The Souls 3 Features as 3 L’s Leaving Learning Loving || Online Sanga || Chaitanya Charan || 1.5.24
Transcript
Disclaimer: This transcript was generated using AI and may contain occasional errors or inaccuracies.
This is an AI-generated transcript and may contain some errors. Hare Krishna. So I’m grateful to be here with you after almost two months and today and tomorrow I’ll be speaking. So I’ll be talking about the broad topic of perceiving the nature of the soul. Now here we are in the seventh canto of the Srimad Bhagavatam in chapter 8 where Prahlad’s life story is evolving and now here Prahlad has become a teacher while he is still a student. He’s a student but he has become like an unappointed teacher. Now unappointed not in the sense that he’s been disruptive but it is he just emerges naturally leader for the other co-students who are curious. He is not disrespectful as we will see that he is respectful whenever his teachers ask him to talk with him but respect but he’s not the respect name of being respectful he’s not being naive or weak. So here in his teachings in chapter 8 in 7.8 he explains why his behavior is so different from the behavior of everyone else. So generally most people they start with a view and then they go toward a world view. What that means is say if we are if there’s someone observing us and say this is we and these are others when they observe us first they observe our view and if they find what they view interesting then they become interested in the world view. So the view view means I’m talking about what they see how they observe us interesting world view then they become interested interesting view then they become interested in the world view. So many times when the question comes up what is the key to getting people attracted toward Krishna to inspire them to become devotees there are many factors but one key factor is that the person presenting bhakti should be to use contemporary language cooler than the person whom those the audience has been previously following or at least in some way if not cooler at least the person should be interesting. So it is not most people are not attracted by philosophy itself so it is we could say first people look at the behavior and then they look at the beliefs. So Prahlad’s behavior has been extraordinary so by the same token Prahlad’s friends they are looking at Prahlad and they are saying why are you so different from us how are you so fearless why are you not adopting the view that our teachers are teaching and now children could just be mischievous but they can clearly see that Prahlad is not just being mischievous Prahlad is different and also is fearless and he’s fear so they want to know and by telling about the world view that is animating him he is giving Atma Gyan. So as a part of the world view we’ll talk about many things within the world view that he’s going to give one major part of it is Atma Gyan Self-awareness, self-understanding. So Shri Prabhupada elaborates on how we can infer the existence of the soul by talking about Anvayate kere itere kena. So this is a standard method which I talk about in scripture. So now with respect to the Atma there are many things which you could know the existence of the soul then we can understand the nature of the soul. So just like with respect to God the first step is to understand the existence of God but you know okay God exists but then you want to understand what is the nature of God how does God function what is the nature of his personality that is also very important for us to know. So now in our discover yourself we talk about the existence of the soul quite frequently that’s why I won’t repeat those arguments over here we will start from there itself but we’ll focus on perceiving the nature of the soul by nature what do we mean how do we know the nature of a person the nature is often associated with the features, functions. So whenever we want to understand something we look at its features you know what all does it do what are its characteristics so today we’ll try to focus on the features of the sun and tomorrow on the soul and tomorrow we’ll focus on the functions of the soul and we will also talk about the nature of the super soul as a part of the discussion slightly today and a little more tomorrow. So we know the Atma is Sat, Chit, Ananda. So the Atma has these three characteristics and these three characteristics can also actually be perceived in the way we function in the way we seek to live. So we can say that the Sat aspect which means existing so we could say this is what creates within us the natural urge for living we exist soul exists and that’s why we have a very strong urge to live the Chit aspect leads to the urge or the longing for learning because we are conscious we are eager to learn we are eager to grow the Ananda aspect we can seek Ananda from various things but the deepest Ananda comes from the reciprocation of love even the lord seeks that love that’s why Eko Bahusyaam the one becomes many so let’s explore these three characteristics that we have these three longings and these three longings the longing for living the longing for learning and the longing for loving these three actually can point toward the existence of something beyond the body beyond matter now let’s see how that happens basically if we look at the self and the self is multi-level there is the body and beyond that there is the soul now in between there’s the mind but we’ll keep a minimalist model over there the body includes the gross body and subtle body now the body is studied primarily through biology and the soul is studied primarily through spirituality so now when we look at ourselves we start with our body when we look at anyone else we start with their body and then we try to understand the nature of the person so we go inward from the external toward the internal so at a biological level what do we see so now at a biological level every living being the urge for living is there and that’s why survival is so important that urge to survive is deeply rooted in the living beings so indeed characteristic existence is characterized by the struggle for existence a struggle for survival now we may say this is simply a biological feature yes it is a biological feature but is it simply a biological feature is there something more to it in the Upanishads there is a fascinating story about which involves Indra who is the head of the Devatas and Virochan who is the head of the Asuras both of them seek knowledge and the seeking knowledge they go to Brihaspati hmm and they ask Brihaspati certain questions and Brihaspati tells them that okay I’ll answer your questions but you perform some tapasya so they try to serve him and they serve him for some time they ask Brihaspati please tell me what is the nature of the self who am I really hmm what is what is it that is at my core so Indra and Brihaspati after they do some seva to their guru they are told go to a lake and look at what you see in the lake and they behold their form and Brihaspati tells them that what you see as a reflection in the lake but that what you see is the self now when both of them hear this okay our guru has enlightened us they start leaving now Virochan goes away thinking oh I went to the gurukul I learned now I’m leaving but as Indra is about to leave he takes our thinking hey the reflection I see in a river can that really be me that reflection keeps changing hmm and if the water shifts a little bit the reflection shifts but he starts thinking that the body is changing so can that really be me he says that the body changes but no I have changed but there is something which is unchanging also so he comes back and he says can you tell me more about this this doesn’t seem to be the full answer and Brihaspati is pleased he smiled ghost of a smile comes on his face he looks with sharp yet approving eyes towards Indra and he says if you want to know more then you have to perform more tapasya and he sends Indra to do further tapasya and further seva and when they do that when he does that and after some time he comes back and he says that when you close your eyes and now it’s an elaborate story and I’m putting the story in very simpler terms simplest terms over here but the broad contours are similar this is okay when you close your eyes and you think of your thoughts the thoughts that you see inside you those thoughts are who you are the whole world is shaped by the thoughts inside you your vision of the world your perception what you what you seek what you achieve it is all shaped by the thoughts inside you so the thoughts inside you are who you really are so basically he’s starting from the body then he’s going to the mind hmm and it is okay he’s happy and he’s about to go but again he becomes thoughtful and then he says wait a minute see if I am the thoughts inside me and these thoughts also keep changing one thought is present there tomorrow another or today another tomorrow another thought is present so which of these thoughts is really me just as the world outside changes in fact the thoughts inside change even more so as he’s thinking basically living is the feature of the body the body wants to live but even biologists who are hardcore biologists they understand the body is not just like a biological machine they’re not just biological robots because we constantly seek to keep learning so now that capacity to learn that is the urge to live the urge to learn the urge to love all of them ultimately come from the soul but the point is here that we often seek to learn about things that are not necessary for the survival of our body we naturally learn things those things but often the question comes up that satchitananda is the characteristic of the atma and the atma is essentially the same in all species then why is the human species considered human form is special why is it special exactly it is because we say that because it affords us the opportunity for self-realization but how does the human form afford us the opportunity for self-realization what is so special is it the brain structure is it the so it is the anatomy or the physiology of the body but then we can basically say that the human body is made of the same biological substance as an animal body we could say okay our brain substance is much more complex but is that what differentiates just because we have a more developed brain that’s why we are capable of spiritual contemplation and spiritual pursuit or is there something more to it now is the difference in the anatomy or physiology of the body is it difference in the soul well how can the difference be in the soul because the soul is the same and that the soul cannot be destroyed the soul cannot even be changed the soul is unchanging in 2.25 krishna talks about how avikari you know that none of the vikaras that affect the body they affect the soul so if the body essentially is the same for in the human form essentially in terms of biological components as an animal forms and the soul is also the same in its essential nature then what differentiates the human body making it special so the biological substance that makes the human body is similar to what it makes in the human body is the same and the spiritual essence is also the same so where exactly is the difference that makes the human body special that difference lies primarily in the extent of coverings that either permit or prevent the soul’s nature from manifesting in the body and through the body so is the extra brain substance that we have does make a difference but it is like if you give a dog we can give a dog a phone a dog if it is given a phone you know whether the dog is given a $300 phone it’s a normal phone you give them or we give a $3,000 phone now is it going to make any difference the dog really doesn’t know how to use the phone i can accidentally press some buttons and do something but the dog actually does not know how to use the phone so this is a problem similarly for the soul if it were the body is all that is different the brain is different but for a for an intelligent person there’s a difference between $3,000 phone and $3,000 phone there are some more features and those features can be used and if somebody really doesn’t know much about the features of the phone even if you don’t consider a dog if there’s an untrained human being so all that this human being knows is that a phone is used for making calls so they’re just going to make calls with the $300 phone or $3,000 phone so yes so similarly it is not this human body is more sophisticated so the animal body is like the $300 phone the human body is like the $3,000 phone there’s a difference no doubt human body is more sophisticated but that itself does not make the difference the soul is the same the human body essentially the same its features are more but the interface between the two is different the layers of covering that are caused to be around the soul they are lesser in the human body and thus that’s what see when all living beings or all beings want to live now living is characteristic of all beings to some extent this is true for all living beings learning is also a characteristic for all living beings but the thing is that in animals actually learning is only for living animals generally learn enough so that they can survive now we may say but animals do certain things which seem to be far more than what is required for survival say peacock has a magnificent set of feathers which come out when it dances there are birds which make very complicated nests but they may not need that much level of complexity of nests just for protecting their babies then eggs first and then the baby birds may be true maybe not maybe they’re biologically speaking in their particular environment maybe they need that level of nest but even if we assume that they don’t or even if we assume they do either way the point is the birds are primarily concerned about learning how to survive there may be beauty and artistry in what the birds bodily features are or its functional dwellings are but the birds are not doing it primarily for the purpose of beauty or for some other higher purpose it’s for living there are courtships there are courting dances where one bird may dance so that a male bird may dance so that it attracts a female bird or a female bird may sing a beautiful song to attract a male bird so all that is there but that is what ultimately for living if I don’t live my genes should live on so our form our species should continue so in humans however this learning that is there is not just for living the learning it is for living of course but it is also for more now for more what is this more it is for bringing meaning to living we seek for our existence to have value and therefore we ask philosophical questions that Brahma Jigyasa that is not possible in the human in the animal body because their learn the soul has the capacity to learn but in the animal body the covering is such that there is not much potential available manifest for the learning to happen and to grow beyond what is required for living human beings often learn many things which are not immediately required for our survival so this is where our potential for spiritual growth is there so the nature of the soul is pursued that if we are simply biological creatures designed for surviving and reproducing then why would we want to spend elaborate time and energy seeking to know things that are not really required for survival so when we study philosophy when we basically seek meaning to our life the pursuit of meaning is not really necessary for survival for a basic level of survival biological survival but it is that when people lose a sense of meaning in their lives that’s when their existence starts becoming so deeply pointless for them suddenly why am I even living and in life there are different kinds of losses there is a loss of means, means could be wealth, means could be reputation, means could be health and all these are problematic but a far more problematic loss is a loss of meaning what is the point even of living and that comes up then that’s where the person goes towards self-destruction so the point I’m making over here is something very significant that there are means of living and there is the meaning of living now we want to learn about the means of living but we also want to learn about the meaning of living see the second meaning second level this meaning of living is so so much more important that for the sake of meaning people may sometimes even give up the means sometimes normally people need the means and then they will seek the meanings like sometimes people say that what can what philosophy can a poor person who is starving understand that may be true they need food of course everybody needs food but once a person has food then the pursuit of meaning becomes so much more important and a person may even forego the means if somebody’s meaning sense of meaning isn’t there protecting their country then they may be ready to risk their life and become a martyr for the sake of protecting their country because they’ve got the meaning and for the sake of meaning that means can also be sacrificed so sat is one feature of the atma which makes us want to live but chit is another feature of the atma and that chit makes us want to learn we are conscious we want to learn how things function in the world and what do we want to learn it learn for you want to learn so that we want to learn so that we can grow we can find meaning in our life now that brings us to the last part that now like that brahaspati is again approached by indra and finally indra is told again perform tapasya and then he goes on there are other stages also which we will discuss in tomorrow’s session he says okay when you sleep when you are deep sleep at that time what you experience that is who you are but then he says that in sleep i dream i experience various dreams sometimes those dreams disappear but what really is there in that time so there is certain kind of thoughts which exist when we are closing our eyes when we are awake and closing our eyes or when we are sleeping and we are with our dreams which are some kind of thoughts so he says finally the he says yes you have passed the test now you understand that you are not your perceptions you are not your thoughts you are the thinker of your thoughts so we as souls we are not thoughts our thoughts we are the thinker of our thoughts thinker means we as spiritual beings we use our thoughts and using those thoughts we think so that’s where now we if we consider our thinking is so important that sometimes once we find some meaning even the means can be sacrificed so chit is so important that the sath aspect can sacrifice the soul is always sath the soul always wants to live but when somebody is a martyr for a cause what is happening now that person may still think i am the body but the sath aspect what is happening is that sath means wants us to live so we are not talking about the nature of the soul the nature of the whole as we perceive it because the soul is eternal we want to live eternally and that’s why we want to avoid death but the soul is not just internally passively existent the soul is curious is chit and the curiosity the soul looks for meaning and if there is meaning in something then the soul is ready to even risk life for it so sath becomes let important in chit here living becomes more less important than learning learning about the meaning of life actually it’s not that simple let’s complete this point we know that chit is important but more important is ananda and ananda comes by loving another can come in many different ways no doubt but the deepest ananda the deepest joy comes through loving through reciprocating love with others and ultimately the one object with whom we can reciprocate love eternally is our lord krishna and thus connecting with him is the ultimate object of love and that brings the ultimate ananda now if we consider going back to the earlier point that people find meaning say somebody a patriot finds meaning in serving the country and they may become so dedicated to the country that they may be ready to leave their lives and why does that happen because there is a joy in our learning learning is important but loving is even more important what does it mean there’s american politician british politician says that london sorry he says england because of you i’ve had so many headaches and heartbreaks because of you i have spent so many restless days and sleepless nights london england because of you i have had i’ve lost my health and i have lost my peace of mind and yet oh despite it all oh england i love you so the idea is that when we are learning about something we can always learn things which may not be the most complimentary there are there are there are movies and pop songs i hate so many things about you you know i hate this and i hate this i hate this but the thing i hate most is that i can’t hate you although i hate all this about you i can’t hate you so like that when we are seeking only learning there are many philosophical problems that can come up okay god exists and why is there evil and why do bad things happen to good people why do bad things happen to me that all that is valid those are valid questions but bhishma pitamaha what does he tell yudhishthira maharaj that the lord’s plan cannot be understood but the lord can be loved so basically when we are seeking learning understanding god is important no doubt but far less important far more important than understanding god is actually experiencing god once we experience krishna it does when we feel his sweet sublime presence when we relish his love then even if you can’t understand the specifics of what he’s doing and why he’s doing it it doesn’t matter and so this understanding god can happen through analysis and analysis is no doubt important but experiencing god happens through service and service is even more important than analysis it is this that’s why that loving aspect the ananda that we seek that is so great that even if the learning aspect is even if the living aspect is impeded doesn’t matter a devotee is normally living means struggle for survival but a devotee is ready to lay down the life for the sake of the lord living doesn’t really it’s not all that important of course as the soul we keep living but the point is these three aspirations for living for learning and longing and how they manifest they point through these these three deep features of the soul and these three can be explained to some extent on the basis of biology but biology cannot explain everything the nature of the longing see biology can explain loving between say males and females and progenitors and progeny for example the loving between males and females is so that procreation can happen the loving between progenitors and progeny between the parents parents and the children in whichever species that can be explained through the fact that living has to go on but why do we have a urge for something beyond our biology beyond our surroundings why do we seek some ultimate meaning some ultimate reality why do we want to love that that love is not explained based on our biology alone and that points ultimately to our spirituality in this way each one of us can actually by observing ourselves and observing people around us can infer the characteristics of the soul so i’ll summarize what we discussed today our topic is perceiving the nature of the soul and within that we discuss especially the features of the soul the features of the Satchitananda so we discussed four main points today the first point was the context the context is that Prahlad is speaking to his co-students and generally most people go from world view they don’t go immediately to world they don’t want to know what is our world view they go from view to world view that when they find a view interesting okay that means what they see about us they find interesting then they become interested in our world view so our behavior should be such that it triggers curiosity among people to want to know the world that is what happened with Prahlad and he’s answering questions accordingly then we discussed about how the three features of the soul can the soul when you talk about the nature here so from behavior the person starts looking at the belief at the world life conception the world conception so when he hears that he’s talking about Atma let me want to i want to know about it something like that is there so we discuss the Sat aspect correlates with the living the longing to live within us and this is there in all life forms and thus a basic level of the conception of the Atma or the Atma is present in all life forms so then the question of the why is human form special the body is similar body is similar but more sophisticated the soul is the same so it is not the sophistication of the body that sophistication i’m talking about the cerebral sophistication physically many other species are more sophisticated than humans also so neither of these is actually the answer it is what makes a difference is the link that is possible the link leaves more openings that normally most bodies they cover the self-awareness or even the potential for self-awareness gyana vidyana the destroyer vinashanam that the lust can destroy self-destructive craving can destroy both of these so but the link has more openings in the human form a person can perceive more and more that’s where we discuss the second aspect was the third point the chit aspect makes us want to be learning and learning not just about living we want to learn about living but about the meaning of living that becomes much more important for the sake of meaning people may even be ready to give up the life itself and that’s where ananda ananda can come from many things but the deepest ananda comes from loving and the souls in the case of a spiritually realized person the ananda for of loving comes from loving the lord and that is such a great ananda that the person doesn’t care for anything more so loving other members of our species for that that may be the longing for that comes from our biology but loving an ultimate reality a god who cares for us who wants to be with us that comes only through spirituality that comes only through spiritual guides so when you have such spiritual guides then we all can grow toward krishna and ultimately attain eternal embrace thank you very much hare krishna are there any questions or comments thank you so much for such a wonderful class what an analogy wonderful thank you so much and yeah there are you have time right for questions yeah please go ahead with your question i’m trying to unmute hari krishna thank you so very much your analogy is just wonderful beautiful my takeaway um such ananda god exists who creates the uh the jet uh it’s the reciprocator for that urge and uh it just made me understand so so clearly i wanted to share what i wrote when you when you brought to the to the attention about you said the bottom line the reason we want to yes and uh yes definitely see the love the purpose of living and learning it culminates in loving so you can say at one level living leads to learning and learning leads to loving at the same time you can also say that living loving also leads to living more fully it also leads to learning more deeply so ultimately it’s loving but then the point is that because these three are features of the soul sometimes only one of these can be manifested so if only living is manifested that means the person is just eating and uh uh maybe just playing video games and and just uh having virtual sensual pleasures and things like that and that living actually becomes meaningless so it’s like living can be reduced only to the level of the body living alone then learning alone some people can become a lot very philosophical or very very much they get caught in the head i want to learn about this i want to learn about i want to learn about that so that can be only to the level to the level of the head so such people can be walking encyclopedias but they can be living failures because you know they may know a lot but they may not be able to have much social skills they may not be able to maintain relationships that’s not very healthy again and if it’s loving alone um the love can be directed towards many things so the people can become sentimental so there are many say for example romantic movies and romantic novels where people are ready to lay down to die for each other or some like people in more horror horror kind of a frustrated lover can kill the person who said no to them so basically loving when loving is bhakti is not just loving bhakti is loving that is grounded in living and learning that’s a buddha bhava samanvitaha so when love is the ultimate but love alone it’s not just love alone it is ananda which is grounded in sat and chit so so that’s why sat and chit sat is at the brahman platform chit is also the brahman chit is beyond the brahman platform anand is the anand from loving is beyond that platform so so that’s a definitely a loving is the highest but it’s not that it is disconnected from the jai haribo har krishna thank you so much thank you hare krishna hi krishna thank you so much very nice explanation about meditation but they should not be sentimental but both knowledge uh should be there but we also so that we can have the good process thank you father probably so the next uh can we go there hare krishna thank you hare krishna prabhu one question one question from today’s class prabhu i kind of have two sub questions prabhu both pointing to the same question now when we talk about the body mind and soul prabhu uh the first question prabhu when i look at the animal body right versus when i look at a human animal dead body versus when i look at a human dead body versus when i look at a dead body who i am known to him i kind of go through different emotions prabhu and to an extent that it also kicks in the smashana vairagya and things like that so although theoretically i know that it’s the same soul that’s in all three examples that i gave the impact that it creates within me seems to be different uh to the degree of the species connectivity or whether i know the person or not to what extent i know the person that’s one thing prabhu and the second question also related to that when we say the love it seems at some level i think the love the manifestation of love also seems to be confined to the body and mind in this world in the sense that though i philosophically understand i am the soul and others are also the soul the love and care that i show to others or others show to me seems to be can only be manifested in terms of body and mind again so i just wanted to kind of understand it seems that the soul itself is confined to these buckets of body and mind in this world yes correct the soul is confined to the buckets of the body and mind as long as the soul is unenlightened and attached so when that’s and that itself is not a bad thing at least as a progressive step just like a parent for parents to be attached to their children a newborn baby it’s so tender you know a mother may naturally want to care for the soul but the mother has to care for the child’s body also isn’t it the child’s consciousness developed mother will care for the soul also so caring for the body you cannot really separate the two then we care for a person we care for the complete person i cannot say i care for your soul i don’t care for your body i don’t care for your mind so but the thing is that we if we care only for the body and the mind it becomes a problem so social society culture education need to help us to make our love more and more holistic otherwise it will remain fragmented so now going back to the previous point about the degree of love that we feel to for when we see an animal’s dead body or a human dead body or a loud one or some familiar human being’s dead body that’s different because yeah because of the degree of emotional investment that is there in that particular living being now there are some churches which actually do funeral services even for dogs and cats because their parishioners are so attached to their dogs and cats that when their parishioners die sorry then the parishioners pets die then they want to form a make a service for that and the service can so now sometimes more people come for the funeral of a pet than they come for the funeral of a human being so how much grief a person experiences does not necessarily depend on just the species sometimes a person may be more attached to a dog than they might be attached to their friend or some acquaintance or some colleague or even some family member for that matter so our consciousness how much it is invested that determines the extent of our emotion and that also will determine the kind of thoughts that arise within us so see loving for example recently when India lost the world cup final there are some people who actually committed suicide there’s no death over there in the sense that it was just a match that was lost none of the cricketers ended their lives but what happened the soul’s consciousness can get invested so much in the idea of this particular game and this particular tournament and this particular team that the person may feel if this doesn’t happen then what is the point even of living so the amount of emotional investment can vary from person to person and the amount of grief that we experience it can lead to frustration or it can lead to renunciation whichever way it is that depends on how much you have invested originally does it answer your questions yes yes Prabhu thank you so much Prabhu just to confirm Prabhu so is would that be a right understanding to say that the way we manifest love in terms of love and care for others or we expect from others should be for the mind and body but on the basis of the philosophy that we are spirit souls would that be a right my words it should be for the mind in the body it should be for the full person not just the mind in the body it’s not that the soul is the basis and then the love is only for the body and the mind thus it’s rather it is for the entire person but the person we can say it should be primarily for the soul that is true but at this present level we cannot separate so it’s need based if a person is sick then the primary thing that we may need is to arrange some medicines for them and then if they are really disturbed or something then calm them down sit down with them and then maybe after that talk some Krishna katha with them so it’s like when we offer care care love and care when we offer we offer to the entire person and the entire person means the body mind and soul is that does that make sense yes yes yes thank you so much thank you providing uh janavatha kurani mataji thank you for a wonderful class my question there are two questions i’ll start with the first one uh we talked about that we are the observe we are the observer we are not our thoughts we are the thinker so the question was which faculty is responsible for feelings and emotions and how do they correlate with what we are thinking and and and being the thinker so how do we understand who’s responsible for the emotions and feelings okay see thinking feeling willing are all features that are associated with the subtle body and ultimately nothing happens without the soul so any say any action is there for that there’s a tool required for the action but then the along with the tool we could say there is a user required also a user of the tool so for example when we blow a whistle there has to be a person that is there and then there is the whistle so where from from where is the whistle sound coming it is coming whistling sound coming it is from coming from the whistle but the whistle itself doesn’t produce that sound there’s a person required so like i’m speaking right now i need my voice box if my voice box is damaged i won’t be able to speak to you but the voice box is not producing the sound so the tool could be the whistle and the user could be the person the tool could be the voice box and the user in this case the person ultimately is the soul and similarly the subtle body could be the tool and the user would be the soul now sometimes thoughts in the sense of reasoning analysis that is associated with the intelligence and emotions feelings desires they are associated with the mind so we could say you can use the word thought in many different senses thought can be like the basic basic unit of subtle action um that means everything that happens in the subtle the subtle body that begins with a thought but then thought can refer to this also so this is i just got a thought when he’s using it that means something just popped up within me so but then we also use the word thought in a i have given this a lot of thought that means i have analyzed it i have deliberated it so this is the discerning deliberating deciding so this is slightly different or significantly different so this is associated this basic unit of subtle action this is associated with the entire subtle body but this kind of discernment is associated family with the intelligence so in that sense the foundational idea of thought that is also the subtle body so then thoughts can grow into emotions then thoughts can grow into um the reasoning faculty i just got a thought and i felt something i thought i got a thought and then i analyzed it so once we get a thought that basic unit of thought that can be developed through feelings that can be developed through analyzing also so that feeling is normally associated with the mind the analyzing that is associated with the intelligence and then that’s how the thoughts develop further okay okay um so using this as a basis the second question was that we talked about we have we have this longing and yearnings um we have these we have these longings and yearnings right all the time that we are seeking we are always seeking we are yearning or looking for something so i see that we talked about colleague relation or family relation or husband wife relation or child parent relation so in all these relations are we are we are subtly trying to seek for that from that learning yearning to loving yearning right so in in this in this platform material platform we are always yearning and we translate that yearning with these relationships like all these kind of relationships so what what i have noticed is that when we are happy in a relationship any relationship we think that we are happy whereas when the same relationship gives you some suffering or disappointment you are not happy and you again go into that phase of yearning and longing so at what point that and how do we transition like we are always transitioning from living learning and loving we talked about experiencing the sublime existence of god or loving god so i was trying to correlate how do we understand this because if i’m happy in a relationship i will say okay now i’m happy i’m satisfied but at another point in time i’m not happy so i’m still seeking a yearning yeah it’s that’s natural because the okay there are two ways of looking at this that there is that we need knowledge of the material world we not make knowledge of the spiritual world and both of those can help us to succeed in life so at a basic level in at the material world there is distress there is the distress can range from it can just plain dissatisfaction okay things are not as good as i would like them to be but from dissatisfaction it can even go to devastation everything that has been allured for has been taken away from but basically there is distress in our life now when we try to relieve distress it like if you consider distress to be like sickness so when somebody is has sickness and there are two kinds of there is pain medication and there is curative medication so both are required so basically our material arrangements they are like pain medication and there are our spiritual alignment with krishna that is like the curative medication now the pain medication when it is working at the time if they feel that maybe i don’t even need the curative medication but when the pain medication is not working then you start thinking what is wrong what do i need the ideal situation is when we we understand how the pain medication works and we appreciate it when it works but we don’t let we don’t let ourselves come under the illusion thing thinking that i don’t need anything more so a good doctor doesn’t want the patient to be in pain and if a pain medication is not working the doctor will adjust the pain medication dosage so that the pain medication also works so like that our material relationships our material situations do they give us happiness yes they do and it is not that we are meant to be miserable over there but the happiness that comes over there is temporary today some things work out tomorrow some things the same things may stop working so we understand that this is a pain medication it’s not the ultimate cure but it is important in its own place however it should not take over the entire place of our life and when we have that perspective then we see see basically the material arrangement and the spiritual alignment the pain medication and the curative medication the ideal situation is these two they are complements that means the material arrangement plays some part and the spiritual alignment plays a bigger part but when this is happening it is good but when the material arrangement becomes a replacement for the spirituality that’s when it becomes a problem so and for most people if the spiritual alignment is attempted as a replacement for the material arrangement that is also not going to work except in exceptional situations so for most people we do need to take care of the material arrangements also so so that’s why it’s a complementary thing both have their value in their place and purpose does it answer your question okay yes the question was at what point the soul is satisfied is it at the level of self-actualization or self-realization while we are navigating this temporary nature of relationships or at what point that happens when that’s when the soul even even if we are under material see when the disease is cured that’s when the the patient becomes free from pain isn’t it similarly when our consciousness is invested in what is the disease the disease is a misdirection of consciousness so while our consciousness is misdirected now we cannot suddenly redirect our consciousness toward Krishna the misdirection of consciousness is the disease for us so now from the misdirection of consciousness the ultimate cure is the redirection of consciousness redirection of consciousness towards Krishna but the redirection does not happen in one moment during that time there is the management of consciousness okay our consciousness investment in the body our consciousness invested in our family our consciousness invested in our country well we are functioning in this world so the take care of our consciousness management invested in those things take care of those things so that they don’t disrupt us too much so that there is some broad level of happiness but ultimately the soul becomes happy when the soul’s consciousness is redirected toward Krishna so once the soul’s consciousness is directed toward Krishna it’s the soul becomes if you consider this to be if you consider consciousness to be like a ocean then at the surface of the ocean there might be some waves that come and go but those waves don’t affect us so even for a pure devotee there’ll be dualities at the surface so but because the depth because the ocean is so vast at the waves of the surface don’t affect the depth of the ocean so this is the vast ocean that is underneath that is our spiritualized emotion the spiritually invested in the consciousness so spiritually invested so then what happens is we are not much affected by the material even if we are present in the material so that means our consciousness because we are in the material world so our consciousness is still materially aware but at the material our consciousness will perceive the ups and downs okay any last question thank you so much do you have time more time one last question okay thank you Akshardas Prabhuji please go ahead Hare Krishna Prabhu Dandekar So I wanted to share my thought process with you like the thoughts I’m having so basically I know and probably believe that Krishna has better plans for us than we have for us right so like I always pray that something may arise in my life that I had to go back to India and I probably go to Vrindavan and I can just live by doing Madhukari and live under a tree as well and I just like to give up this material life and things like that thoughts like that even if I see hear about someone’s death or passing by I don’t usually get sad and even like I enjoy sometimes so even I embrace for the death of my parents like I might not grieve a lot so am I a psychopath or like I’m still I’m not able to deal with this thoughts like are those these negative thoughts okay see detachment is desirable but there are certain things which are which may seem to be detachment but they’re not attachment so for example detachment is not cold-heartedness detachment is also not aversion or frustration so what is cold-heartedness it is it is almost like a incapacity for emotions a person’s emotional capacity has become so deadened that the person no longer experience emotions that is not detachment aversion or frustration is basically strong negative emotion toward in this case toward something material so all this job is so frustrating this family life is so frustrating I just want to give it all up so how much is the attraction to Krishna that is something which is more important so if it’s detachment it’s not aversion frustration detachment is also not apathy so apathy is just lack of emotion one does just doesn’t care all these are various ways in which a person’s emotions may be no longer be expressed for us on the spiritual path detachment is actually a stepping stone for toward attachment toward Krishna so detachment for us in that sense is actually clear-headedness clear-headedness means it’s more of there is the capacity for emotions but it is we are awareness of where emotions shouldn’t be invested and thereafter where emotions should be invested and then gradually it is that we transfer our emotions so if somebody is say not feeling any kind of grief if our parents die I don’t think we should immediately assume that we are detached it could be that we have become cold-hearted we have become apathetic we have become averse we have become emotionally stunted in one way there is a story told by Sri Vishnu Acharya or contemporary Sri Vishnu Acharya the principle is there that a person comes to a guru and says I think I should take sannyas he says why my wife passed away I didn’t even shed one tear I think I’m detached so the guru says go and remarry why what are you telling me your wife is someone you could see you could interact with and if you couldn’t love her enough so that you cried when she passed away how are you going to love God whom you can’t see and you can’t interact with immediately and how are you going to cry for God bhakti is about crying for Krishna so now this this particular anecdote can be understood in many different ways but the point is that detachment in the sense of cold-heartedness or apathy is not uncool for bhakti so if you feel a strong urge for going to Vrindavan or something like that that’s good but it doesn’t mean that we have to immediately abandon our family responsibilities ultimately Vrindavan is perceived not just by going physically over there it is not just by doing Madhukari Vrindavan is revealed to us by the mercy of the Vaishnavas by the mercy of guru and therefore if we try to fulfill the will of our guru in Vrindavan and beyond Vrindavan also wherever we are that is what will actually open the higher realities of Vrindavan to us so that’s how we focus on becoming clear-headed okay this is where my emotions should not be invested this is where my emotions need to be invested and now how can I transfer my emotions from here to here it’s a gradual incremental process in that way we can steadily and steadily grow in bhakti so thank you very much thank you okay I didn’t sleep at all yesterday night which is a bit shocking may not be the best word shocking surprising I didn’t feel tired or lazy or lazy distracted incapable of clear thinking I want to keep growing keep learning and let’s see what happens thereafter I was trying to speak for one hour and I ended up speaking for one hour 20 minutes actually it’s one hour 30 minutes it’s a long long time grateful that I could speak and it was an interesting subject that was developed during the course of talk and I can really sleep you can see that I am feeling tired right now and I don’t need to sleep can I crawl in this how would you feel it can mine for me I believe there is some swelling when I crawl okay why it is a mistake I’m not sure how serious a mistake it is and how easy it will be to resolve the mistake but basically at this stage I am going to take some rest maybe a couple of hours of rest would be good that I would like to talk with him I don’t know how much or how long I can talk with him but I could I can definitely try actually do I need to sleep I definitely need to sleep no doubt about it let me start by thinking about what all can be done please bless me I’m grateful grateful that is a good question the simple thing which can and should be done I can’t get it done why can’t someone take it up for doing these things there’s no one available he said we’ll find someone I said we’ll pay but just paying a loan is not enough 39 percent this definitely needs to be charged now let’s start with charging what needs to be charged and removing and what doesn’t need to be charged actually this could come over here this could go over there into the charging socket okay if I need to have something over here which helps me to sleep well it’s better to have this strap isn’t it it’s definitely better to have this strap because I took it out for it now okay maybe it might be helpful maybe it would be helpful to have it I think it can daddy. and I’m not going anywhere with you. Tomorrow same time then? Question mark. I am free now also. Are you free to talk today anytime? Are you free to talk anytime today? Question mark. I am okay overall. And I am recovering steadily. And will resume my travel. Tomorrow from Seattle to Toronto. Full stop. I had a minor fall. But it was not a fracture. Thankfully. Full stop. The swelling was substantial. But it has gone down by gentle… Question mark. Now it’s up to the listener. If he really wants. He can go into the folder. And find that particular file. The lecture he is listening to. He will get all your files. And whatever he sees in that folder. If he feels that you don’t upload your videos. He will talk to you. He will talk to you. When you live your lecture.