krishna? Prabhupada said, why are you making me Satya? He said, we are worshipping God in our way, we are worshipping God in His way. So we appreciate God’s consciousness wherever he is present. And we help them to rise upwards.
Srila Prabhupada said, by understanding the principle of Krishna, Krishna consciousness, a Christian becomes a better Christian. That is also the success of Krishna consciousness. So by seeing that people are experiencing Krishna in different ways, that God is revealing Himself in different ways, we speak to them at their level of experience and help them rise upwards.
So if their conceptions are off, then we may have to help them get the right conceptions. But by seeing that it is Krishna who is all-attractive, Krishna who is attracting different people in different ways, we can see that common thread of attraction that joins through people, not just of different religions, but of different orientations entirely. Even if people are atheistic, they are attracted to nature, they are attracted to something.
What is it that they are attracted to? That is the spark of Krishna’s attraction. So in that way, we can see the commonality amidst the diversity of the beliefs in this world. Does it answer your question? Some question here? Some scriptures say that we should see our parents as God, but then many young devotees renounce their parents and they give up their families to practise bhakti.
So how do we understand this? We don’t denounce our parents. Denounce means to condemn. There is no condemnation.
The word is renounce, not denounce. But there are different perspectives to understand this. The Upanishads say that matra deva bhava pitra deva bhava.
Now if you look at the context, this is what people often quote, but if you look at the context, it is not saying that the mother and father are God. What it is saying is, it comes at the conclusion of a passage when it says that the mother and father are to be respected as if they are God because they are representatives of God. That is when we are born in this world, among all living beings that are born, humans are the species that is most, are among the species that is most dependent on the parents for milk.
Other species, you know, if they are nest, if a baby is born bird-led and the parents are not there. But the bird-led will find it difficult. But they can manage somewhat.
Many other species can just get along. But humans cannot get along. A baby, if there is no one to take care of him, he will die.
So now, especially in the infancy and thereafter, the parents take care of him. And it is actually Krishna who is manifesting his love through the parents. Now, a mother may say, I fed you my breast milk.
I have taken care of you. That’s true. At the same time, when the child is born, the mother doesn’t do anything special to manufacture breast milk in her breast.
The same God who sends a child through her womb to this world also sends milk in her breast. That’s when we feed the child. So we have to see the connection that whoever offers us love in this world, it is Krishna who is offering us love through them.
So now, they are the instruments. We are grateful for the instruments. But we don’t stop at the instrument.
And we don’t let the instrument become a competitor to the source. And that is the mood of the verse. तो मेवा माता चपिता तो मेवा तो मेवा बन्दुष्च सखात तो मेवा तो मेवा विध्या द्रविणं तो मेवा तो मेवा सर्वं मनने तो मेवा So, my dear Lord, you are my mother, you are my father.
The Siri that is given over here, you are my mother, you are my friend, you are my knowledge, you are my wealth, you are my everything, O Lord. So, it’s like a growth trajectory. Initially, the child knows only the mother.
Then the child comes to know about the father. Then the child, O this is my brother, these are my friends. My child goes, O I have to do well in my exams.
I have to do well. My studying materials is important. My knowledge is important.
And then I have to earn. My money is important. So, all these objects give us shelter.
Some are persons, some are things. But they all give us some shelter in this world. And the vision, the integrated vision is to see all these.
It is God who is giving us shelter in this. So, if we start seeing our parents as offering God’s love to us, then we are grateful to the love that they offer us. At the same time, we also don’t let our love for our parents come in the way of our life.
If the parents literally are taken to be God, then say the mother wanted the child to become a doctor. The father wanted the child to become an engineer. Now, which God should the child be? There are two Gods who are telling two different things.
The verse is clearly not literally saying that the parents are God. It is actually telling that the parents are a person. And Dhruva Maharaj, his mother tells him that you, I cannot help you in this situation.
And his parents, his father has neglected him, his step-mother has insulted him. He says, whatever love I have offered you, the Supreme Lord Vishnu, he can offer you millions of times. So, she is not saying that her love is not true.
If her love is zero, then millions of times zero will also be zero. Her love is real. She really cares for her child.
But she is Katanayani’s. Now, in her case, she was actually reduced to a situation of very obvious helplessness. That I can’t help you in this situation.
But actually, this is true for all parents. They do a lot for their children. At the same time, you know, they are not her ultimate child.
We all have gone through many different lifetimes, many different species. In each species, we have had some parents. And the purpose of our relationships in this world, especially in the human form, is to, all relationships are meant to help us strengthen our relationship with Krishna.
We have horizontal relationship with others in this world. We have vertical relationship with Krishna. The ideal situation is that the horizontal relationship strengthens the vertical relationship.
And the vertical relationship strengthens the horizontal relationship. That means that our parents are devotees. They inspire us to become devotees.
And not just parents, all relationships, it applies. And so, our horizontal relationship strengthens our vertical relationship. And our vertical relationship strengthens our horizontal relationship.
In every relationship, there is expectation, there is frustration. Sometimes, you know, our parents may not be able to do what we want them to do. They may disappoint us.
Then we understand. We tolerate doubts and rumours. We become more understanding.
We become more respectful, even in spite of whatever limitations are there. So, by seeing that, when we are connected with Krishna, we are sheltered in Krishna, then that decreases our, we get an emotional security by the connection with Krishna. And that decreases our emotional dependence in other relationships.
And that can bring stability in other relationships also. So, the ideal situation, the normal situation is that the horizontal and the vertical should strengthen each other. They should be symbiotic.
Now, in a few exceptional cases, sometimes, some people, they may decide to focus primarily on the vertical relationship. In every tradition in the world, there are people who feel called towards God. That since their childhood, since their young age, this is what I want to focus on.
They may not feel it from the childhood, but once they get the calling, it’s an overpowering calling. And there are some people who live in this world. Their feet are in this world, but their hearts have touched the sky.
And for them, life as it is lived normally just doesn’t make sense. You sit and chit-chat with people about cricket, about sports, about news, about politics. It’s just so distant.
It just doesn’t make any sense. So, for such people, whose heart is drawn towards God, at that time, they have gone beyond the principles of vertical relationships. Then, for such people, they are meant to focus on Krishna.
sarva-dharmavan parityajya maham ekam shravanam vraja There are many dharmas and they are important, but Krishna says, the time comes in our life, just focus on maham ekam shravanam vraja. Now, this is not the path for everyone. But there are few who may do this.
And the bhagavad-gita assures that for those who devote themselves to Krishna directly, Krishna takes care of their parents. Not just parents, Krishna says, tri-sapta-tapam-tapam 21 generations, Krishna takes care of them. They are directly devoting themselves to Krishna.
So, there is a difference between, there is dharma, there is paradharma, and there is adharma. So, normal dharma, that’s aparadharma. That is normal conventional dharma.
That is, that we should take care of our parents. And that is what we will see, that many people, you know, I was in a college and I was in intellectual university. And then after that a professor came.
And he said, you did engineering at a women engineering college. And then now you have become a monk. He says, India lost an engineer.
Because I told him, India did not lose an engineer. America lost an engineer. You know, when you see, many people say, when somebody becomes a brahmachari, they say that, no, you have not done something material.
Here you are talking about engineering. People say, you didn’t take care of your parents. But, how many young men actually take care of their parents? The most people go, they are just busy with their careers.
And then they may provide some monetary support for their parents. But they are really not there to take care of their parents. So, I once addressed a group of, in Pune, I addressed a group of senior citizens.
All of them, you know, their sons or daughters were in America. And they were so desolate. So lonely.
So, they felt rejected. Their children are busy in their lives. And they dreamt, I will send my child to America.
And yes, they send a child to America. But the child doesn’t have any time for them now. So, actually, it is materialism that makes people more and more apathetic about their relationships.
In America, there is no culture of parents, children taking care of their parents. So, the parents have to plan for their retirement. They have to plan for years, especially with the lifespan, life expectancy increasing.
People have to plan, if I am 80, I am 90, how will I live? So, actually, the more the culture of this material state, the less relationships are valued. And even parental relationships will be valued. Even the child-parent bond will be valued lesser and lesser.
So, what happens by understanding spiritual wisdom is that many people who would have been at the level of Adharma come to the level of Dharma. A few may go to the level of Paradharma. Among the thousands of people, literally, there are thousands, millions of people who are practising bhakti all over the world.
Now, a few of them pronounce the word and focus entirely on practising dharma. As elements. Most of them will become grahasthas.
And when they become grahasthas, they take better care of their parents than what they would have taken care if they had been materialists. So, that way, the spiritual knowledge makes us more responsible, not less responsible. So, when somebody renounces their parents, if they are doing it for the sake of their own sense gratification, for their own world, that is Adharma.
But when somebody does that for the sake of God, that is Paradharma. And even those of us who do devote ourselves to God, it’s not that we completely reject or reject our parents. No, we actually care for our parents.
There are various ways in which things can be arranged. There is a community of devotees. The parents can come and stay in the community.
The other members of the community take care of the devotees. So, last year when I was in America, my father suddenly got a severe attack. And I was thinking of coming back to India.
My brother is also in America. There was no one to take care of him. So, then, it was devotees.
They took him to the hospital. They took him by the hospital. They took care of him.
And they provided him prasadam. My uncle who came there, he said that, you know, we couldn’t have cared for him as well as the devotees took care of him. So, it is not that the parents are neglected or rejected.
They are also cared for. The community of devotees comes and helps the parents. So, you know, I wrote a book about how I became a brahmachari.
It’s going to be published in the next maybe six months. So, the whole idea was, and many people feel that if somebody becomes a brahmachari, they are announcing they would. So, when I wrote this book, after that, I gave this book to my father to read.
And then his whole perception changed. He was very upset. When, in fact, he had come to the temple.
He had come to the temple, the brahmachari leader, and he had taken out 500 rupee notes, the biggest note, and he just threw it at them. He said, how many notes do you want? Take them and give my son back to me. He was so angry at that time.
But now, he comes to temple, he is very appreciative of me, what I am doing. And when he read this book, now what has happened is, he has written the foreword for this book. So, actually, it is not that we are neglecting or rejecting our parents.
It is rather, if some people feel inspired to connect with Krishna directly, then that is a special honour, it is a privilege. And the parents are also spiritually benefited by that. And as far as materially, there is a community of devotees to take care of them also.
But overall, we shouldn’t just look at those few instances. Among the, how many, there must be a million devotees. Out of that, how many brahmacharis are there? Maybe a few thousand.
I would say just a thousand or a thousand five hundred or something like that. So, for most people, by practising spiritual knowledge, by practising Bhagavad Gita, they will take better care of their parents. And even those who become brahmacharis, they also take care of their parents.
But in a way different from what is known. So, does that answer your question? We will stop here. Are there any other questions? Till what time should we go on? So, what is scripture? See, Bible is also scripture.
Then why is it that in the church, Christians wear shoes but Hindus don’t wear it in temples? Bhaktivinoda Thakur explains that scripture contains the revelation of our God given according to specific time and circumstances. So, there is a purpose and there is a practise. Now the purpose can be the same, the practise can be different.
Now whenever I go to America and then I come back to India. I was three months in America. I come back to India.
Whenever I am going for a programme after that, I always end up going on the wrong side of the car. Because in America, in India we drive on which side of the road? Left. In America? Right.
Now you see, the practise is not only different, it is opposite. Now if in India, if I drive on the right, I will be penalised. If in America, I drive on the left, I will be penalised.
The practise is opposite but the purpose is the same. So, if we get too fixated on the practises, now the purpose of the traffic rules is the same. That is regulating traffic so that people can travel smoothly and safely.
The purpose is the same but depending on whatever particularities may be there. Now in USA, when United States of America was liberated from Britain, they had that sense that we are no longer the colonies. We are separate.
So, they did many things which were different, the opposite of what was being done in Britain. So, they decided they will travel on the other side of the world. They just wanted to assert their identity separate from what was British.
So, of course, some things they have continued. So, Stanford and Massachusetts, they are more or less modelled on Oxford and Cambridge. But some things they did opposite.
So, the practises can be different and the purpose is the same. So, we should, if we start expecting that all the practises should be same, then what to speak of Christianity and Hinduism. We will see even in different temples, even in the same movements of practises may be different.
So, we don’t get too caught in the practises. But look at the purpose. The purpose is to raise our consciousness towards Christianity.
And whether we remove our shoes or we don’t remove our shoes, the mood is when Christians go to a church, they go there in a mood of reverence. They go there in a mood of respect. So, generally speaking, in the Catholic churches or in the Christian churches in general, they don’t have a deity over there.
So, they don’t have a conception of a form of God that is manifested in this world. And it is the presence of the deity that is especially sanctified. And because the deity is considered all pure.
So, therefore, when we go to the temple, we don’t take a good prayer over there. But because there is no deity in the church, there are many different reasons which can be done specifically for cultural practises. But because there is no deity, so that specific aspect of not taking on shoes is not applied.
So, we don’t have to get fixated on practises. There was a movie PK, you know, which was a satire of religion, which highlighted these practises of different practises and which tried to show that these religions are all man-made. But actually, no, they are not man-made, they are made for man.
And because man in different places is different, the way it is manifested will be different. So, I wrote a book in response to the movie PK. It is called GK for PK.
So, GK is General Knowledge, God Knowledge, Gita Knowledge. So, using these three levels of knowledge, I answered all the questions that were raised in that movie. I got all answers on my website also, the spiritual scientist.
But in general, so this was one of the questions I answered there also. But in general, we focus on the purpose, not the practises. The practises will be different.
Even in normal educational system, you know, say in IIT Kharagpur and IIT Delhi, it’s not exactly the same system of education will be used. It’s not the same textbooks, same books may be used. It’s not exactly the exact same apparatus is used.
The purpose is to give education. The practises will be different. Similarly, in different religions or different traditions or different spiritual centres, different centres of religion, practises may be different.
The purpose is the same, to raise your consciousness in the spiritual world. Any other questions? So, if people are practising religion according to their level, how can we elevate them because they believe in their own practises, their own principles? Yes. So, elevate means that we have to see where they are and have to take one step forward.
Mr. Prabhupada would meet with Christians, he would talk about the commandment thou shall not kill and encourage them to avoid eating meat. It will help them to raise their consciousness. Now, of course, as rightly said, they have their own interpretation of the commandment.
And they may not agree to that. But there are many Christians who do recognise that Jesus taught compassion. Compassion means compassion to all the humans, even to animals also.
So, there is an increasingly vibrant movement of vegetarianism within Christianity. It’s a minority, no doubt, but it’s becoming increasingly present. Vegan movement is there in the western world, vegetarianism is also there.
So, basically, whatever they are practising, we encourage them to practise better, we encourage them to understand the philosophy more thoroughly. So, Prabhupada was once asked that, you know, A, if Jesus talked about the father and that father is Krishna, then why didn’t Jesus not talk about Krishna? Prabhupada replied, Jesus himself, whatever let me talk about. Then he said, as much as I have to tell you, you are not the ears to hear.
So, he said, whatever little he told, he told a little and you killed him for that. He was crucified for that. So, he couldn’t tell so much.
But the more important thing is, Prabhupada said, the conception of Krishna as God. Understand the definition. God is all strong, all wise, all beautiful, all famous.
All renounced. So, these are attributes of God which are compatible with every religion. Atheistic religion first.
So, if we look at a objective criteria of the definition of God and then we have a conception of God. Prabhupada said, if you have a better conception of God, you tell us that conception. But don’t have a specific conception of God, which is alternative or even superior.
So, it’s not that if a person is open-minded, they can learn from Krishna Consciousness also. They can deepen their devotion to God by learning the principles of Krishna Consciousness. Now say, suppose somebody is studying in IIT here and then they want to study Computer Engineering and they come to know MIT in Massachusetts that has Computer Engineering very highly.
So, then if they get the opportunity to study there, then they say, no, I will study Computer Engineering only what is taught in IIT Kharagpur. I won’t study anything else. Then, if they start saying like that, we have to ask them, are you interested in knowledge or are you interested in college? The college is meant for knowledge.
The knowledge is not meant for college. So, like that, different religions, they are like colleges. They are meant to give knowledge about God.
So, if some knowledge about God, some features is not available in a particular tradition and is available in some other tradition, why not take that and enrich yourself with devotion to God. So, there are open-minded people who will be open and will accept and they will be ready to be elevated and illuminate further. Those who are not so open-minded, we just offer them our good wishes and the interaction in a pleasant mood and move on.
So, not everybody will be receptive. When we say that we should try to elevate people from where they are, it also depends on whether they are ready to be elevated. If they are not ready to be elevated, we just offer them our good wishes and move on to other people who are more open to be elevated.
Last question. How do we deal with defeaters? One of my colleagues is one. Firstly, we should never impose our moral standards on other people and demean other people based on our moral standards.
Now, what I mean by this is, we may say it’s not our moral standards, it’s scripture’s moral standards. That’s fine. But they have not accepted scripture as authority the way we have accepted.
So, even if they are Hindus also, they are just normal Hindus. They will not really be serious followers. So, in general, when we are dealing with people at individual level, we should always be courteous.
We should always be polite. We shouldn’t demean people, disrespect people because of certain because they are following certain things which are different from our moral standards. So, everybody deserves respect for wherever they are.
Having said that, we have to find out what is it that will make sense to them. Sometimes religious concerns may not make sense. That person is from another religious tradition.
The sanctity of the cow as explained in our tradition may not make sense. Sometimes emotional concerns may make sense. Prabhupada says we take milk from our mother, we take milk from a cow.
Cow is like a mother. I know one devotee in England. When he read this first time, he was just so jolted by that.
Just that one he read that, he stopped eating milk. And soon after that he stopped eating meat also. Now that may make sense to some people.
For some it may not make sense. So, some people may say we take milk from goat also. They might not protect goats.
People can have different reasons. So, we have to find out what is it that makes sense. So, in today’s world, you know it was said, one thinker said that when it comes to money, everyone belongs to the same religion.
So, everybody is interested in money. So, we can present the value of the cow purely in common terms. Unfortunately, today the idea of cow protection has become politicalised.
And some radical elements commit violence in the name of cow protection. And then that leads to terrible anti-publicity, publicity against the cows. But it is not even politicalised or radicalised at all.
Even purely from economic grounds, a cow if we know how to tap its value, then cow not only gives milk, the various other products that cow gives, they are also very valuable to them. From the economic point of view also, avoiding the eating of cow flesh, it makes enormous sense. Now, if we see among, now most of the cows, most of animals which are bred today, they are bred primarily for the purpose of slaughter.
So, there are factory farms where the animals are bred. So, among, it is the, among all forms of meat which pollutes the environment, which contributes to greenhouse gases, which contributes to climate change and global warming, it is beef that has the maximum ecological footprint. So, if beef eating, even if people didn’t become vegetarians, they stop eating beef, a substantial amount of ecological problems would be reduced.
From the economic point, so ecological point of view also we can go. From the economic point of view, I read an article in Uttar Pradesh, there are some Muslims, the whole community of Muslims, who take care of cows. And they take care not because of any religious reasons, simply economic reasons.
They have learned how to use cow dung, how to use cow urine, how to use the products of a cow and they are making money out of that. So, we have to, when we have to communicate to people, especially the most people in today’s world, if they are not educated, if they are not national, it’s interesting that in India, even now people think it is modern and progressive to become a, to be a, to eat flesh, to become a non-vegetarian. In the west, actually it is considered progressive to be a vegan.
You know, if somebody is eating non-veg, you know, you have no eco-sensitivity. You know, it’s all primitive. So, actually, you know, where the west is, where the west was maybe 50 years ago, India is there right now.
And we think that to be progressive. But if you just present to people, you know, how many prominent people all over the world, prominent movie stars, prominent sports players, prominent politicians, prominent authors, they have turned towards vegetarianism. Not because they are religious leaders, but simply because of ethical reasons, economic reasons, ecological reasons.
So, if you present reasons objectively that, you know, and especially present about beef, how it is harmful, then that can encourage people to at least change that. They can give up meat, that is the best, but even they can’t give up meat, they just give up beef. That itself can help the ecology.
On my website, there is an article called HELP. How your food can help the world. So, HELP is acronym, H-E-L-P.
That by what we eat, you know, we can promote our own health. Beef, among all forms of meat, beef is among the meat, forms of meat that is very damaging to the health. Health, H is health, E is ecology, environment, L is livestock.
So, so many animals, they suffer in inhuman conditions, in terrible conditions in the factory farms. And P is poverty. The amount of land that is used to feed, the amount of land, most of you know the statistics, the amount of land that is required to feed one vegetarian is actually far less than the amount of land that is used to feed non-vegetarian.
Because then what happens is, the non-vegetarian, first the animals have to be fed. We feed this much hay or like food to animal and this much flesh comes out of it. So, poverty also can be alleviated by shifting towards vegetarian diet.
Mahatma Gandhi said that the most violent weapon in the world, the most destructive weapon in the world is the kitchen fork. It is the kitchen fork. We believe that that causes far far more violence and destruction than the bombs that terrorists explode or even the weapons of mass destruction.
So, if you just raise, rather than being moralistic and judgemental, oh you are so following ITV, just rationally explain to people, raise their level of awareness, then many people will take the step forward and move away from this. Thank you very much. We will talk later.
We will have again sessions, isn’t it? Thank you very much.