What should be a devotee’s attitude towards scientists?

Transcript

This is an AI-generated transcript and may contain some errors.
and how this can be done is to be decided in guidance with some individual spiritual guide future scientific research may disprove their beliefs so Mayank has commented that many scientists are not demons but most scientists are so as devotees there are different ways of looking at things and it depends on which perspective and which purpose is being considered at a particular time for example from a very broad perspective we could say that as Krishna says in the Bhagavad Gita that there are two kinds of people there are the divine and the demonic so there it is said that anybody who is not a devotee is a demon now in Dau Bhuta Sargaon Loka it is said that and Shri Prabhupada writes in the Parpora that the basic criteria for deciding who is a devotee and who is a demon is whether a person is following scripture or not so by this criteria we can say that not only everybody else is a demon most people in Kali Yuga are demons because we ourselves are also a demoniac because how much of the scripture guidelines are we able to follow ourselves in our life so this is one dividing line but now if you look at how the Madhyam Adhikari sees people so the Madhyam Adhikari is the level of devotee that we should try to be as sadhakas and it is described in the 11th canto as well as in the Upadesha Amrit that this Madhyam Adhikari’s level of perception is more refined in one sense this is a very first was a very broad level devotees and demons those who follow scriptures are daiva and those who are not following scriptures are demoniac but then so Ishwara for the supreme lord there is Prema Tad Adhineshu for his devotees there is Maitri friendship we love the lord we befriend the devotees Krupa we show compassion or mercy on behalf of Krishna to the Balisheshu to the innocent and Dvisheshu the envious Upeksha we neglect them now that means here apart from the devotees the categorization has been divided into two that is there are the innocent and the envious so that means earlier what was said was demons and devotees now that demons have been divided into two the envious and the innocent so now can we say that demons can be innocent not in a absolute sense or not at one sense no can say if somebody is in the material world that person is by definition envious of Krishna and sinful but that person may not be consciously acting in a inimical way towards Krishna so Dvisheshu refers to those who are actively malevolently against Krishna whereas Balisheshu refers to those who are under who are under mainly ignorance and they are innocent they are like children children can be said to be both ignorant and innocent even if there is mischievous activities they don’t know and usually they don’t intend any malevolent harm towards anyone at least from this life perspective so actually towards the Balisheshu we can have three levels of perspective we can say that okay from this life’s perspective these people don’t know what is right what is wrong so they are innocent from a past life karmic perspective we can say they are put in that ignorant situation because of their own past misdeeds so still they are blameworthy that is fine but beyond that we can say that ultimately they are all pure souls and our goal is not to condemn them to the impure coverings that are obscuring them now but is to bring out the pure souls that they are to bring out their natural purity and their attraction towards Krishna so now where would we place scientists among these categories science for most people is just another career it’s a lucrative career and they will do whatever is required to go ahead in their career if their field of study goes against God they will go against God if their field of study goes towards God they will go towards God whatever it is so most scientists in one sense are just like other human beings just as most human beings in Kaliyuga are materialistic scientists are also materialistic largely speaking and science is a way by which they try to further their materialistic career there are some scientists who are very strongly inimical to God and there are some scientists who may be even devoted to God but for most of them from a functional perspective they are in science for a career and certainly the scientific education, scientific study may have certain effects on their conceptions and attitudes towards religion and God and that has to be taken into account so because the mainstream scientific academy is materialistic like the rest of the society so scientists are unlikely to be specially inclined or devoted to God just as the rest of the society isn’t and because there are many atheistic conceptions within science so it is also possible that the percentage of scientists who may not believe in God may be more than the average community of people so to some extent science may bias their perceptions because of the way today science is presented is presented largely materialistically but still ultimately they are all souls and even scientists can become devotees of Krishna if they are presented Krishna consciousness properly so then they can become devotees so now from the second perspective I said is that we have some scientists who are not really into science because of their atheism or enviousness of God they are just there as a career we could well classify them as also Bali Sheshu, as innocent if they become actively involved in propagating atheism then they can be called as Indushetsu otherwise they are also innocent certainly they may be very learned and they may have some respect in society because of which you may not feel that they are actually Bali Sheshu they are like childish or innocent but from the spiritual perspective they are just as uninformed as everyone else and from that perspective they could well be called as Bali Sheshu now another perspective of looking at people is through three modes now among the three modes intellectuals generally have at least some characteristics of the mode of goodness very few intellectuals will have a lifestyle entirely in the mode of goodness in Kali Yuga because passion is quite prevalent and ignorance is also there so even the best of scientists may have unregulated sexual habits they may be drinking and they may have things like that we see that sort of unregulated sexuality even scientists write from Einstein to Stephen Hawking so certainly we cannot say that they are entirely in goodness but to a large extent especially those who are seriously seeking God not necessarily God but seeking science as a vocation for truth they are surely having some traits in goodness and relatively speaking among the three modes goodness, passion and ignorance goodness can be more conducive for the practice of spirituality because one has an intellectual nature by which one can understand deeper philosophical truths if one opens one’s mind and because one is not so grossly engaged in passion so in passionate activities or in ignorant activities, tamasic activities therefore one’s lifestyle may be more conducive for the practice of devotional service of course as I said scientists today are materialistic like the rest of the people so they also are likely to be quite in the mode of passion but at least to some extent the vocation of their study the area that they have chosen to do it involves some level of goodness because in general goodness involves dealing with ideas and concepts so because goodness is more receptive to some extent for the practice of spirituality if a person is open minded so in that sense scientists deserve more attention and respect also respect in the sense that they are intellectuals and if they if they understand Krishna consciousness then they can use their intellectual ability in Krishna’s service and of course because they are intellectuals they may have many more questions and doubts and they may be more sceptical than everyone else in the average class of people and that is understood and therefore it is required that they be given special attention and time and in general one of the anarthas of the mode of goodness is attachment to one’s opinions attachment to gross sense gratification is characteristic of the mode of passion but goodness is characterized by attachment to one’s opinions that’s why scientists may come up with their own theories and they may try to strongly aggressively propagate their theories and by that they may they may in one sense if their theories are are anti-devotional they may be propagating atheism so for such people to change may require more effort from our side so in the Vedic tradition normally the preaching the written preaching was done for the general people and the books were written for the intellectuals because intellectuals are unlikely to be convinced just by hearing one talk or a few talks they want to see written material and study it, scrutinize it, think about it and only then become convinced so Srila Prabhupada spent a lot of time writing books and Srila Prabhupada told Swaroop Damodar Maharaj that Swaroop Damodar Maharaj who was himself a scientist that when he is dealing with scientists he should be very polite and respectful to them should behave with them like a gentleman so now is that just a farce that we think that they are demons but we behave with them like gentlemen no, it depends on how we see if we see people as demoniac then there is very little chance for us to actually help them to become devotees just like if you are going for distribution at that time if we think everybody who is over here is a all these people, everybody who is not a devotee is a demon then we think all these people are demoniac then how can we actually distribute books to them we have to see them not as demons but we have to see them as souls who may be overcome by materialistic and even demoniac misconceptions right now but if we want to actually give Krishna’s mercy to them then we have to see them as souls who need Krishna as much as all of us do and only then we can reach out with Krishna’s mercy to them so now there are some situations where if by certain people’s actions and words our faith is being threatened if they are explicitly acting in anti-devotional ways then it is important for us to understand okay this person is under demoniac influence to call them demons would be a little too harsh and it also ignores the fact that ultimately they are souls and they are also as souls devotees of Krishna we could say that they are under demoniac influence and not only are they under demoniac influence if they are threatening our devotion then we can say they are also radiating demoniac influence so then we need to keep a far distance from them so on the other hand we also need to see that if we want to reach out with Krishna consciousness then we have to see that they are souls who need Krishna as much as everyone else does so I’ll conclude with one last example the scriptures for example sometimes in order to avoid or prevent sexual immorality and fall down may refer to the opposite sex it can be females for males and males for females in very negative terms sometimes it may consider to be like it may say that women are like snakes or for women it may be said that men are like hunters and they are like the deer there are examples like that in the 4th canto in the 11th canto and other places so now these within the context where the attraction to the opposite sex can become a threat to a person’s devotion to that extent these sort of perceptions are valuable but at the same time if in a normal functional way in a cultured society you treat women as Matajis and men as Prabhus so that is how we function in a normal society and we may use these terms explicitly for other devotees but actually this is how we should try to see everyone and so the normal functioning way by dealing with scientists is if by their ideas our devotion is being threatened then we can consider that they are under demoniac influence and are radiating demoniac influence so we have to avoid them but if we are trying to share Krishna Consciousness with them and we are trying to share Krishna Consciousness even with those who are under scientific influence which is most of society today then we have to see the people to whom we are reaching out not as demons or envious people but as innocent people and only by this vision can we have the proper attitude by which we can reach out to people and purify them and elevate them just like when we go for fundraising for building a temple for Krishna the Bhagavatam may say that materialistic people are dogs, hogs, camels and asses so when we go to a person for raising funds will we say, oh, you are a dog, hog, camel and I forgot your ass also no, we would never say such a thing and it is not that we will not say such a thing we will not also feel such a thing we will see that, ok, this person is a soul and here he has the opportunity to serve Krishna let me engage in Krishna’s service according to the best abilities that I have so same way, there may be certain perceptions certain statements in scriptures and they are true and they are valid when we understand them with the perspective in which they are spoken and for the purpose that they are spoken apart from that, to extrapolate them would be counterproductive for our capacity to, at one level, attract scientifically minded people to Krishna’s lotus feet and also to be seen as intelligent people in society if we just go around calling scientists by names then we will be seen as fanatical, irrational unscientific people and that is certainly not the perception of Krishna Consciousness that we want to give to the world because Krishna Consciousness is certainly not anti-scientific, irrational, fanatical so we should not conceive or communicate things in a way that misrepresents Krishna Consciousness